Benefits of an Ext Box ?
 

On a 25 Outlaw with a 496 ho with X drive what would be the benifit of adding an extension box if any? Or just adding a shortie? Thank you.

I have only seen one 25 OL with an extension box. It was built because Baja had a box left over and decided to put it on a single. It went to Alton Blakley in Kentucky and a buddy down here on Lake Norman bought it.

I rode in it and drove it.

It was actually slower than a 25 without the box. They tried every prop under the sun. The boat was bought at a discount because of the box and reduced speed.

My opinion was that is sucked. Too much leverage and the bow was very lose. I thought it was especially squirelly over other wakes.

Save your $$$$$$

I cannot help you on the shortie but if I had to bet you would not be able to get on plan with one.

I've learned a valuable lesson about Baja. It takes HORSEPOWER for added speed. Everything else is snake oil.

Just my opinion.

Good luck

I was running with a 25OL last summer with a Stellings box stock drive 496HO he was next to me in 2-3' running 70mph on GPS I was IMPRESSED!!!! I recommend a extension box on the 25OL after seeing how it handled. It's all in the setup..

I also know of a 99 25OL with a -2 Imco Shorty on it running 81mph with 700hp and he's putting a Imco Neutral extension box on it this winter.

Start by measuring your x-dimension and prop shaft height. Jeff

+ 1

With a box, the propshaft height has to go up.

Where it is now will tell a lot in which combination
will work best.

There are 2 guys over at our favorite place:rolleyes:
( TBM) that have 25 O/L's with an extension box,
they go by Wild card and Violator.

Wild card runs a 3" IMCO box and Violator runs
a Stellings box

Both of those guys seem happy with their results.

I've seen Steve's ( violator) boat run, and it runs
well.

You'll probably want to check with those guys
to find out where their propshaft height ended
up at.

If you don't have external steering, you'll
have to add that too.

I think my question would be, do they run well enough to justify the cost & labor on a 25 Outlaw?

Violator is the one that was running with me in 2-3' slop on Lake St.Clair last summer at 70mph...The boat runs a solid 70 on GPS and handles VERY well..It is again though in the setup. I believe his propshaft height is 4.75" He's spent ALOT of time perfecting it. Wildcard is the same way tried many things he's running well into the 80's with his although his power is a Merc 600sci. The 99 25OL I spoke of is at 5" now with a -2 Shorty on it and is adding a neutral box this fall.

Oh, I don't know.....I just love to spend other
peoples money......that's why I'm considering
running for congress:D

The word "justify" usually isn't found in the boating
vocabulary.

But seriously, we ran with Steve's boat last year
at the Hawkeye poker run.

He kept up with my loaner boat ( 33 O/L w/HO's )
and Thunderflash ( 40 O/L w 575's)

He's got that boat dialed in, and with stock power.

It seems to run like a boat that has blue power in
it, but, with better handling.

And, the way I look at it, we're kind of stuck with these
boats right now, and since we're stuck with them,
you might as well make them so you enjoy them.

I gotta say that the only way an extension box works on a Baja is to raise the x dimension. There are 3 ways to do that. Listed in my preference.
1) +3" Imco box
2) Stellings box with -2" shorty.
3) Neutral Imco box with a -2" shorty lower or -3" drive package.
I would suspect the 25 that Doc drove had a stock length lower with a deep x dimension. That combination would indeed make the boat slow & enable it to carry the nose to excess.
Setup is the key. You need to know where you are at on the x dimension 1st.

All the singles that Baja Marine put together were "too low" on the "x". That includes both the 25 OL, and the last 26 OL that was at the 2007 Dealer Meeting. It had no speed advantage, and the handling was poor. Lesson learned.

XT

I never understood why that was done. When a model is designed, what makes the determination as to where the x is placed?
After a plug is made, does the plug get tested before it is a mold?

No, our plugs were a solid block of foam that was cut on a 5-axis router at Sea Ray, and send to Bucyrus for us to put the finish on it, to the create the hull mold. Most smaller companies do a plywood plug, over cross sections by hand in comparison.

Testing was done on the first "prototype" boat that was produced, and we started by cutting a real high "x" and installing outdrives that had spacers installed. We usually decided on the best height after much testing, and handling won many times over any small speed gain. The 23, 26, 30, & 35 prototypes all ran good right out of the box without any real modifications.

XT

Thanks JT, I was giving it all she had she didn't have anymore. I think I have reached my limit with my stock power. The only way I am going to keep up with twins is more power!

Just buy a boat with Twins. :lolhit:

Will

I could see you in a 33OL with boxes...

Here is a video of Steve boat running. He is the second boat to go by.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4I9aNm9uSY

I picked up 4 or 5 mph 83.2gps with my 2'' shortie better handling flew flat across swells, also THE GUY FROM GERMANY who had the 25ol 525 put a 3 raised box on his boat he hit 81gps, then last year put a merc 600 plus a 2'' shiortie ended up lowering it 1'' and the last I talked to him he was at 87 or 88 and climbing. with the shortie you need a 4 blade or 5. I always use my k planes when I come up on plane anyway less stress on the all the boat parts. hope that helps.

