Thoughts on doing some 454, 330 upgrades?
 

Thoughts on doing some 454, 330 upgrades?

I can spend about $1500 per engine and don’t mind used parts. Please understand that 1500 is the number I want to stay below and going 100mph is not what I am looking for and yes I understand these are not performance engines. I am talking good Chevy stock heads, cam, intake and carb or something like that.

Please be considerate and understand that 1500 per side and 3000 total is a lot of money to me and I would appreciate not being trashed for not spending more.
Thank you!

Here is a great example of a budget 454/330 build........ but at a $1500 a side budget...... Set that money aside for normal maintenance. On a twin engine boat 3k in maintenance in one year would still be a win in my book.
http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...l-results.html

I would save the $$ until a year or 2 from now and you can make it $6,000 and upgrade power. The 330's are really nothing to bother with. They can handle 400 hp but why bother spending a lot of money on that? Please understand $3,000 is a good chunk of change to me as well. Save the money, sell 2 stock 330's and buy 2 420's or hp500's.

i agree 100%.

What year 330's and what boat are they in.

Thank you, I actually take that as a compliment!

+1 on that....... even a set of used 502 mags would really wake things up and be a great foundation for later upgrades

the problem with the 330s is they have cast cranks and pistons and the small 3/8 rod bolts and the peanut port heads.if you sold them and bought some 365 mag engines you would have a solid setup to build on,forged crank&rods and the better rods with the 7/16 bolts and the rectangle port heads.500 hp is easily gotten without spending a lot of money and you dont need to wonder if it will break the crank every time you run it hard.

1+ To everyone that posted already. Run the boat for a few more seasons and save up some more money for better engines.

your welcome,it looks to me like you and i are on the same page.

Also a very good affordable option.

i took this advice and bought a 502 mag its a no brainer, now ill clean the 330 and sell it

OK so we all agree that a set of drop-ins is the way to go so what should the OP expect as far as prices on low hour fresh water carbed 454 and 502 mags, 420's and hp500's and which is the best bang for your buck option

Since every one has decided for the op, i guess that means he has no other options. What if the 3k is the only 3k he intends to throw at motors.What if he is only looking for a little more,and it wouldn't be the first time someone wanted one that sounded better at idle. FWIW i totally agree he could own a better base motor,but he doesn't .
Idle comments

Thank you all for your input. I think this year is going to be spent on some newer stereo equipment.
MOTOR, to answer your question these are all stock 1993 330’s in a 32 fountain fever. Yes I know under powered but the price was right. The boat will do low to mid 60s on flat water and just over 65 in 1’-2’ chop.
It drives me nuts when a Crownline or I hate to say it but a single engine 27’ Baja is staying right there with me. :evilb:

It doesn't take big power to have a 32 fountain in the 70's

What are some realistic prices if I wanted to purchase 2 engines with at least 450hp per side with or without better exhaust?

the point i am trying to make is after he puts 1500. per engine he might gain 2 to 3 mph and he still has 330s,with cast internals.now if he waits and saves up for a few years he can buy better engines and drop them in.i am not making his decision on what to do,im just pointing him in the right direction.i am just stating my opinion,only he can decide what direction to go.after all he did come here looking for opinions.:confused:

What a bunch of diks! lol J/K

I'll throw some ideas at ya. Bolt on a pair of 96+ Vortec style heads. This will bump your compression up from 7.9 to 9:1 with the smaller chambers. Get yourself some takeout cams from a 454/502MAG MPI engine, the roller cams. These can be found cheap, and usually guys have good used GM lifters to go with them and a gen vi timing set. Ditch the stock iron intake manifold for an edelbrock performer oval port. Keep the stock carb, it will be fine.

You'll see a noticeable improvement, and it will sound tougher. Bumping the compression, and going to a roller cam, is a nice upgrade. It doesn't have to be an exotic build. Even if you find the vortec heads from a 96-00 454 Truck engine, they should have Inconel valves in them already.

Put a package together like that, and I will bet it will run circles around a stock 365HP "MAG", make better torque, idle better, and no need to spin it past 5000. Which the stock 330 crank/rods will be fine there.

I think the upgrade MildThunder brought up is more along the lines of what the op was asking .I obviously don't know the op's mechanical ability.With some hunting used stuff and providing his own labor he should be able to get his boat in the 70's within his budget ......My Opinion.

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the op didnt say what year his engines are but unless they are gen6s he will need retrofit lifters,different length pushrods and should modify the heads for 7/16 rocker arm studs as the vortec heads use non adjustable rockers,at this point his 1500.is gone and he still has an engine with cast internals.now he will need to upgrade his exhaust system for the cam he will need to make 400 hp.it just does not sound cost effective to me.

The 454 and 502 mags had the same exhaust as the 330HP. The 224/224 cam on a 115lsa should be no where near reversion. However, it is a step up from the stock 214/218 flat tappet . Pretty sure he can reuse his rocker studs from his 330 heads.

Many years back the 330HP Mercs were in a lot of boats. in the early days of OSO, there were a lot of guys running hopped up 330 merc's. Making 400, 450+ Hp out of them. If they kept the RPM within reason, they held up very well. Heck, some guys even had mounted small blowers on them and ran 4psi of boost with good luck.

Granted its not ideal as having forged internals, for an engine making less than 1hp per ci and kept at 5000RPM and under, its fine.

if my wife says black ,i'll say white.Life's no fun if we all just agree.
I agree there are a lot better bases to start with .But i disagree as to "not worth doing".If he doesn't spin the hell out of the motors,they will live
Do we know what exhaust he has ? I know he said motors are stock .

