Self tune mefi burn, am I crazy?
03-22-2013, 09:42 AM
#61
Gold Member
Gold Member
Thanks.
I've chilled out a little since then, I read and responded at 12am EST. I'm still going for it, my curiosity must be cured.
The locals are even more skeptical, a few so called "experts" have attempted tunes and failed. One guy convinced a friend to convert his 555cu ci 500EFIs to carb!
I do want my boat to run, but I also want to know what the big deal is? Maybe I can help others in the future.
I've chilled out a little since then, I read and responded at 12am EST. I'm still going for it, my curiosity must be cured.
The locals are even more skeptical, a few so called "experts" have attempted tunes and failed. One guy convinced a friend to convert his 555cu ci 500EFIs to carb!
I do want my boat to run, but I also want to know what the big deal is? Maybe I can help others in the future.
Go out and get an A/F program, get bungs welded in (pain in the a$$) and get yourself the data. Its nice to be able to see where your A/F data is all thru the RPM range. Then, after a dozen WOT runs make the call if its worth buying the programming software. The whole software kit thru Innovate is $299 http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/kits.php
All you do after you get the data is convert the graph to CSV in Excel and you have A/F data by the second at every RPM range.
...maybe you dont need changes.
03-22-2013, 09:54 AM
#62
Go out and get an A/F program, get bungs welded in (pain in the a$$) and get yourself the data. Its nice to be able to see where your A/F data is all thru the RPM range. Then, after a dozen WOT runs make the call if its worth buying the programming software. The whole software kit thru Innovate is $299 http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/kits.php
All you do after you get the data is convert the graph to CSV in Excel and you have A/F data by the second at every RPM range.
...maybe you dont need changes.
All you do after you get the data is convert the graph to CSV in Excel and you have A/F data by the second at every RPM range.
...maybe you dont need changes.
My stock tune is safe, however it is prob the worst tune that merc has ever put out.....correct that, it is. The cold start tune is so rich it instantly blackens anything around it. Many know the 575 came way off from stock. And I do need the burn software to at the very least change the rev limit to 6k
My plan from the start is to change the cold start on the hose, raise the rev to 6k then start datalogging. Very good chance it will still be a little rich with the stock tune across the rest of the range, which I am ok with. It was safe stock, but not so rich that I was getting wash or deposits.
I will share my data collection with screen prints on here and with Bob from mefi burn, and take all your advice.
I am not trying to squeeze every last pony out if this engine with a tune, I am trying to clean it up and insure it is safe
Last edited by 4bus; 03-22-2013 at 10:13 AM.
03-22-2013, 09:58 AM
#63
-Been following this tread with great interest as I've got a few upgrades in mind also.
FWIW, when my 575SCI's were upgraded a few years back, the mods we did were flat top pistons, minor port, custom ground hyd roller cams very similar to the 525EFI, Whipple intercoolers and smaller pulleys (6.5lbs @ 5600)
The ecu's were sent to AZ Speed & Marine for re-cal and rev limiters bumped to 5600. Fortunately, they nailed it on the first try, the boat runs fantastic, much cleaner than a stock 575SCI, no soot on the transom at all. -In fact, been running the same plugs for 3 seasons...
I've just recently received a new pair of TBS billet blowers and thinking hard of upgrading the outdated throttle bodies to the new FAST four barrel dual 4150 style four barrel TB's. AZ Speed offers a complete kit to convert the old system, retaining the MEFI 3. At what point do you can the antiquated MEFI system and start fresh with an entirely new system??
-Here's a shot of the AZ Speed kit.
FWIW, when my 575SCI's were upgraded a few years back, the mods we did were flat top pistons, minor port, custom ground hyd roller cams very similar to the 525EFI, Whipple intercoolers and smaller pulleys (6.5lbs @ 5600)
The ecu's were sent to AZ Speed & Marine for re-cal and rev limiters bumped to 5600. Fortunately, they nailed it on the first try, the boat runs fantastic, much cleaner than a stock 575SCI, no soot on the transom at all. -In fact, been running the same plugs for 3 seasons...
I've just recently received a new pair of TBS billet blowers and thinking hard of upgrading the outdated throttle bodies to the new FAST four barrel dual 4150 style four barrel TB's. AZ Speed offers a complete kit to convert the old system, retaining the MEFI 3. At what point do you can the antiquated MEFI system and start fresh with an entirely new system??
