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New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Fountain testing motors that could rewrite history
Plans are to cruise at race speeds around current world record By LAWRENCE KEECH, Staff Writer Fountain Powerboats is poised to not only break the vee-bottom boat world speed record, but obliterate it at speeds approaching that of the renowned super-cats. In testing Friday, company president David Knight said the Rio Rose’s boat “will run as fast as we want to go,” using technology that defies the laws of physics. “We are going to be cruising (in Sunday’s race) at speeds well above the world record,” Knight said with a hint of pride in his voice Friday in a phone interview. Knight had predicted earlier in the week a race speed around the current world record of 171-miles per hour. But in testing Friday, the engines that some say “aren’t suppose to work” produced race-condition speeds near the 180-mile per hour range. “And with some tweaking we could probably break the 200 mark,” Knight said. Knight estimated the motors are capable of producing speeds in the neighborhood of 225, but a redesign boat hull would be required first. Knight, who joined Fountain Powerboats with a goal of keeping the company at the forefront of technology and engineering excellence, admitted skepticism in the new motors until he saw them run, and said it will take more time before they can start shooting for the 200 mark. “These motors create an incredible amount of torque,” Knight said, “and a vee-bottomleans to the left in a turn already, plus the torque is push-ing you to the left. It is going to take a lot of getting use to, before we are going to know how to compensate for that. I’ll just trim it hard to the right and keep working at it, until we get it.” How much of a change in torque? According to engine builder and designer Alberto Solaroli’s research, the new motors produce almost 250 extra pounds of torque, nearly double the horsepower of Fountain’s previous race engines, increases boost by two tenths, reduces RPMs and comes close to tripling fuel mileage — and the faster the engine runs, the colder it gets. “Torque is what is most important,” Knight said. “Horsepower is just a number, but torque is what turns your tires, or your drives, or props or what ever it is you’re trying to push.” Solaroli’s patented system, which he unsuccessfully pitched to numerous companies before getting a shot with Fountain, creates an adiabatic system — principles similar to how a refrigerator or air conditioner work. It takes hot compressed air and rapidly releases it, causing it to cool. It is much like a can of spray air for computer key boards. Adiabatic systems are not new, but until Solaroli’s design changes, they were not practical due to early ignition, compression and other problems. Solaroli installed multiple cooling chambers that allow the motor to continually cool. “Since the motor is getting colder as you run it faster, there is no need for a radiator, no need for fans and all the belts, hoses, gears and drives associated with them,” Solaroli said. In the case of race boats, Solaroli was able to replace the nearly four-foot superchargers with six-inch turbo drives, further decreasing the boat’s weight. The system also runs very clean and does not require a catalytic converter, which means less weight and by burning less fuel, there are fewer refills or smaller tanks. Inside the motor, Solaroli writes “the pre-expansion of air on its way into the combustion chamber, prevents excessive temperatures being generated ...” “We have three basic phasing going on inside the motor,” he said. “We’ve got a depressurization (which cools the engine), then we can lean burn the motor because of the temperature of the charged air that is going in, and we have changed the efficiency from 15 percent to 85 percent.” Breaking the law of physics, Solaroli has shortened the length of the flame. The explain why a shortened flame is more efficiency, Solaroli said, “You hold your hand over a candle flame, it gets hot, you run your finger through the flame at the wick and you don’t feel it. Everything beyond the point where you do not feel it, is wasted energy.” “You’re going to see the physics books rewritten because of the motors in this boat,” he said. Solaroli added, “we wanted to give somebody like Fountain the oomph to be able to get way ahead of everybody else. We’re going to give them so much power, they are going to have to redesign the hull to handle it.” Solaroli sees a number of other uses for the technology. He said he is working on plans that could be used by the U.S. government for engines which could be placed into humvees, “Hummers are burning up in the deserts in Iraq,” he said. “We have a program coming through the Pentagon, where we are going to convert some diesels. We can take a Durmax diesel, which typically gets about 14 miles per gallon, we added 196 horsepower, 346 pounds of torque and we gained 44 percent more fuel economy.” Why else is the military interested? “Heat seeking missiles work at a 400 degree Fahrenheit threshold, below that they are classified as people,” Solaroli explained. “This system cools the engine to a point below that, so now I can make a hummer go across the desert and look like a human and nobody can shoot at it.” Other uses include smaller generators that produce more power. “We are going to take a C15 diesel that is six and half feet long, five and half feet high and has a radiator of 6x6 on the front, and we’re going to shrink that by two, multiply the torque and horsepower by two and give them 60 percent more efficiency,” he said. Solaroli said there is the potential to use the technology in regular cars. |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
I don't think they made it a lap in the race.