Clear your inbox, need to send you a pm please

try again buddy

What Mild Thunder and MOTOR have mentioned is more of what I am looking to do. The only thing I get nervous about with the L29 heads is the valves. I have a friend that has done this but dropped a valve after the third season on his engine. How do I tell if the stock valves are Inconel or not?

I am not against doing an engine swap to a better platform but I have seen first-hand good results with mild modifications other than the dropped valve but you can’t tell me a 502 or anything else hasn’t had the same thing happen to it.

To be honest it’s just a boat with no sentimental value so if I want to go that much faster I would be better off selling and taking that extra 6g with me to buy a different boat better equipped

im not saying the manifolds are different,im saying that to make a notacible difference in performance he will need a cam with more lift&duration than the 502 mpi roller from a gen 6 engine.back about 100 years ago we made mods to 330s in the jetboats because we had no money for better,bigger engines and exhaust was basset headers that were dry untill 2200 rpm.i agree that 400 hp can be had from a 330 but at the end of the day it,s still not a desirable engine.with the price of good used takeout engines plus what he can sell his 330s for,its a no brainer IMO.

and thats all i have to say on this one fellas,LOL.:pray:

My engine is a rebuilt 330 bottom end with, all ARP bolts, 088 heads, small Isky cam, roller rockers, Edelbrock intake and carb. I blew the original 330 2 weeks after I purchased my boat so I did not have money to spend on a better engine, and I built that engine on a budget. Made 407hp on the dyno and I don't run past 4800rpm. I only gained 2mph. I have been running this one for 3 seasons now and runs great but I got the itch for more speed and plan on saving money and building another engine in a few years.

if your engine made 77 more hp it should have gained more than 2 mph,more like 4 to 5 more mph.

if you can please post cam specs,and part numbers for intake manifold&carb as maybe the op might want to mirror your build and also a rough idea of what you spent on it.

I ran a 330 bottom and peanut port heads in my old 226. Had a comp exrteme marine.544/.547 112 LSA flat tappet, scorpion roller rockers, edelbrock performer, 830 cfm holley, imco powerflow. Ran great for years. Boat went 58-60 mph stock and would run 70 mph (69.9 GPS when I finally bought one) after the mods. Ran @ 5000 rpm turning a 25 mirage with no issue.

It was like that probably 8 seasons. Believe it or not it met it's demise over heating in the mud with an inexperienced captain who thought the trim switch was the tilt.

I would say it all depends on how you run it. But, if you can't afford an exhaust upgrade I would listen to Lil Red and keep saving.

Its pretty much a fact, a non stepped 32 Fountain with stock 330's ran mid 60's. With 454/365HP they ran 68-70. With 502 Mag carb (390HP), they ran mid 70's. 465HP 502's, (HP500's), they got around 80. Point is that boat responds well to power. I see no reason why doing some budget upgrades to get in the 400HP range, you shouldn't be running low to mid 70's.

Your current engines are probably worth 3500 for the pair. A set of takeout 415HP 502 mags are probably gonna run 12-14K for anything that's not in need of major rebuild ready to drop in. You can spend 10G to go 75mph, or spend a few grand and do some upgrades to what you have. "takeout" engines aren't always a win. Unless you know the person your buying from, you could end up with a pile of junk.

If you go back through some old threads, you'll find tons of 330HP buildups that easily made 400+HP, some closer to 500HP, and guys who ran the snot out of them. If you had a old 38 Scarab, Cigarette, I'd say save up for big power. But a 32 Fountain, adding 150HP to the boat will wake it up bit.

My Isky Cam Specs,
RPM-Range (2200-6500) Valve Lift (.542 .565) Valve Lash hot (.000 .000) ADV Duration (270 280) .050 Duration (221 232) LC 114
Fell flat on dyno after 5000rpm with my setup but didn't want to spin any fast anyways.

Still been playing with props so it is possible when I dial the prop in I will see 4-5mph gain. Original prop on boat was to big for both engines and I think the one I have now might be too small.

Standard Edelbrock Performer manifold (not air gap) and the Edelbrock 750 marine carb

And it was broken in and tuned by Brian41 on his dyno. Brian had to put the biggest jets Edelbrock makes in that Edelbrock carb so it wouldn't run lean. I wouldn't recommend that carb if you want more than 400hp

SUNROCKET24,thanks for posting.i dont care for the edelbrock carbs and agree a holley might do a little better.if brian41 said you made 400 hp,you did.

LOL! yep it made 400hp,Brian said the same thing about the carb! He said he next time I build a engine use a Holley carb! I have the Dyno sheet and Brian has it saved on his Dyno Computer.

The only thing I see with sun rocket, is that his bottom end was fresh, so off to a better start. My biggest reason for not messing with the 330's is they won't sell for crap and will lower the value of the boat once you touch them. Leave them stock and sell them for more $$$. Mild thunders suggestion is a good upgrade, just note unfortunately no one will pay anymore, or within $1,000 of a stock 330 for them after you put money into them.

The 32 non step fountain is about one of the best go fast on a budget hulls to work with for a v hull so IMO its worth putting some power in vs buying a different boat. I like my 31 Scarab for the same reason and it is just a bit slower than a 32 fountain with the same power.

I watch the swap shop forum quite a bit and I have seen some very good deals on drop in motors. I have seen 502 mag mpi's with 300-400 hrs in the $8000 range for a set. I also know of a very clean set with 400hrs that sold for around $7k. At those prices if he can get $3500 for his 330's the OP doesn't have much saving to do at all.

Allot of very good points to consider and some great options have been brought up but it is up to the OP to decide witch option he is the most comfortable with and what his performance goals really are. What direction will end up being the most efficient will have allot to do with luck and the condition of his existing 330's

I still would not suggest tearing into a 454 with a $1500 budget in mind or building on a short block without knowing its existing condition. Just a stock recon. on a tired 330 would exceed $1500.