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Old 10-09-2006, 03:16 PM
  #11
BRAD SCHOENWALD
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

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Originally Posted by NefariousOne
Maybe a calmer environment, but better controlled than "crowded" "open" ocean...... ya lost me for a second. never associated the open ocean as crowded.

I agree condition wise though.
Your right... The open ocean is just that. My current mental image is my boating back yard as the entire Fort Lauderdale/Miami area is extremely contact heavy offshore and as such not the best site for instruction.

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Old 10-09-2006, 04:16 PM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

I would imagine you would have to be a USCG certified captain to teach any type of boating skills. This is basically hiring out a boat for a charter which I know requires liability insurance and a USCG license. I'm sure their are many people out there with the skills but without the proper paperwork it doesn't mean much to an insurance company.

The idea is a good one as many boaters have the funds to purchase a boat but most do not have the skills to run it safely at the current speed an quarters such as a poker run.

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Hey Guys,

The school curriculum is using the most efficient instructional methods to achieve the desire outcomes. It isn’t about running it as we see fit but more about finding a practical way to transfer needed knowledge to performance boat owners.

The ability to find appropriate insurance is and will continue to be difficult. Notice I said appropriate… Having the instructors and all the students as named insured is as I’m sure you could imagine not practical or attainable.

The bottom line is the students are leaving the current course with some extremely powerful skills to which they can employ on their own in appropriate settings and times. The course critiques continue to be amazing, ask anyone who has attended for their first hand opinion.

I would go on to tell you, as a person who has and continues to instruct students both in vessel operation and vessel inspection there are other individuals who poses the skill sets required to operate performance boats, but only one I know of who has the presence, dedication, and proper motivation to transfer that knowledge to others.

I have done performance based training at just about every Coast Guard School there is including advanced ship simulators and it was the demonstration of proper skills I walked any with and then employed and practiced upon my return to my duty station which improved by ability. If I kept driving a motorlife boat like I did at Lifeboat School in Ilwaco I would have killed someone.

The lake environment offers a completely accessible and better controlled operating environment than a crowded open ocean with complications of weather and rough inlets. Additionaly this is not meant to be drivers- ed but more advanced skill training. Sure there are new boaters coming but if you want basic training then we highly encourage everyone to take a local boating safety course offered at low or no charge, they will teach basic safety, operation, and how to tie lines.


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Old 10-09-2006, 05:00 PM
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BRAD SCHOENWALD
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

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Originally Posted by CIG3
I would imagine you would have to be a USCG certified captain to teach any type of boating skills. This is basically hiring out a boat for a charter which I know requires liability insurance and a USCG license. I'm sure their are many people out there with the skills but without the proper paperwork it doesn't mean much to an insurance company.

The idea is a good one as many boaters have the funds to purchase a boat but most do not have the skills to run it safely at the current speed an quarters such as a poker run.
You do not have to be a USCG certified captain to teach. You must poses at least an OUPV "Six Pack" if you operate for hire on a navigable waterway. I am a Active Duty Coast Guard Warrant Officer and work as a Marine Inspector dealing with commercial operations from small inspected charter boats to cruise ships and I can tell you since the Coast Guard farmed out lower level licensing to third parties the competency and value of these licenses has dropped significantly. I also maintain a 100t Masters License for continuity and recentcy.



The insurance companies have learned to look well beyond the paper on the wall and find real solutions which mitigate risk and provide tangible value to the policy holders.

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Old 10-09-2006, 07:41 PM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

One can learn alot just from listening to those whom have done!
I have seen many people who chose not to take the time to listen at all, and a few of those have ended up wet or even hurt.

These new classes are designed to teach through example. Allowing the students to sit, watch, listen and learn as opposed to attempt to controll and learn at the same time.
I hold a commercial Pilots licences with some respectable endorsments behind it. I have learned the most from classrooms and cockpit example type teaching, i.e., an instrucor flying while explaining what the situation is and what he/she is doing to controll or correct it. Sure its more fun to drive the vehicle yourself, but that limits the amount of learning while controlling.
Let the instructor teach as you learn, and then go teach yourself as applied knowladge in your own boat in safe conditions. This creates a safer more knowladgable driver... and than is the point of taking these courses
(I would think).

