Anybody who thinks Mark McManus or Bobby Saccenti isn't a "Hands-on" boat builder, they are sadly mistaken or had never been to either factory during a normal business day.

Morning everyone! Is Anyone going for a ride on their Apache today?

Not really a slip but it was meant to be a response to your post, not necessarily meant to be a slant on McManus....

I've never owned a Sutphen but do like them. I've only had the opportunity to ride in one, it had (3) 2.5 Bridgeports on it.... quick boat but very light, not an Apache ride but it was fast.

Everybody has a place in the world.

You misunderstood my point... My perspective is if you drive/race/build your product you are in tune with what needs to be done to make it better. If you don't....you need to rely on engineering logic and/or other people to do it for you....

Amazing how off topic this thread has gotten...as all Apache threads do...

Like Ed Cozzi said.... You get what you pay for....

Thank You

After reading this, and I have to admit its been a good time I looked around the classifieds and they really arn't priced much higher than most of the others when you look at the hardware involved. ( ck the 41 Shogren has) And while we are at it can someone explain to me why any if not ALL the builders or for that matter Merc gets the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ that they can get for the products that for the most part have no warr, little or no service to speak of and they just keep charging more and more. I just don't understand any of it, and it seems to me that they are just priceing the small to middle income guys out of the sport........ Its not just the Apache's.

Question. Then why was/is Mr. McManus so damn successful with the Apache brand, without being a racer or engineer or whatever else?

I believe that I already answered that question......

To reiterate..do you own or are you going to buy an Apache?

I'm not sure how you quantify success. Whatever McManus is doing, presumably it's satisfying to him. He's not building any boats and most likely avoiding all the hassles and money-losing that comes with the territory. My guess, based on what you can see and other's suppositions, is that he's making a living doing refits and such to existing Apaches. I've seen what he charges for his work and it seems like he's always got work so maybe he's smarter than the rest of us. I know Saccenti has had plenty of ups and downs since the split with Kramer's and that the latest Chief incarnation resulted in one boat being built, despite the name recognition and all the commotion surrounding him going back to building boats. Now, if I were in the market for a new boat, I'd sure as hell rather it be built by Bob than Mark.

In the end, it's a crowded marketplace these days in the $500K custom boat business.

Why not Mr. McManus, look at his experience and the resale, I think he even was the man personally responsible for painting up boats with wild graphics. He is the founder of mega power, wild painted offshore boats. It seems that many want to ride on his fame, but he has always weathered it out.