New marine diesel engine
 

Check this out: http://www.buckdiesel.com/index.php?Section=Home

Very Interesting......

Yes it is. Time will tell.

I was wondering if you knew anything on it.........

Nope never seen this before. But I will know something by the end of the week!

Don

Maritime Eng .. where did you go to school?
My degree is in Maritime Systems Engineering - "Offshore Structures"

Ernie

University Of Minnesota (Institute of Technology)
My Degree is in Mechanical Engineering with an emphasis in Internal Combustion Engines

I'll bet! :D When ya do, ya gotta SHARE!!!!!

Check out the patents here. Interesting concept: Individually modular cylinder assemblies mounted to a common rail, rather than a one-piece block engine. Not completely original in concept or production, but in application perhaps.

Cool.

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7287493.html
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7287494.html

Buck has four years experience and has solved all of diesels problems. What has everybody else been doing the last hundred years?

Hey everyone. Sorry it took me so long to find this forum.

I work at Buck Marine Diesel. We are currently developing a prototype diesel engine specifically designed for inboard marine use, with some possible OTR applications in the future. We're still working on things right now. We're getting VERY close to getting the first prototype fully up and running. We had it running the other day for about an hour at around 2000 rpm without any problems. We need to do a little more work to get our dyno fully-functional but things are going good.

We are currently working on a 6-cylinder model with 3- and 4-cylinder models to follow. The engines have a unique two injector per cylinder design that will increase the fuel mapping potential exponentially and result in lower emissions capability. The family of engines will range from 150 to 700 HP and have been designed from the bottom up with a totally different approach. These engines are capable of exceptional cooling, allowing for substantial improvements in power output while increasing longevity.

The cooling path for this engine is a fraction of most engines. In the classic designs, coolant flows into the front of the engine, all the way back to the rear cylinder, then back out the front. This means that the rear cylinder is always receiving water that has already been heated by the previous cylinders.

In the Buck Marine system, the coolant flows individually into and out of each cylinder. This means that the all of the cylinders will be operating at the same temperature at all times. Using individual and shorter cooling paths, will also help eliminate hot spots and temperature stacking.

The engine also has a dual cooling system that uses both an internal coolant as well as circulating raw water from whatever body of water the boat is in. This cooling system will keep the engine running cool, allowing us to generate more power. If a problem should arise, the engine is also very serviceable.

The modular cylinder design allows for easy maintenance. With our design, you can change an individual cylinder, head, piston, and connecting rod without having to remove the crank case. We are estimating that the entire upper half of the engine (cylinders, heads, pistons, and connecting rods ) could be entirely replaced in about 2 hours time. Each of the aforementioned parts is also interchangeable with each of the other cylinders. In addition, nearly every seal is made with an o-ring of some form, meaning that the gasket set for the entire engine can fit in a gallon-sized plastic bag. These two factors will significantly reduce part inventory. A video of the connecting rod replacement procedure is available on the website.

Since we didn't have the dyno working properly, we're not positive on the actual power numbers. However, while running under a moderate load at about 2500 rpm, the exhaust temperatures were around 1200 degrees F. We ran under those conditions for about 15 minutes. The hottest that the coolant pump got was about 110 degrees F. None of the 6 heads were over 135 degrees and all of them were within about 3 degrees of one another. You could lay your hands on top of the valve covers.

We will hopefully be back up and running by the end of next week with a fully-functioning dyno. When we have some solid power numbers, I will be sure to let everyone know.

Check out our website for further pictures and videos.

Feel free to ask any questions that you have.

Buck Marine Diesel

This is a video of our cylinder replacement procedure:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsgCHbptRRc

This is a video of our engine actually up and running:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5PkOV6gxZA

looks very good !

any idear what the weight is of the 6 cilinder

please keep us posted here !

where having here (in europe) two diesel projects,one for this winter ,a 32 hustler whit 2 cmd qsd 4.2 320hp and for next year a 40 ft baja outlaw whit twin 440 s and asd 8

but more hp is always welcome
:ernaehrung004:

keep us posted on the results. i am interested in some more info.

Our 6-cylinder, ready-to-run, weighs about 1500 lbs.

What will be the est. wieght (700hp model)... complete with headers, fluids and all. Thank You. Jeff

The Magic Engine Bullet??
 

Nice looking product and development ideas here.
The biggest concern the marine engine market has for these type of diesels is :
1. Engine package size and weight
2. the realitively slow engine rpms and low torque rise characteristics make coupling these engines up 1 to 1 with exisitng drive ratios not practical and make bottom end acceleration times a big problem and issue.
3. If a multispeed transmission is used to overcome the low rpm operating range then the package gets, more expensive, bigger and longer and a difficult drive develoment problem.

