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Old 11-01-2007, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Phil M View Post
Can you imagine these Offshore racers - not wanting to be photographed ? I cant - I think they would buy photos from anyone that fiilms them - remember - its a ego trip !
I will not be taking any pics of them in Key West this year.

I have been offered photos from someone that does plan on vacationing there next week..

So an interesting twist.

A person take pics of boats out in the Gulf while on his vacation from November 6th thru the 11th.

They return home and give me the photos and says do what I want with them.

How could this be illegal for me when I never even stepped in the state?
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Old 11-01-2007, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by sharkeymarine View Post
I will not be taking any pics of them in Key West this year.

I have been offered photos from someone that does plan on vacationing there next week..

So an interesting twist.

A person take pics of boats out in the Gulf while on his vacation from November 6th thru the 11th.

They return home and give me the photos and says do what I want with them.

How could this be illegal for me when I never even stepped in the state?
Maybe just make sure there's no SBI logo's on the boat in the pics.... For purposes of a picture, they could have been doing a test run....
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Old 11-01-2007, 05:36 PM
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Public Domain as I know it is anything that's available to the public which does not have a copyright. Are we talking about the same thing here or are we talking about just "open to the public"?

"“Public domain” is not a place, but rather a concept where a work of authorship is no longer under copyright protection or the author “releases” the work to the general public to use without compensation."


"Myth #14: If it's in the public domain, I am free to use it.
Fact: Not so fast. While most of the material that has fallen into the public domain is indeed free for the public to use, there are some public domain works that are still protected in other ways. Some public domain art works may be protected by trademark law, though a recent Supreme Court case may limit the extent to which trademark law can be used to restrict works otherwise in the public domain. Other works may be in the public domain in one country, but still under copyright protection in another country. I know this may sound counterintuitive, and "public domain" should really be public. But if you are considering using a public domain work or incorporating it into your work (in a "derivative work"), you should perform some due diligence and determine who, if anyone, still retains rights to it - just to make sure it is free and clear. Keep in mind also, that if a work is in the public domain, you cannot copyright it for yourself."

Last edited by Panther; 11-01-2007 at 05:46 PM.
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Old 11-01-2007, 06:38 PM
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Ok then, in a completely hypothetical situation:

If someone takes pic of you in your boat on a run. That photog owns the rights to the pics and can sell it to whomever they want. Right? And if the pic gets sold to multiple major publications and gets a nice paycheck for that photo, it is fine. That even though an organization paid for the event & that the owner who also paid to enter the event, has abosolutely NO RIGHTS and deserves no compensation nor notority. It's the photographer that owns ALL the RIGHTS and ALL the PROCEEDS. Do you agree?
Yes !

As long as it was the photographer that sold the image to the multiple major publications and not the person that bought an image. The purchaser would need to have in writing a Copyright License Agreement that clearly states that they are allowed to sell it to third parties.

That is another reason you see magazines having to pay out judgements for printing photographs that they did not have a license to use contract from the photographer.

If I have the information of the person and boat I usually will include it and let the magazine determine if they are to add it to the image. In my case where I submitted photos of the Atlantic City Poker Run to H2O Full Throttle Magazine, you will see the names were included with the images. The Poker Run Club as well got 6 pages of notority.

If an organizor doesn't see a value in the publicity from a photgrapher's work, then perhaps we should all stop taking pictures of those events ....
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Old 11-01-2007, 07:58 PM
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[QUOTELucididee]"I think the bottom line is you can take a picture wherever you want and pretty much do what you want with them. But the gray line and controversy starts when they are sold for a profit."

Thank you .......... THAT is the bottom line is this particular instance.......AND... another party brought the photographer in to shoot for them.

Just my .02 because I was there....I'm honestly not taking sides due to my affiliation, I try very hard to see both sides of stuff......and there are big mis-understandings here. Bashers, feel free, I am not family.

I am glad I finally got to meet you Sharkey......sorry I didn't have more time to talk to you. After KW I will. Hang in there. PD
PROFIT or NOT, I was told I couldn't sell them without 1st paying up the sum of $1,000 and give the organization copies and copyrights to everything I shot.

I still have not received a copy of the contract that they said they would send. I have honored the request of not selling the images so far, even though my attorney had advised me that being as I didn't sign anything there is nothing stopping me from doing so.

Pat, It was nice to finally meet you as well. I am not sure if I will be attending any future races anytime soon.

Take care!
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Old 11-02-2007, 06:41 AM
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JUST GO TAKE YOUR PHOTOS - THEY ARE YOURS - IGNORE SBI - AND HAVE FUN -

ITS MONEY MONEY MONEY FOR THEM - AND THEY KNOW THEY CAN NOT CONTROL THE AIR SPACE OVER THE RACE - THEY MIGHT SAY IT IS IN A "NOTAM" AREA - THAT MEANS - NOTICE TO AIRMEN - SAYING - USUALLY -

"CAUTION - MANY AIRCRAFT - ETC. - BUT THEY CAN NOT RESTRICT FREE TRADE - ITS EITHER OPEN TO ALL OR NONE." NOT THEIR ANOITED AIRCRAFT - AT ALL

GO TAKE YOUR PHOTOS - SELL THEM TO WHOM EVER YOU WANT - AND ENJOY LIFE -

DONT LET SBI GET TO YOU - THEY HAVE NO POWER OTHER THAN THEY LOVE TO HEAR THE SOUND OF THEIR OWN VOICE !

PHIL

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Old 11-02-2007, 12:03 PM
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Maybe SBI would like copies to use in future advertiesment and that is why they are asking for copys and copyrights? But to pay them money to shoot is the interesting one. Unless you are flying in a heli that during the even for you would be flying over the race course would be something for insurance reasons? Also dosnet this topic come up around this time every year? seem to remember a thread last year about the keys and photos.
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Old 11-02-2007, 01:22 PM
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We welcome the press, media and photographers with open arms. No fees to pay, just a big thank you for attending our race in Destin and helping to promote the sport of Offshore Powerboat Racing.

You can even sell the images if you want and we'll still say thanks for attending.

See ya next week in Destin.
Welcomed with open arms, what's that? lol Guess I've been talking to the wrong people. Good to know. I feel I've done a good job for a lot of these guys privately & put out a good product. I really enjoy shooting from the chopper. However, I can't seem to break through all the politics/BS & get in touch with a solid contact to avoid the hassels such as these or that's not threatened by a fellow photographers work. I feel there are plenty of shots, events & knowledge that could be shared to go around for everyone. I "believe" though now the copyright laws have changed more in our favor due to so many getting to sue happy. It's my understanding that if you shoot it & can prove you shot it, it's yours to do as you please!! No one can do a thing about it provided you as the photographer (considered the artist of the print) have not signed any contracts stating otherwise. You knew I couldn't resist this thread Jay....LOL.
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Old 11-02-2007, 01:25 PM
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Not classy, just someone that realizes that our racers need to give thier sponsors some real value for thier money spent and seeing photos on the net and in magazine is part of the equastion.

The racers need to be given every opportunity to promote themselves, thier team and thier sponsor. The media is what makes that happen, so why not welcome them with open arms so that they attend more of our races.

Frankly, OSS and SBI should consider paying the media's expenses for attending, not driving them away.
WELL SAID!!!
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Old 11-02-2007, 10:49 PM
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You knew I couldn't resist this thread Jay....LOL.
I wondered when you were gonna show up.
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