holley 650 adjusts
 

i have a holley dual feed elec choke vacuum sec 650,its was just torn down and cleaned all new gaskets etc, now the motor idles but runs really rough and smell of raw gas ,no leaks screws are 1 and 1/4 turn out back off boat and drive are black, put new fuel in and filter. any suggestions

Yes make sure the baseplate throttle plates are adjusted right they need to be .020 open on the idle slots for the idle circuit to work right if they are more than that it will pull fuel from the main circuit

The first thing you will need to check is the throttle bores while the engine is idling. Look and see if you have nozzle drip. A small drip coming from the venturi boosters. This is usually caused by a high float level or needle and seats not sealing. Otherwise I would suggest replacing the power valve (it may have a ruptured diaphragm). Other problems could be wrong metering block gaskets or a warped metering block (or leaking metering block gaskets).

The biggest problems with Holley carbs is the needle and seats in the float bowls will leak even when brand new!
Sometimes the carb kit will sit on the parts shelf too long and the needle and seats will dry out. If you are lucky they will start working/become pliable after they are soaked in the gasoline for a while, other times they will never soften up enough to seal. You should always have a spare set in your boat tool box.

Make sure that the idle air bleeds are not dirty, if they are dirty the idle mixture will be rich (by design, air is introduced into the idle wells to lean out the A/F mixture).
The idle air bleeds are next to the venturis (barrels).

The most common problem when rebuilding a Holley carb is getting the old gasket material off of a never rebuilt carb. The gaskets used by Holley on new carbs are different than in the rebuild kits and they are practically glued into place. Gasket remover and a brass wire brush for about a 1/2 an hour will get them off (hard on a mechanics flat rate!). Make sure you got it all off before you reassembled the carb.

The accelerator pump diaphragm/gasket will leak on about 50% of them when they are replaced. Sometimes the surfaces will need to be flattened.

The metering block idle fuel wells and main metering wells have small fuel/air bleeds inside the metering block that will clog and are almost impossible to clean out by soaking in carb cleaner. It may require a new metering block.

Sorry, just some of the joys of owning a Holley carb!
Dennis Moore

If it was just rebuilt, your float levels could just be slightly high. Check to see if the boosters drip while the engine is idling with the boat in the water. Often the carburetor will not sit level due to the attitude of the boat while sitting in the water, the float levels may need to be lowered slightly. Set the floats with the sight plugs out of the sides of the bowls and the engine idling with boat sitting in calm water... Simple

Don't fear a Holley carb. Some guys aren't that good at what they do, so simple issues overwhelm them and they tend to over-sensationalize about minor issues... Then their business becomes slow and they spend alot of time rambling on and on about nonsense.

thank you, carb was torn down and soaked and cleaned ,i think its floats and mixtures screws need to adjust thank you,let everone one no tomorrow what happens

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Cubic Inches, Not tough on your flat rate either I'm guessing ? LOL.:D

Funny how some guys will not drive an American car or truck because they think they are junk. But those same guys are so offended when a person suggests that an American carb, designed 60 years ago, might not be very good!

Some of you guys really have an emotional attachment to Holley Carbs (you would think I was insulting your mother!).

Pull yourselves together will ya?

It has less to do with Holley carb's and more to do with the fact that you're flooding this board with old, out-dated, and more often then not incorrect info. A lot has changed over the years and you obviously have not. Take a good look in the mirror and ask yourself if your business is suffering because of the economy, or because you're a tired old blowhard. You whine about the economy and then talk about how great Chinese manufacturing is. You want to make a living building marine performance engines and write articles about the dangers of Global warming. You are a walking contradiction. Do a little more research before you post, or possibly add the caveat "in my experience/opinion".

These are my observations and opinion and I'm not trying to speak for everyone, just myself..

ps. If you would like an education on modern cylinder heads and why someone would be so foolish as to use a single plane intake with a small runner head then start a thread about it and you might learn something new..

I'm not offended by anything you've stated in any of your posts, and I'm unclear as to the basis for your statement regarding what vehicle a person drives. I actually drive a $55k 2011 American truck, and I'd be the first one to tell you that it has issues. You see, that's being objective. All things mechanical, at some point, will have issues.

No love affair here with Holley carburetors, other than they perform excellent, and are most definitely the logical choice on most engine platforms which I regularly build. I'm actaully a huge proponent of Quadrajet carburetors... They are an excellent carburetor, and perform well in the proper application. They do, however, have their own set of inherent issues... No different than a Holley. Notice that I'm not on here denouncing either... No love affair with either. They both have issues from time time to time, and I repair them... Like anything else that fails. That's what I do... doing enough of it keeps me from having to grovel on the internet for business.