What is really needed in a high performance marine diesel engine is
1. Light weight- smaller package especially length.
2. Higher rpm capability up around 4000 plus rpms and a slower, flat torque curve that runs lower at low rpms and stays realitivly flat up to higher rpms.
3. A moderate cost marinized unit that will sell complete in the $30K price range
A lot to ask for, but that is whats needed and when its available in the future, that is what most performance boaters will want to buy!!
If this engine becomes a production reality and it proves reliable and cost affordable it will obviously compete well against the similar Cummins, Cat and Volvo offerings in the general marine market. If fuel costs diesel versus gasoline stay in there relative ranges they are now or in the near term future, these type of engines don't pencil in the performance boating community . As for its viability in the marine performance market, I don't think this is the magic bullet you guys like to talk about.

Best Regards,
Ray @ Raylar

Ray,

I've voiced my thoughts on this engine before, you just put it so much more politically correct than I would have. Thank you for doing that!!!

Joe Gere

QUESTION .......

how come nobody use's the wiesman multie speed trans, on any of the yanmar or cummins boat's ?
are they that much $ ?
or they just wont fit ?

thank's
mike

I still think a boat with a set of old 8-71 2 stroke Detroit diesels would be bad as he!!. Those engines can scream

Who's the owner?
 

Is this one of Al Solaroli's projects?

Ray, you seem to be missing something. We are not advertising this as a "high performance" marine diesel. Our estimated power numbers are: 650 hp @ 3200 rpm, max rpm 3500, 1500 lb. weight. 1400 ft-lbs. of torque at 2000 rpm. We will offer a high performance line at 800 hp that will weigh about 150 lbs less than this engine.

So let's compare it to another inline 6, 4 stroke engine in the market in that same hp range. The Caterpillar C-12E engine has a listed size of: 62" Long x 39.5" tall x 38.1" wide and has a listed weight of 2588 lbs and an output of about 600 hp. (this is taken off of http://marine.cat.com/cda/layout?f=200499&m=214842&x=7 if you want to look it up yourself)

Our engine measures 60" long x 29.7" tall x 28.9" wide, weighs in at 1500 lbs, and has an estimated 650 hp. (The dimensions of our engine are shown here: http://buckdiesel.com/index.php?Section=Specs)

This is purely a dimensional comparison. This does not take into account the fact that our engine is MUCH easier to work on, should be more fuel efficient, and will be available at a competitive price. Overall, we have a list of about 55 improvements that our engine has over a conventional diesel engine.

If you would like to hear more, let me know.

Joe, where did you voice these opinions? I would be interested in hearing them.

No. This engine was designed, patented, and built by Mike Buck and Buck Marine Diesel.

Ask RIK about Weisman:drink:

there very expensive!!
a friend of mine is gonna use a zf 2 speed trans whit 440 yanmars and asd 8 hopefully end of next season ready and some results

timbillyosu,

My opinions on the Buck engine are on the website here somewhere? In a nut shell not you or Buck itself but other people were pushing these engines as an alternative to regular diesels and these could be the performance answer.

I thought on the website before there was mention of Hp ratings and rpm's???? When I looked there today I don't see them and I thought the engine was being presented as a slower turning engine much slower than your talking about here?

I think I quoted what was on your site and commented - "it won't work for these applications"

When I go to website today it seems a little more tangiable that's good to see and I wish you luck.

If it truley weighs 1,350 lbs dressed minus trans, turns 3,500 rpm's and makes 800 continuious Hp you probably have something there.

I'm guessing with that engine your whole marketing strategy has changed then and you're going after "performance" boats?

With that said what kind of turbo(s) are you running (fixed, VG's, seq, bi, etc)?

How are you going to generate lower RPM boost than a Yanmar, Cat or Cummins?

What will make your engine accelerate better than say a Cummins when that big cleaver is fully submerged under water (don't tell me vent tubes or multispeed trans because then your no better than anyone else!)?

How did you loose 150 lbs on the performance version?

Are you still using the SAE #2 bell housing?

Checked out the web site. I see a lot of high quality machined parts. What i don't see is how all that quality is gonna translate into a less expensive end product.:drink:

I'm not aware of any numbers being posted to the site, but we had a guy here that was doing the site work and let's just say some of it was "sub-par"

As far as I know, the engines have always been touted as having a max of 3500 rpm...

1500 lbs. The 800 hp model will only be for the performance model. The standard model should be around 650 hp.

Fixed for now, but when we can get some more complete testing done, we will examine some different turbos.

