A few questions about 38 Flat Decks
 

Hi everyone,

My dad and I are thinking about buying a 38 flat deck as a nice winter project, but I have a few questions that I hope you can help with. This forum has been a great resource over the last few months, as I've tried to read every thread I can find that has info about flat decks. My dad and I are typical back yard mechanics with a decent amount of experience with performance boats, but we've never touched a Cigarette before. My questions are...

1. How good/bad is the hull construction of the 1980's flat decks? I've heard that they are strong and heavy, but are there any typical weak spots to look for, or can anyone point me to a web site or link that explains the hull construction? For example, was there a lot of wood/core used or are they mostly fiberglass?

2. Did Cigarette ever make a top gun flat deck? I thought the top gun was different than the flat deck, but this classified link looks like a flat deck but it's labeled as an 86 TG..
http://www.offshoreonly.com/classifi...o44742-en.html

3. I would like to find a flat deck that has the optional #3's, but am I wasting my time looking for one? I've read that people have less problems with the #3's compared to Bravo or TRS drives, but are the standard #3's (not 3A's) really any better?

thanks for your help!

Dan

One more question about the hull construction to help put things in perspective for me... are the 1980's flat decks, or top guns, built with the same or similar strength as the 41 Apaches? Or are they considerably different? thanks,

Dan

i just bought a 38 flatdeck also , from what i found out a " top gun " did not start till 87 .
i can tell you they are heavy , heavy if you did not catch the first one . takes alot of power to go
above 70 mph . mine has the TRS drives that i have been told that they will hold up to about 700 hp
if you dont abuse them .

Thx for the input Kenny. how do you like yours? I don't mind a heavy boat since I would really prefer a good ride in the rough rather than the best top speed.

I would have to think the 38 flat deck is built very similar to the mistress, if thats the case go for it, either way I say go for it they are gonna ber built stronger then most other boats of that period...

Takes lots of power to hit 70 in one, I run 63 with my mistress with approx 480hp at best...
trs 700 hp in a old Cig... nah... I would start to worry around 550-600 hp unless your real good on the throttles..I personally think TRS is underrated but thats still about where I would be cautious..3's are harder to find and a lot more to fix, but last way better...

To me though, I love the flat deck of the mistress and 38 flat deck Cigs.. classic look
good luck with whatever one you get, great boats all around

Yes, go for it, but check for moisture and rot. If you can find a #III boat, you are way ahead of the game, because more than likely you can just have them inspected/freshened and get good life out of them. You can also easily upgrade to IIIA's, IV or V's without doing anything. RPMRam on here is supplying new gearsets for IIIa and V's, which should extend the useful life of these drives.

Like FullForce says, these boats are power hogs. Bravos will not live on them unless they are aftermarket, and then still maybe not.

If you pick up a TRS boat, you could look at the Konrad conversion, or if you are going to keep it around 500-550 hp, just run them till they let go, then convert.

thanks for all of the input guys! I will keep an eye out for a #3 boat. Also, I am definitely not opposed to a 35 Mistress. I love the lines of the 35 and the 38 flat decks. They are a classic, timeless look that reminds me of offshore racing from the early 90's. Did any Mistress's come with #3's? I saw one for sale that was totally restored with lab finished #3's but I wasn't sure if the drives were stock... tcelano, that's a really good point about being able to upgrade the drives if the boat is already set up for #3's. thanks again for the input... Please let me know if you guys have any links or resources that you have found helpful for flat decks.

I forgot to ask in my last post, how difficult is it to work on the motors in these older boats? Is it impossible to get to the spark plugs etc? I had a hell of a time servicing my old boat. Having the motors stuffed in there together isn't a deal killer for me since I am pretty set on an old Cig, but I just want to know what I'm getting myself into

#III's was an option. Others may have been redone. For instance I have a 1979 hull, and the IIISSM was not introduced until '82. So, either it was originally rigged with III clubfoots, or TRS's then converted at some point.

As far as engine access, it's a side-by-side. With transmissions, at least you can get around the back. Mine is set up with a race hatch, and I cut the existing deck way back around the engines, which significantly improves things. As it is now in mine, it's tolerable.

My engine compartment is huge since someone redid it....either way....cig has lots of room in front of engines that most boats dont......!! I wluldnt rule out a mistress....and don said it was the best boat he designed

lots of room.... 1st pic speed master top gun. 2nd pic trs top gun. 3rd pic bravo top gun

Good pics for comparison. Bravo probably least fun. due to restricted access behind.