As long as we're on the subject, I find it funny that a person states on another thread that he's on here to promote his business and that it's ultimately important that his potential cutomer base here realize that he's honest to the core, and doesn't like to mislead people into believing that they need fancy aftermarket components to have their engine perform correctly. Yet the same person turns around and makes a lengthy, unfounded, and somewhat misleading, post which would horrify most everyday Holley owners... on a thread in which the original poster probably needs nothing more than a simple float adjustment. A bit ridiculous, even though I think we all realize that the post was probably just meant to be infammatory to the crowd here that's got this person's number... But, whatever...:rolleyes:

Oh, and supposing a Holley carburetor was designed 60 years ago... Would that alone make it bad? And, if so, would it still be prudent to recommend that someone use an iron dual plane manifold from a '60's Chevelle?

Was my 2004 Silverado made by Honda or Nissan ? :angry-smiley-038: Boat made in US. Engine by Detroit...maybe made in Mexico. Sleds/engines from Wisconsin.

All parts I have designed are made here in the US.

So don't start !

I design and sell niche performance parts.

I also repair cars/trucks to pass Federal emmissions. 99.9% are fuel injected.

Since I live performance I burn a ton of fuel. I'm good at that. :eek:

I don't give Global Warming lectures. Thanks for all the snow though !

A few examples of the carbs I've rebuilt this year: pair of Strombergs, large and small Rochester 2bbl, quadrajet (imagine that), Weber 2bbl, a Holley, few Demons, etc,etc. And I'm not a carb rebuild shop. They where all built for their application and run well for those.

Maybe they come to me because I don't fear them. Some came into my shop, a few where left off at the house. I even received one in the front of my sled trailer. LOL.

Speaking of Mother's - my Mom (72) feared computers and because of such they disgruntled her. Almosty disgusted. Well, I sent her to a class, she learned the basics, now understands them enough to smile when the subject comes up. Guess what, she now likes them. After all this time.

Maybe it's time to get over your fear of Holley carbs.

Your never too old to learn something new. My mom did it, you can too.

If you have trouble tomorrow, feel free to PM me for phone #. I'm better talking vs typing when walking someone thru something. Sometimes I suk at both. LOL.

Don't argue with Dennis , you are forgetting HE WROTE A BOOK once!!!!:evilb:. We are evil doer's with our global warming suicide machines with these DAMN holley carbs!!! Maybe if your nice to Dennis he will tell you about some out of the catalog RV cam's from Comp that he can spec for you so you can quit wasting your money on those fancy pants, custom grind, SNAKE OIL cams!! Oh, and another thing, don't put headers on a EFI motor because the injectors won't know it has headers and it will make zero difference, I read this recently, maybe someone can design a computer program to tell those injectors about the headers, Hmmm!!!

All I have to say is there are a hell of a lot of holley's running around just fine and some making unreal H/P !!! like anything else there are certain things that work in certain area's...

I think DM is related to the "Chilton" family? :lolhit:

Damn Dennis, you finally tell the truth!!

Girls, girls, girls, hair pulling, eyegouging, scratching and throwing hissy fits is not acting like a lady is it?

Just because you have PMS doesn't mean you can take out your emotional frustrations on men!

Please try and act like real ladies ok?

Count to ten before venting your emotional tirades. It works for my girlfriend!

Good comeback...

Thanks,
Unfortunately I have had to deal with more than a few women who are emotionally out-of-control.

Is this a technical forum? I forget.
Dennis

:popcorn:

I knew I liked you Smitty. LMAO.

whew! guess I'm really in truoble as I have been using Demon carbs for a few years on my boat and drag cars. with good success:popcorn:

I keep re-reading your post and I wonder what rock you crawled out from under. You definately love your Quadrajets, but wait, common quadrajet problems that I seem to see on everyone that I come acrossed these days now that most of them are getting to be 30 to 40 years old-
Warped base plates/main bodies from repeated over tightening
well plugs that perpetually leak
wore out throttle bores from plates hitting
wore out throttle shaft bores
very little tunability on primary metering rods, especially with engines that use high duration cams with low idle strength
generally butchered up over time without a readily available supply of replacement parts
I save them for parts and once in a while I have enough pieces to put one back together and have everything right, Gm hasn't used them on oems since the early 80's but you obviously know this, Holleys have put them in a GRAVE. I looked at your website, other than selling cheap, casted, imported low performance manifolds, do you actually have ANYTHING to do with high performance marine engines or are you hoping/waiting near the phone for a 1988 liberator owner to call you up to have his quadrajet carb rebuilt???:evilb:

I am a BIG fan of Holley Carburetors...especially the Double Pumper Mechanical Secondary versions. I have had very good results with them on boats and in my opinion offer the best available throttle response you can get...short of Multi Port FI...which is the best fuel delivery system we have developed so far.