It's our intent to use a variable geometry turbo which should improve the low-end boost.

We are using a lighter rotating assembly which will improve throttle response and therefore reach maximum rpm faster and maximum boost sooner.

The biggest weight reduction will be switching to an aluminum instead of a cast-iron carrier. But the performance line is down the road a bit yet.

Yes, on all of the 3-,4-, and 6-cylinder models.

Keep us informed it should be exciting, sounds like your still far from running test iron in boats let alone production. Hopefully the economy won't take it's toll on your project.

Joe Gere

We believe we have about another 6 or 8 months of testing before we can get the engines in boats. Then we plan to put 25 out on the water and see what they can do.

We are working on raising the capital to take things into full-scale production. We believe once we have the capital, we will have the first engines available in about a year and a half to two years.

Yes, the economy is a big worry, but we feel we are getting into things at about the right time. The economy has to rebound sometime. Hopefully things will be picking back up in those 2 years it will take us to get production set up :)

The modular cylinder kinda reminds me of a Deutz. Doug

But Duetz still uses a full cast-iron block and their modular cylinders are just basically removable sleeves. Our jug is made of aluminum with a cast-iron sleeve pressed in. This significantly reduces the overall weight of the engine.



We have some preliminary power numbers.

So far, we have only gotten about 160 Hp at 9 gal/hr fuel burn. My boss's boat has 2 Cat diesels, when he is burning 35 gal/hr, he gets about 565 Hp. So let's assume it's a linear trend, at 36 gal/hr (4x our current fuel burn), we will be getting about 640 Hp! We are working to adjust our BSFC. These numbers were made with a BSFC around 0.45. We are still extremely happy with these numbers and as soon as we get more, I will be sure to let everyone know.

Tim,

Good luck, we always expressed things in lbs of fuel/Hp hour. We always felt anywhere from .33 to .36 lbs/hr was good and meant we were very effiecent?

Joe Gere

Which Big Rig engine are they modifying ?

MANY Big rig engineS has those features.

Hey, what did you forget to mention with them aluminum cylinders sleeved if they are modular...seems your trying to make a Lycomig as a diesel....and just as fragile:angry-smiley-038:

35gal/hr and only 565 ..which Cat in question?

Maybe you guys should try to tune and bluprint the engine first...


Regarding non vented Surface drives and big cleavers, Joe Done it already. from standstill to 15 knots quite slow but from 15 up in 3 seconds per 10 knots up to 54...
Cat Powered 25K lbs behemoth....without a two or multispeed tranny.

But I´m more waiting to get my hands on a 5000rpm V12 750hp Diesel that fits anywhere a BBC does...and 800 ft.lbs to boot all over the Rpm range...and with a race history to back the sturdiness up.

Oopps maybe I said too much..

So when do you hope to bag an Audi unit ... anyhow they only ran or so I thought around 650hpish at Le Mans from the 6ltr block so how you going to squeeze 750 out it and in the road car 500hp for reliability that to me seems like a 550hpish boat race engine and it fits in a incy mid engine bay R8 car ... defo one future engine to keep an eye on

That is the BSFC number I was talking about. It stands for Brake Specific Fuel Consumption. So we were getting about 0.45 lb/hp-hr. as i said, we need to do more tuning to get things running more efficiently.

We aren't modifying anything. This is our own design.

The aluminum cylinders have a cast-iron sleeve pressed into them. I don't know much about the Lycomig engines, but I can tell you now that nothing we have here has seemed fragile as of yet.

As I said, we have some work to do to get things tuned to where they need to be. These numbers are just preliminary. Just kind of a "Hey, we're actually doing something"

Jesus you guys are negative.....

They are trying to build a better diesel, thats it.

They did not come on here saying they could break speed records, make pigs fly, build a Aplha drive to hold a ton of power, etc,etc....:evilb:

Why can't people just say, "Looks good man, post some more info along the way"

Negative f*cks all of you.

It's all a matter of view!
 

Lighten up dude. There is a difference between being negative and being critical. Critical input actually helps Timbilly detect problems that he doesn't see from his angle. Between me, joe and mikey combined there is over a hundred years of diesel experience. Some of the technology on this "new" engine has already come & gone in engines you don't see any more.

40flatdeck -

You listen here!!! I am always negative and I say I am, never doubted that I am for one minute - so thanks for noticing!!!

On a serious note though, I do wish them luck, I hope they make it. All I've ever said from day one is it sounds like they are building engines geared toward slower boats not performance boats.

timbillyosu -

How long have you been with these guys?

Lighten up...........me??

I am all for people trying to make something better.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Donger.........