I am pushing the idea of people taking these classes when they purchase boats from my showroom. They are great for our entire industry.
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Old 10-09-2006, 07:54 PM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

Surprises me that many of the high end manufactures do not offer an inside teaching platform of offer to pay for their new owner to go to a performance oriented learning center such as Tres' or alike.
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Old 10-09-2006, 09:44 PM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

Cig3,

Manufacturers don't offer it because they're afraid of liability. If I, Mr. Cigarette, take you out and teach you, and then you have a crash I'm afraid you'll sue me. Or your heirs will sue me. After all, you said I was good to go. You even trained me. Now I'm dead. And that must be your fault. So you owe my family a lot of money.

That's the society in which we live. No good deed shall go unpunished.

Wellcraft actually tried a driving program with its Scarab line. It had legendary instructors such as John Connor. And it failed. Yes, it was expensive, but a week at South Seas Plantation is expensive ... without daily high-performance boating instruction. So obviously such a program could be created and is insurable, at least it was at the time.

The Wellcraft program had hands-on and classroom instruction with the best of the best. Other students were, in fact, in the boats with other students driving. But Wellcraft is a mighty big company. Talented as he is, Tres Martin doesn't have Wellcraft's bank. So he does what he does within the parameters of being a one-man show, and he's doing some good.
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Old 10-10-2006, 08:58 AM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

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Originally Posted by CIG3
Surprises me that many of the high end manufactures do not offer an inside teaching platform of offer to pay for their new owner to go to a performance oriented learning center such as Tres' or alike.
Actually some manufactures have jumped aboard, and some dealers. Outerlimits offers our class to every boat owner to lower the liability for the company. And this means they really care about the customer. This is the last free thing you can still do in this world.You cant freely drive a motorcyle or car at 150 anywhere. I am only here to preserve what is left. Later the manufactures, boat dealers, repair shop etc. will be thankful that this will still be around. Too many people think this is a class like driving school like you go to when you get a ticket. Some enter my class because the insurance companies force them in. So the attitude when getting there is "Lets just get this over with" once in the class they soon find out its quite fun, and they find they have been making many mistakes on the water. They really have a different outlook after going.
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Old 10-10-2006, 09:04 AM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

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Originally Posted by 100-Plus
Cig3,

Manufacturers don't offer it because they're afraid of liability. If I, Mr. Cigarette, take you out and teach you, and then you have a crash I'm afraid you'll sue me. Or your heirs will sue me. After all, you said I was good to go. You even trained me. Now I'm dead. And that must be your fault. So you owe my family a lot of money.

That's the society in which we live. No good deed shall go unpunished.

Wellcraft actually tried a driving program with its Scarab line. It had legendary instructors such as John Connor. And it failed. Yes, it was expensive, but a week at South Seas Plantation is expensive ... without daily high-performance boating instruction. So obviously such a program could be created and is insurable, at least it was at the time.

The Wellcraft program had hands-on and classroom instruction with the best of the best. Other students were, in fact, in the boats with other students driving. But Wellcraft is a mighty big company. Talented as he is, Tres Martin doesn't have Wellcraft's bank. So he does what he does within the parameters of being a one-man show, and he's doing some good.
Thanks.Its not a one man show for long. Brad is now a important part of this project. Soon there is going to be a big announcement. Stay tunned.
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Old 10-10-2006, 01:41 PM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

I guess my question is what is the difference between a performance boating class & a Petty Driving Experience, BMW Driving School offered by BMW or a Kevin Schwantz Superbike School when it comes to liability? They teach you things that one can certainly apply to their street riding or driving and obviously operate profitably (or they wouldn't be so many schools in business all over the country) w/ the same or greater risk certainly based on the #'s of people that take their courses. I'm sure they get sued in fact I know of several deaths involving students while attending the schools. Does the # of boats & insured contributing to the boat insurance pool versus the far many more cars & insured contributing to the auto insurance industry have anything to do w/ Tres Martins ability to secure a policy that would allow more student participation?
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Old 10-10-2006, 05:48 PM
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Default Re: Performance Boating school

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I guess my question is what is the difference between a performance boating class & a Petty Driving Experience, BMW Driving School offered by BMW or a Kevin Schwantz Superbike School when it comes to liability? They teach you things that one can certainly apply to their street riding or driving and obviously operate profitably (or they wouldn't be so many schools in business all over the country) w/ the same or greater risk certainly based on the #'s of people that take their courses. I'm sure they get sued in fact I know of several deaths involving students while attending the schools. Does the # of boats & insured contributing to the boat insurance pool versus the far many more cars & insured contributing to the auto insurance industry have anything to do w/ Tres Martins ability to secure a policy that would allow more student participation?
At the end of the day, too many say I already know how to drive. I dont need school. Just as I thought before I took motorcycle safety course.
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