Are you saying you gained 4 to 5 mph with just adding a 2" shortie? If so which one did you use? Thanks.

If you look at his speed he put in bigger power first.

I could too.....I know where one is......but, he would
have to re-do that fancy picture on the back window
of his truck though;)

This is the one I had in mind for him...

http://bajaboatsforsale.com/premiumc...ieds00536.html

That one doesn't have boxes though.

I'd take 30k less than that for mine and pay for
having the back window of the truck re-did:D

There's always this one

http://www.boattrader.com/listing/19...utlaw-95022486

That boat and my old 29 use to do battle every weekend
about 10 years ago:drink:

Last time I saw it, it wasn't running quite as strong though,
a friend with a 33 O/L and HO's was keeping up with it.

Nice setup..Just needs newer boat...I'm thinking the boss won't let him go backwards that far.

Since we're talking "backwards", how about a 98'
36 O/L w/procharged 502's and boxes......all that for
under $ 40k !

36OL is a heavy boat..As Dock has found it takes ALOT of HP to get it into the 90's..I still think the 33 is the best boat Baja built.

Agreed:drink:

I thing the 25 OL is!!:drink::drink:

I have a post in the Dive section. "What is your drive height?". Check it out and post the info about your boat.

Irish...Any room in that pole barn of your this year to get the motor out and ext box on mine?

I think that first boat looks good too.:drink:

Is it teal?

One of the colors is teal......pink and purple too

SST graphics

Keep in mind that when considering a -3" IMCO extension box, that requires the motor to be raised 3" also.

If you truly need a full 3", then consider a neutral IMCO box, a 3" IMCO shortie and an IMCO upper (required when using a 3" IMCO shortie because of the cav plate). Look at the upside, you end up NOT re-rigging your motor mounts and have a much better upper drive section. It's only money.:eek:

yes I gained a total of 8mph with a carb change to. but the imco is a faster lower the merc has a longer skeg which has slown boats down.

nope same motor 509 picked up between 13 to 20 hp thats it with the custom carb but it ran better on top, so we figured 4 to 5 on shortie and 3 to 4 on carb change which might be high. this was multi runs over a few weeks. other power was 330 to 390,585,595,637,647, aprox 670ish in the end, but will get a few adjustments to get it over 700hp intake cam carb change, ne motor 572 blower but might be going in a saber 28 or sutphen 30. this spring.

I think the 24ol if they built it my way like mine has been coming along:evilb:

I am going to add the Stellings Box and 2" shorty on the off season. I would love to pick up 4-5 MPH with the mods but am not so certain it will happen. I hope at the very least to go taller in prop size to net a few MPH but again, not to certain it will happen. All this is on a stock 496 HO that can do 63 MPH GPS all day with either a 24P Bravo 1 and a 23P M+.

your net gain with a standard box is 1'' you can go up one but the stellings is a lot harder on the drive than the imco, cause of splind shaft with coupler on the imco like the merc set up and the stellings with ujoints solid bolt on . no coupler for the shock of the prop loading and unloading. your best bet is 2'' shortie and do motor up grades like headers stainless marine gen 3, 4 1/2'' OD will last longer than cmi etops and give you a lil gain in power. other wise get the 3'' imco box have your motor set and do the headers and you will not have to change your exhaust holes:eek: with new exhaust headers or SM you tell them you holes are custom once the motor is lined up they send a template for you to line up. poof all set no recutting anything now you have a 3 '' raised drive 12'' set back like the 25 with 525hp that did 81gps when stock 25s were at 74 to 75 and you will need a labbed 26:evilb: and breaking 70 to 72 63 is a lil slow for a ho motor there more like 66 to 67 from what I HAVE SEEN HEARD HERE. keep us posted but don't buy the stellings it more money and hard on the drive. art later

for the guys that have stock exhaust and want more speed a set of headers or stainless marine and the 3'' box is the way to go, just do the box 1st and have the exhaust co send a template for you to get your angles so theres no transom holes to change:rolleyes:, and theres a lot more in the bajas. I have seen room to go up the few inches on the front of the motor and then you can play more with a shortie if you want but after our friend over sea's posted a 3'' box with a 1'' shortie total of 4'' shorter was perfect for his 25ol with the merc 600 last I heard he was running 87 88 not done yet. but with the 3 inch raised box he got 81 mph from 74 to 76 with a 28 b1 prop once he put the 600 merc in he put a raised shortie 2'' imco on then lowered a1'' to be at 4'' total:coolcowboy: at 87 plus

If you use the Everett Performance shaft it is great. It is a slide on shaft. You dont have to change your yoke. You can keep your coupler and wont have to remove the bellhousing. It is $550 new and supposedly works better than the IMCO set up - Randy at Stellings told me that.

You will not have to reprogram the ECU either...

I have a great line on a Stellings neutral box and IMCO steering that I am going forward with. Just have to find the 2" shorty to complete the project. I do want to add the new CMI e-tops but it may not be this off season.