If you get a mistress with stock hatches, you'll find there is not a lot of extra height to play with. My boat's transom had never been drilled for exhaust, as they'd used an over-transom setup. I went and drilled the transom. The exhaust risers poke well above where the flush hatch would be. I'm on drivelines, and I mounted the engines almost 1" lower than the drive inputs. My offshore mounts practically scrape the stringer. I did extensive measuring and templating, and found that my setup would shoehorn into only one possible position with less than 1/4" to play with. Thankfully, I hit it on the first try.

If anyone has pics of a stock mistress setup, I'd like to see how they make everything fit.

Here's what it looked like putting the first one in, before I cut away the old deck more.

This is mine, someone cut the old hatches and such out and added one huge one, it is SOOO easy to work on, for me to not get mad wrenchin is amazing...lol

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e4...-38-23_615.jpg

85 38 Flat Deck

Looks like yours has a whole coaming. Nice setup.

My hatch actually closes onto the old deck surface, and has a rubber bulb seal it sits on. I installed some guide pins that it engages onto. Once down, the actuator holds it tight.

believe it or not the bravo is really easy to work on. only 2 bolts in the back. i pulled 525's in a 42 tiger w/ bravo's and that was a little tighter for some reason. trs and speedy stuff is super easy if you dont have big blowers. those get in the way a little bit.

couple more

Love that 38!!!

Thanks for all of the pictures and info! this is really helpful. It looks like room around the motors won't be as bad as I was expecting... and damn, you guys have some really nice rides!

those arent mine lol. i just work on them

Just curious, were do you plan on boating...?

Most of my boating time is spent around Sea Isle City NJ. I grew up boating on the Chesapeake since my dad had a few high performance boats over the years, but now I have a 23' Wellcraft center console docked in NJ. The center console is a great little Jersey boat for fishing. I've had it in 4-6's plenty of times offshore, and the hull rides beautifully (and surprisingly it tops out at almost 50 mph). The biggest problem is that the hull isn't long enough to bridge the gaps in between waves depending on the conditions, and also I am just not into fishing anymore. The reason that I started thinking about an old Cig is because my dad recently mentioned that he's itching for a fast boat again and I don't really want to keep the center console. So our idea was to buy an older Cig together and fix it up.

Your not going to go wrong with older cig in my opinion.....look great and built to handle whatever is thrown at it

here is a picture of my boat at Townsends Inlet from earlier this summer...

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m...78884722_n.jpg

It's no Cig but it gets me around haha

Is that the Wellcraft that has the cushion in front, and the front of the console with the seat in it flips up to reveal a toilet?

If so my buddy has a slightly older one (I actually talked him into going and taking a look at it) and I honestly think that is one of the great boats in that size range. Place to layout up front, toilet, lots of walking around space, etc.....

I'd love to have one in addition to my CIG if I had either the money, dockspace, time, resources, etc......

yep, exactly. Mine had a removable toilet so I took it out to have some more space in the console for fishing gear, etc. The boat is a 2008 that was a leftover in 2009, and the dealership was going out of business so I as able to pick it up at a nice discount. I hate to sell it, but it's paid for so I want to roll the sale money into buying a Cig.... If you guys have any pictures of your 38's or Mistress's please feel free to post em! I am not ready to move on a flat deck yet, but I'd love to see everyone else's!

A couple of mine..love the classic lines...

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e4...3-34-51958.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e4...-58-03_684.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e4...g/P7137582.jpg

Were is the last pic at?

Huron lagoons, we went to riverfest this year, good time!!

Nuff Said LOL
This is why you need a wave crusher

Mark:eekdrop:

One of my favorite boat rides ever was in a 38 Flatdeck, in 5-6FT lake michigan seas, doing 65mph or so. 65 may not sound like much, but that day, most couldnt do 45 in that water. Needless to say, I was in the slowest boat of the group that day, but first one to the bar.

Old Cigs rock.....

Mine

Not all Flat decks are slow right Kris??????

[youtube]VkY5bPPFukc&feature=BFa&list=ULdYHY2y66ZQc[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkY5bPPFukc&feature[/youtube]

What boat? LOL. I see a boat girl of the week. Your on the right track. Cig. time with Dad. Can't go wrong. Artie

Hahaha, thx... Great pictures guys! You all have some beautiful boats

That is one Sick Mo FO brutha Now lets see whats hanging off the Azz shot again!