What do you do when you're ripped off ?
 

Hey guys, I am a fairly new member to OSO (Sept/07) and wanted to run something by you for opinion if not anything else.

Towards the end of September '07 I posted in the Formula forum a question .... " Million dollar question .... Which props to use for a 311?"

It got a lot attention ... which I was looking for ... I wanted to purchase some props for my boat of which had the stock 3 blade mirages on it.

There was a lot of great in put from fellow boaters with the similar boat I have ('88 Formula 311 with 330s and bravo drives).

A fellow OSO member "MOERON" posted he had some nearly new props ... a set of Hydromotive Quad IVs 24 pitch for sale.

I think to myself .... perfect that is exactly what I need according to everyone's input.

I contact him .... Ron Truax .... and he states " these props are perfect I tried them and I just can't the rpms out of them that I need..." " They are no good to me so this why I am selling them."

Now by this time it is now first week of October and for you that don't cruise up north (Lake Ontario NY) it is one of two things ..... NO WATER to boat in because the water level has been dropped or it is on the verge of snowing.

I received the props and immediately put them on my 311 and went to launch.

In a period on 40 minutes I knew something was wrong with them or it was to much prop for my boat.

I am by no means a mechanic and don't pretend to be. So I decided to put the boat back on the trailer ... Clean it up and put it away for the winter because at this point nothing can be done as far as getting one of buddies to try them with thier 311s. They have already stored theirs for the winter.

At the end of January this year I decided ... what the he!! ... I have some time before it is boating season again, why don't I send them right to Hydromotive so they can tell there is nothing wrong with them.

Well, what do you think they told me?

"These things are junk!!!" " They are only good for paper weights now."

I ask .... "What do mean the guy I bought them from said they were perfect and that nothing has been altered or changed."

They told me " Someone has hacked the hell out of them to the point we can't fix them properly. And even if we did they would still crack eventually ..... for get the fact it would be cheaper to buy new ones then fix these."

So I called Ron Truax aka MOERON (OSO member name) and explained what I have ran into with props that I purchased in good faith from him last October for $500.00.

His response in the beginning was "It can't be true .... I used them and they were fine."

I responded with "Well apparently they aren't therefore I would like my money back and you can do what ever you want with these props."

He then said " I can't take those props back for $500.00 it has been almost 6 months that you have had them."

I once again explained that I didn't and couldn't even if I wanted to use them for that period of time because of where we live.

Two weeks later he "finds" a guy who will by them as spares ... one of his buddies ..... for $250.00 and he will pay for the shipping. Which by the way up until this point I have been paying for.

I said that is crazy and I am very disappointed with your response to this matter.

At this point I am so pissed off over the whole thing that I told him to send the certified check and be done with it.

Two things happened here .... first I was screwed by a guy who uses this site for information just like the rest of us ... who knew all along something was wrong with these props.

Second I just wasted another half hour of my life writing this note as an FYI

***** Don't do any business with MOERON *****

aka

Ron Truax

Thank-you for reading this and any responses are welcome ..... good , bad , or in different.


Sincerely,

Jeff (got twins ?)

write on brother
 

Thanks for sharing that with us. I to ask alot of questions looking for help. I to have bought things from people on this site. This is a good way to keep them honest.





:angry-smiley-038:

Next time, don't do business with a MORON!!!! :evilb:

Thanks ....

I, too asked myself is it MORON or is it MOERON ....

It is not like I intentionally wanted to get screwed over here.

Just for the record ....

Jeff

I feel for ya. I also bought 2 'brand new' Hydros from off the board. When they showed up, neither was new and 1 had a crack in the hub. I called the seller, which he agreed to replace with another 'new' one. The replacement showed up used, nicked and looked like someone took a wire wheel to the blades. I refused to loose any more $ too this guy by shipping the cracked one back to him. Instead, I sent them all 3 to a prop shop that used to be active here but are no longer around, for repair and labbing. They all came back looking great, but now I could have bought brand new labbed props for less. Sold the 3rd prop to recoupe some $$.

All kidding aside I definately understand your frustration.