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Solaroli.......
He has some sales pitch |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
I always look forward to new things, saw the world go to fuel injction and superchargers now come from manufacture's. This is the type of publicity that fountain should be doing, not the cat killer video. BUT, they shouldnt brag about it until the testing is complete...
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
I have some prime real estate Reggie might be interested in. :cool:
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
someone stole TMP'S secret receipe........
:D |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Man.... I needed a good chuckle today....... :rolleyes:
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
If it sounds to good to be true, you know the answer.....
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by 42MTI
If it sounds to good to be true, you know the answer.....
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by CASH BAR
Like...."Your boat will be ready any day......".......... :eek: :D
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Ouch.......... :eek: :rolleyes:
Have you been to this thread in a while Phantom....???? http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...d.php?t=135699 |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
If you cool the air by expansion, isn't it going to heat right back up when its compressed for combustion? I'll need a couple of stiff drinks before this makes sense to me. And 4 foot blowers? And since when do race boats have fans, radiators, converters?
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
hmm whats all this about?
http://truckerssavefuel.com/features.html |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Not sure exactly what this system is actually doing here, but it sounds like some sort of air condtioning system on the induction side of a motor. The question is, and maybe there are some knowledgeable AC guys here, is that a motor capable of getting a boat of this type and size to 200mph is going to use about 1500 cubic feet of air per minute at top rpms. I would think that the horsepower use , size of this pump, heat exchanger, etc. would make this system kind of expensive and oversize. Maybe It's just got a couple of 50 gallon nitrous bottles? Time will tell all! Hope it works and will really revolutionize engine power.
Ray @ Raylar |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by CASH BAR
Like...."Your boat will be ready any day......".......... :eek: :D
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
ok before RoR threw a prop blade. he was 1/2 to 3/4 mile a head of any boat on the corse . he was smoking fast well in to 3 didgets . when he came by us . :drink:
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
i stopped reading at 85% efficiency. I'll believe it when it solves our energy crisis. He may need to tweak the flux capictor first.
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by fountain1fan
ok before RoR threw a prop blade. he was 1/2 to 3/4 mile a head of any boat on the corse . he was smoking fast well in to 3 didgets . when he came by us . :drink:
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Solaroli also has new, patented technology that will allow Reggie to double the amount of rapper-bling jewelry and still remain upright under his own power.
Solaroli is also working on physics-defying technology that will make Reggie's hair look real. |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by Raylar
Not sure exactly what this system is actually doing here, but it sounds like some sort of air condtioning system on the induction side of a motor.
You can read the whole thing here. The USPTO is full of crap like this http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...RS=IN/Solaroli |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
The fact that we are first hearing of this in the boat industry makes it bunk.
If I invented this and it really worked my first pitch would be GM, then FOrd, then Toyota then down thru the rest of the huge automakers. It would make a LOT more money there than in the boating industry. |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by Chris Sunkin
Solaroli also has new, patented technology that will allow Reggie to double the amount of rapper-bling jewelry and still remain upright under his own power.
Solaroli is also working on physics-defying technology that will make Reggie's hair look real. thanks, Mike :mad: |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by kswest
The fact that we are first hearing of this in the boat industry makes it bunk.
If I invented this and it really worked my first pitch would be GM, then FOrd, then Toyota then down thru the rest of the huge automakers. It would make a LOT more money there than in the boating industry. |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Venture capital is hard to come by these days, maybe it was boat company willing to risk the cash?
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
i was told it was a prop blade . gatorone
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by CASH BAR
Venture capital is hard to come by these days, maybe it was boat company willing to risk the cash?
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
it was rods
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by FeverMike
Seriously can you please grow up? :mad:
Thanks for asking though. |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by fountain1fan
i was told it was a prop blade . gatorone
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
cute sean :drink:
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Now Fountain is employing Physicist's to build speed boats. Not many people get the opportunity to break the laws of phsics let alone get to re-write the book.