-Here's a shot of the AZ Speed kit.
Last edited by Biggus; 03-22-2013 at 10:23 AM.
03-22-2013, 03:17 PM
#64
-Been following this tread with great interest as I've got a few upgrades in mind also.
FWIW, when my 575SCI's were upgraded a few years back, the mods we did were flat top pistons, minor port, custom ground hyd roller cams very similar to the 525EFI, Whipple intercoolers and smaller pulleys (6.5lbs @ 5600)
The ecu's were sent to AZ Speed & Marine for re-cal and rev limiters bumped to 5600. Fortunately, they nailed it on the first try, the boat runs fantastic, much cleaner than a stock 575SCI, no soot on the transom at all. -In fact, been running the same plugs for 3 seasons...
I've just recently received a new pair of TBS billet blowers and thinking hard of upgrading the outdated throttle bodies to the new FAST four barrel dual 4150 style four barrel TB's. AZ Speed offers a complete kit to convert the old system, retaining the MEFI 3. At what point do you can the antiquated MEFI system and start fresh with an entirely new system??
-Here's a shot of the AZ Speed kit.
FWIW, when my 575SCI's were upgraded a few years back, the mods we did were flat top pistons, minor port, custom ground hyd roller cams very similar to the 525EFI, Whipple intercoolers and smaller pulleys (6.5lbs @ 5600)
The ecu's were sent to AZ Speed & Marine for re-cal and rev limiters bumped to 5600. Fortunately, they nailed it on the first try, the boat runs fantastic, much cleaner than a stock 575SCI, no soot on the transom at all. -In fact, been running the same plugs for 3 seasons...
I've just recently received a new pair of TBS billet blowers and thinking hard of upgrading the outdated throttle bodies to the new FAST four barrel dual 4150 style four barrel TB's. AZ Speed offers a complete kit to convert the old system, retaining the MEFI 3. At what point do you can the antiquated MEFI system and start fresh with an entirely new system??
-Here's a shot of the AZ Speed kit.
What size TBS? Have you seen the threads with guys converting to 8-71?
Did you find my pulleys yet?
03-23-2013, 02:39 AM
#65
I already did the bungs, and purchased the innovate mtx-l with data logging but haven't played with it yet.
My stock tune is safe, however it is prob the worst tune that merc has ever put out.....correct that, it is. The cold start tune is so rich it instantly blackens anything around it. Many know the 575 came way off from stock. And I do need the burn software to at the very least change the rev limit to 6k
My plan from the start is to change the cold start on the hose, raise the rev to 6k then start datalogging. Very good chance it will still be a little rich with the stock tune across the rest of the range, which I am ok with. It was safe stock, but not so rich that I was getting wash or deposits.
I will share my data collection with screen prints on here and with Bob from mefi burn, and take all your advice.
I am not trying to squeeze every last pony out if this engine with a tune, I am trying to clean it up and insure it is safe
My stock tune is safe, however it is prob the worst tune that merc has ever put out.....correct that, it is. The cold start tune is so rich it instantly blackens anything around it. Many know the 575 came way off from stock. And I do need the burn software to at the very least change the rev limit to 6k
My plan from the start is to change the cold start on the hose, raise the rev to 6k then start datalogging. Very good chance it will still be a little rich with the stock tune across the rest of the range, which I am ok with. It was safe stock, but not so rich that I was getting wash or deposits.
I will share my data collection with screen prints on here and with Bob from mefi burn, and take all your advice.
I am not trying to squeeze every last pony out if this engine with a tune, I am trying to clean it up and insure it is safe
Since you have a tune that works but isn't optimized you are in great shape. Start simple and in the idle range as you stated. Keep the changes small and make them one at a time. In other words don't make a bunch of changes to the timing table, coolant vs bpw and MAP/BPW table all at the same time.
Often times the rpm/MAP points lie in between 2-4 cells on the table. In this case you may need to adjust the 4 cells appropriately to get the desired results.
I've done what you are going to do so feel free to PM me.
Does anybody know why the MEFI 3s and 4's take so long to load? The MEFI 1 takes about 2-3 seconds max.
03-25-2013, 09:44 AM
#66
I still run the same AFR unit as you, the MTX-L. Works great.
Since you have a tune that works but isn't optimized you are in great shape. Start simple and in the idle range as you stated. Keep the changes small and make them one at a time. In other words don't make a bunch of changes to the timing table, coolant vs bpw and MAP/BPW table all at the same time.