I've often wondered if a business "rating" system could work ......I know it's been discussed and is too easily manipulated.

My idea was to start a thread about a PENDING deal:
IE:
"I'm buying/selling a set of props from/to OSO member XXXXX. If anyone has info either of us should have please passs it along."

I'm more than willing to post a thread to that effect for anyone that is buying something from me.....would it work?

These props?. I was looking at them for my ScarabIII, still need a set actually. hope it works out


http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...d.php?t=168225

I feel for you but waiting 6 months after buying a used product is way to long to complain

I can appreciate that .... but once again do to the circumstances of my situation ..... the props were altered before I received them.
Even if I waited until one of my buddies tried them with their 311 in the spring the out come would have been the same.

Under any other circumstance I would totally agree with you.

I guess I could of sent them to Hydromotive right away ... I just figured they were to much prop for my boat. My buddies have bigger power than I do in their boats.

Jeff

I think you are on to something ..... what about a rating system like ebay's ..... I have no clue what it would intail.

Jeff

You are the man !!!! these are exactly the ones I bought from him.
Now you can understand how pissed I am.

Thanks for finding that thread.

Jeff

In one of our conversations (Ron and I) he told me to sell them .... I said "that is fine and dandy but I am not going to screw someone else knowing these are what they are, my reputation to important to me."

Therefore I went this route to explain my situation and let the "people" decide.....

Jeff

Do they look like they look in the pictures? Do the props that you got apear different? Is it possible that he did not know that they were altered because he purchased them used? I know if it was me I would just take them back and hang them on the wall as I do not feel that chit should roll down hill.

If he has a friend who is AWARE that the props are compromised and are willing to pay 250 for them, and he is willing to cover shipping I would take that deal and chaulk it up to a lesson learned.

I don't think that is totally unfair of him - he found you a buyer and is covering shipping. More than he HAD to do. (Not that I am condoning the original sale of crappy props)

I can see both sides of the story but it has been 6 months and I would be wary if I was the seller.

Yes they did look like the ones in the picture .... therefore I didn't give it a second thought until waiting for the spring to try them on a different boat.
It wasn't until later I decided to send them to Hydromotive since I had some time on my hands .....

I agree with you regarding taking them back hence that is why I didn't offer to re-sell them.

Jeff

I would agree with that if I was aware to .... let me make the decision whether or not i want to purchase altered props like his buddy did.
Why should I take the loss ..... his buddy didn't or Ron for that matter ..... it is not the $250.00 it is the principal at this point.

Jeff

I understand you, and the principal does make it hard to swallow, and hell - $250 dollar loss is still a decent amount of money (at least to me it is), but you'll probably spend more energy being angry over it than just letting them go and getting the props you want and need just in time for the summer. Once you get the right props and the boat runs how you want it to you will forget about this whole crappy episode...

This sucks. Might want to work with Brett at BBlades. You can trial any prop before you buy.

I couldn't agree more .... and thanks for your input.

Jeff

It is possible that he did not know they were bad when he sold them. He reported the same problem that you did - not enough rpms on his boat. Seems like he just assumed they were too big for his boat, just like your initial thought.

At this point, neither of you trusts the other, so maybe selling them for 250 is a good compromise. Still a bad situation though. This sounds like something that would happen to me.

It just plain sucks that people do this to others.

Ditto, we've all had similar things happen once or twice in our boating lives and the best thing to do now is cut your losses and get the right props.
Do it quick before he reads this thread and tells you deal is off.....

Do what? I'm with HeavyP here, what if he bought them that way? I've gotten chitty props right out of the box before. Brand New! Look at the pics. They certainly don't look like they have been hacked. I know that is hard to tell in a pic. But the original poster surely didn't notice. Or he would not have sat on them for 6 months.

Take the $250 and run...

i don't get your problem

His reason for the rpms was his ratio was incorrect he said he was 1:25 and they needed 1:50 to work properly.....
I have 1:50 ratio so I thought this was a no brainer ....

Jeff

I already have the $250.00 for the props.
I have already cut my losses so to speak .... I am just curious
how and other people would have reacted to this situation.
And if not anything else don't let it happen again to someone else.