Have fun trying. Its only money, they'll print more. :evilb: :evilb: :evilb: |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
3 Attachment(s)
Has been in limited production since February 13, 2006
Is high-efficiency, light-weight (approx. 196 lbs for the big rigs) (approx. 129 lbs for smaller vehicles) Is 750 Horse Power Multi-fuel capable: diesel, gasoline, natural gas, vegetable oil, etc. May change fuel while operating under load Requires NO computer Slow turning, 1500 RPM >>>>Will run inverted<<<<too funny :rolleyes: May operate on hydrogen with water injection for more power and efficiency. May be used on helicopters with no gear-box. Our manufacturing processes make this engine cheaper than the replacement cost of most engines!! Environmentally friendly |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Now I understand...with that equation it makes it clear as mud.... :eek:
Originally Posted by Back4More
Has been in limited production since February 13, 2006
Is high-efficiency, light-weight (approx. 196 lbs for the big rigs) (approx. 129 lbs for smaller vehicles) Is 750 Horse Power Multi-fuel capable: diesel, gasoline, natural gas, vegetable oil, etc. May change fuel while operating under load Requires NO computer Slow turning, 1500 RPM >>>>Will run inverted<<<<too funny :rolleyes: May operate on hydrogen with water injection for more power and efficiency. May be used on helicopters with no gear-box. Our manufacturing processes make this engine cheaper than the replacement cost of most engines!! Environmentally friendly |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
I believe this "Italian" may be using, taking credit and patenting an engine that the great "Smokey Yunick" already had running and operating and I believe also patented way back in the 80's.
Smokey Yunick called it the "adiabatic" engine also. It used a type of tubocharger to compress air that was then cooled by a pressure drop when forced into the engine to promote ignition under high compression without detonation. He also had it submitted to the military, but i think he died before it was ever brought into commercial production. If Yunick said it will work, it will!, but I hope this guy is not trying to take credit for someone elses great innovation and work? Ray @ Raylar |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
GM did some significant experimentation with adabiatic engines in the 80's. Since we don't see them in cars, you can assume there was some issue. Like all theories, sometimes the application falls short.
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
The ac systems in some aircraft work the same way, ambient air is compressed by a compressor, then cooled while it is still compressed, then expanded by a cooling turbine( which is connected to the compressor by a common shaft), when the air is expanded it can be below freezing temp. In the airplane it is called an air cycle machine (acm), on the ground they work ok, in flight the work great, but you have a lot colder air temps (i've seen -70+ in flight), and you have the engines driving the airflow to the compressors. There is alot more to it than that, this is the very short version! I don't think this would work on a boat.
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
The figure above describes a cooling system. Unlike refrigeration there is no phase change if the cooling medium is air. But some of the heat energy (Qh), presumably from engine cooling, is being turned into work by spinning the turbocompressor.
The figure shows that if there is enough heat energy driving the system, there is excess energy to do some work from the shaft. Or you could use that energy to drive a bigger compressor and supercharge the engine. The high speed of the turbine shaft is only good for this kind of work. The limit to power when supercharging is detonation, so the overall success of this approach seems to depend on controlling combustion so that detonation does not occur. That's the real trick isn't it? The patent talks about modifications needed to the top ring of the piston to deal with extreme and uneven cylinder pressure and damaging vibration frequencies. Not a bad definition of detonation. But I do find interesting the claim that even with very high combustion chamber pressures, wtih low air temperatures, lean mixtures and turbulence you can prevent detonation. Tom P.S. bobkatz I understand your description but the temperature graphs for the adiabatic system show heat being added by the heat exchanger after the compressor. I am assuming that this is from the engine cooling medium and is necessary to extract energy from that source when passing through the turbine. But I've been wrong before. |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
On the acm's the only time heat is added is after the outlet duct for cabin comfort, or the acm can be bypassed entirely.
And I have also been wrong before and I'm sure in the future. :D Now off to play with my old inefficient roots technology, on dare i say it, a fountain! :drink: |
Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
We had the best start in the race and at about 127- 130 Reggies boat with the new motors went by us at least 20 to 30 mph faster than we were going. When they get it right the boating world will stand up and take notice. Also at is very quite at WOF
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Re: New engine technology, or Hocus Pocus.....?
Originally Posted by TeamTaboo
We had the best start in the race and at about 127- 130 Reggies boat with the new motors went by us at least 20 to 30 mph faster than we were going. When they get it right the boating world will stand up and take notice. Also at is very quite at WOF
Sounds really cool! Can Reggies hairpiece stand the G-force???? Sorry, feverMike, I just had to :D |
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