Often times the rpm/MAP points lie in between 2-4 cells on the table. In this case you may need to adjust the 4 cells appropriately to get the desired results.
I've done what you are going to do so feel free to PM me.
Does anybody know why the MEFI 3s and 4's take so long to load? The MEFI 1 takes about 2-3 seconds max.
Since you have a tune that works but isn't optimized you are in great shape. Start simple and in the idle range as you stated. Keep the changes small and make them one at a time. In other words don't make a bunch of changes to the timing table, coolant vs bpw and MAP/BPW table all at the same time.
Often times the rpm/MAP points lie in between 2-4 cells on the table. In this case you may need to adjust the 4 cells appropriately to get the desired results.
I've done what you are going to do so feel free to PM me.
Does anybody know why the MEFI 3s and 4's take so long to load? The MEFI 1 takes about 2-3 seconds max.
I have some options for dropping the stock thermo down. It runs at 150 factory, I can get 140, 130 and 120. A few tuners I talked to run the 120 for best charge no chiller. Is this 30 degree drop going to cause a tuning nightmare? Or should I choose a higher temp like 130 or 140?
I here the mefi4b loads fast as well. I am not that concerned with loading time...I have lots of time
03-25-2013, 11:07 AM
#67
Registered
It was mentioned earlier, why not use an automotive ECU that you can buy at any junk yard for $85 and program it with HP Tuners? I already have HP Tuners software for my cars and trucks. The ECUs are more than capable, and dirt cheap. There are several companies that make harnesses for them to fit any application. I was toying with the MEGA Squirt idea, but then I needed the HP Tuner software anyway, so why not use it for the boat also? It doesn't support self tune or live tuning, but the data logging is decent.
03-25-2013, 11:09 PM
#68
Don't let all the opinions get to you. If you're interested in learning how to tune, how to get your boat running to YOUR satisfaction, and having the ability to say "I did this myself!" then go for it. I can tell you first hand.... it may be a bit intimidating at first but it can be done and the satisfaction in the end is well worth it, IMHO. I upgraded to a mefi4a in 2010, went the mefiburn route and am still fiddling with it a here and there. I'm not sure why some believe it should be "one and done." I learn something each and every time and for me, is why I do it. To each their own I suppose.
03-25-2013, 11:25 PM
#69
Great advice, and thank you.
I have some options for dropping the stock thermo down. It runs at 150 factory, I can get 140, 130 and 120. A few tuners I talked to run the 120 for best charge no chiller. Is this 30 degree drop going to cause a tuning nightmare? Or should I choose a higher temp like 130 or 140?
I here the mefi4b loads fast as well. I am not that concerned with loading time...I have lots of time
I have some options for dropping the stock thermo down. It runs at 150 factory, I can get 140, 130 and 120. A few tuners I talked to run the 120 for best charge no chiller. Is this 30 degree drop going to cause a tuning nightmare? Or should I choose a higher temp like 130 or 140?
I here the mefi4b loads fast as well. I am not that concerned with loading time...I have lots of time
Do your initial BPW/MAP changes with the motor up to operating temperature. Then adjust the coolant temp vs. BPW multiplier table to adjust for cold start/warm up enrichment (akin to a choke). That's how I did it, others may have more eloquent methods.
03-25-2013, 11:33 PM
#70
Great advice, and thank you.
I have some options for dropping the stock thermo down. It runs at 150 factory, I can get 140, 130 and 120. A few tuners I talked to run the 120 for best charge no chiller. Is this 30 degree drop going to cause a tuning nightmare? Or should I choose a higher temp like 130 or 140?
I here the mefi4b loads fast as well. I am not that concerned with loading time...I have lots of time
I have some options for dropping the stock thermo down. It runs at 150 factory, I can get 140, 130 and 120. A few tuners I talked to run the 120 for best charge no chiller. Is this 30 degree drop going to cause a tuning nightmare? Or should I choose a higher temp like 130 or 140?
I here the mefi4b loads fast as well. I am not that concerned with loading time...I have lots of time
Do your initial BPW/MAP changes with the motor up to operating temperature. Then adjust the coolant temp vs. BPW multiplier table to adjust for cold start/warm up enrichment (akin to a choke). That's how I did it, others may have more eloquent methods.