I however am currently running Quadra Jet Marine Carbs on my near stock Small Block Chevy s with great success. Now don't laugh...but the damn things work for me!!!

I found a great source for Marine Carburetors that I want to share.

http://www.nationalcarburetors.com/

These guys sell just about anything you want to buy and they are in Jacksonville, Fl...employing Americans...rebuilding carburetors...Automotive and Marine...of all makes...including Rochester and Holley!!!:evilb:

I bought my Q-Jet Marine Carbs ...rebuilt, for $199.99 ea plus freight!!! I took them out of the box...bolted them on...connected the fuel lines and linkage. I spun the engines a few times to fill the bowls and they started right up. I had to set the idle speed but the mixture was spot on. These carbs looked as good as new and came with a spec sheet showing the air flow results, A/F ratio achieved and what engine they were tuned on!!

Check them out. I wanted to share this because they are a group of Americans building parts in America for American products...and I think that's a good thing.:evilb:

arcticfriends -

Let me guess, Quadrajets/Webers work good for you with factory dual plane intake manifolds, oe heads, and idle to 4800rpm cams ?

They work good for us in those applications too !

Maybe I'm onto something here...... :bong:

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Dennis -

BTW: I've never used wire brushes and gasket remover to remove the old OE Holley gaskets. Maybe that's causing a problem for you ?

Carb cleaner, a long fingernail (thumb preferred) and a new razor go a long way. Quick too ! Be amazed how good the carb clean loosens things.

Tilting surface being 'scraped' down is also beneficial. Gravity lets the material drop towards bench, not into the holes. Also, blowing air from opposing holes makes any material on/over the holes blow out. If you blow into the hole material is in/on, you'll just jam it up.

A rubber tipped blow gun is a great tool to have.

They do make a book for all of this.

[QUOTE=SB;3494169]arcticfriends -

Let me guess, Quadrajets/Webers work good for you with factory dual plane intake manifolds, oe heads, and idle to 4800rpm cams ?

They work good for us in those applications too !

Maybe I'm onto something here...... :bong:

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Scott, I have built quite a few quadrajets for medium and low performance applications, was 25 years ago though that I actually had one on something that ran 13's , when I wanted more adjustability and moved into the high 12's then 11's (with a much bigger cam, heads, intake etc) I went to a annular discharge holly carb (my personal favorite aside from fuel injection). I still build one once in a while for a old muscle car but my latest project-1974 T/A is getting a mefi fuel injection, Smitty

Had a few Quad's on non-race cars with small blocks (one a 403 Olds)down low 12's. Was also a small part of a few Superstock cars and few Stock Eliminators with Quadrajet's and Webers. Ran amazingly well, but way benefited from 'magic potion carburetor tuners.' Big moolah too.

Those guys craved Holley's but rules forced the others.

The upper classes of course, most pick cars that came OE with Holley's so they could run those. How about AMX's that came OE with two Holley's. Yeh baby.

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Back to boats, be it Quads/Webers/Holley's etc with Vacuum secondaries (Quads/Weber's only come that way) they can be a real pain in the azz with a strong motor and lighter boat. Believe me, I've been in a bunch.

You set up vac secondary for best acceleration and top end, prob is when trying to cruise near sec throttle opening. Slight touch of throttle and secondaries and vroom. Too much, Slight pull back, and not enough.

CAn play around with it somewhat to make that area a little better but you end up taking a little from either acceleration and or top end.

Enter mechanical secondaries. You control the secondaries. You control the exact speed of the boat. No mechanism working on it's own...thru airflow, weights, nor etc. You are in total control with mech secondaries.

Good description of vacuum vs mechanical secondaries. Learned something from this.

Enter mechanical secondaries. You control the secondaries. You control the exact speed of the boat. No mechanism working on it's own...thru airflow, weights, nor etc. You are in total control with mech secondaries.

This is a fact...and why I prefer the system. The ability to control acceleration accurately becomes critical in rough seas...especially following seas that you must regulate forward speed precisely. I have been in situations...especially running in and out of our East Coast inlets here in South Florida in marginal weather...that depend on this ability. Being able to speed up and slow down quickly can make the difference weather or not you breach or pitch pole a boat.:eek:

It's much easier to do this with a properly sized mechanical secondary carb than one with vacuum secondaries. I had this explained to me also by some "old school" offshore racing team throttle men.

In my current situation, with near stock engine set ups, with a decent power to weight ratio (right at 10lbs for each horsepower in the water) it's not as critical so I do well with the Q-Jets. If I start running something like a pair of 383 strokers then I will be running Double Pumper Holley's for sure.

sb and everone thank you for your help, i will adjust it this week, got stuck in new york working hazmat with all the flooding