Jeff

I see your point. I took it on the chin with a prop before. I guess I am to trusting. If they guy wasn't happy and only used the props once and nothing was wrong with them I would take them back.

When I asked him why he didn't want them he replied they are awesome but I just can't get the rpms out of them.
Now if that was the case and he really did try them then he would of surely noticed they were screwed up from the beginning regardless of whether or not he had the right ratio.
The on prop was out by 300-400 rpms compared to the other.
I will take full responsibility for waiting as long as I did ..... but honestly didn't think there was an issue do to the time of the year. Boating was over for the season as far as I was concerned.

Jeff

That is exactly what I think too .... Stand behind what you sell .... if say they are perfect .... then there perfect .... if there not then send them back.

Thanks
Jeff

I don't either.......I mean......the props look fine in the pics, they looked fine when you got them, you tried them and they didn't work right (after 40 minutes.....I would think if something is wrong with a prop you would know if 2 minutes), you waited 6 months, then Hydromotive said they are crap. Are they bent? Are they unbalanced?

Maybe they wanted to sell you an new set of wheels?

To clarifiy where I am ... it takes me approx 15 min. to go out a channel at 5mph and approx 5min of running time and approx. 15 min. of returning time back in the channel to the launch.

Secondly , they weren't bent or even for that matter have any major scratches .... and as I mentioned in the above posts I actually thought it could of been my boat in the beginning. I am obviously not a prop guy or a guy who knows anything about props .... hence why I asked the questions in the beginning that started this whole delima.

I realize that when you buy something espicially used you are at some kind of risk.
When I sent them to Hydromotive all I was trying to rule out was .... was the boat or was it the props ..... and how much to fix them if it was the props.

When I got a responce back from Hydromotive that they were basically junk and impossible to repair them to spec. and the cost would be more then buying new ones
The fact still remains .... someone worked them and it wasn't me .... and I was sold a pair of worked props without this being disclosed to me before I paid for them.

I got little pissed off with the fact "someone" knew these were Fukked up before they were actually sold.

Jeff

....Life is a schit sandwich, but some people got more bread.

Take the 250 and run.

Some people get ripped off way more.

Some people lose a 42 foot boat in the dark of night from inside a locked yard.
250.00 is nothing.
I think that most of us have dropped 250 at the gas dock or bar. Chalk it up to experience.

Oh... and in general... don't trust people on the internet.
Good luck.

KURT'S language
 

Kurt you should be ashamed of yourself using language like that,I'm far too dignified to be reading stuff like this,:D:D

you know, i usually try to stay out of these kinda things but is it really out of the realm of possibility that Moeron did not know there was anything wrong with these props? You had them for six months and i am assuming there is no visible issues. It seems very reasonable that they could have been purchased, tried, and deemed the wrong prop than sold. If i tested a set and they did not perform i would just move on to the next and keep testing props. Also are you sure thats just not to much prop? 24P four blade anything seems a bit tall for a 330hp Merc in an older straight bottom some what heavy boat. tough issue for sure, of which i'm sure there are two sides. Like i said i hope it works out.


Its hard to believe a set of props that look as good as those are junk. What did they say was wrong with them? I have totally crushed props and had them redone. I would expect a manufacturer to steer you towards new ones regardless.

I took in a cleaver to have re-worked that was severely torn up.
The way the prop guy just stared at and looked it over for a few solid minutes (because he couldn't believe how phucked it was) gave me a certain sense of pride when he told me it was scrap.:D

buying anything used is a gamble, i am seriously thinking about buying a hydrohoist and having it shipped out. if it is a piece of **** then i will be out 10k :(

but if it is good then i save 15k :)

Sorry.....maybe "someone" knew, but it wasn't the guy that sold them to you (six months prior!). If I were MOERON, I would be thinking that you screwed them up in the 6 months that you had them. Where's the limit? I mean, what if you tried them like you did, but then didn't figure anything was wrong with them for over a year, or two years?

It doesn't sound like you were ripped off.......but it does sound like an unfortunate situation for both parties. A "ripoff" would be buying something from Trick Marine, paying for it and never getting it.