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Some residents and businesses trying to ban personal watergraft on Lake George, NY

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Old 03-20-2002, 09:45 AM
  #11
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Shane, your PM box still thinks it's full so I will post this here>

OK Shane, let's try this again. Morning to you to. Good Morning is an oxymoron. Snow is good - we need the water. Gotta fill the lake and all.

Every day is one day closer to getting the boat in the water.

Ronie and I would love to spend a weekend sometime this summer. Now if we can just find one we can both agree on. . .

This proposed ban on PWC is ludicrous. I am not a big fan of most PWC OPERATORS but people have to realize (on both sides) that they are boats, just like any other boats, and there are enough laws on the books to regulate their operation. Enforcement should be stepped up if we have a problem. No need to throw the baby out with the bathwater. WHere does this mentality come from that says everything will be perfect if we can just pass enough restrictive laws?

Shooter: I agree with you to an extent. SOMETHING need to be done but I am not in favor of an outright ban. Lake George has probably the highest density of law enforcement per square mile of lake of any large body of water. We have sherriff's departments, State police, Department of Environmental Conservation police and Lake George Park Commission Patrol boats (Shane jump in if I have left any out). The capability already exists to adequately patrol and enforce existing laws. All that is lacking is the will. Many of the landowners around the lake own PWC and use them responsibly. The problem is primarily renters and to a lesser extent, short termers - people who come for a vacation and never bother to learn the local regulation. A couple of years back the local authorities cracked down on the renters and made them responsible for the behavior of their clients. Results: dramatic improvement. They have not continued to pressure the renters and the behavior of the renters has deteriorated. Coupled with ever increasing usage of the lake overall this has resulted in the current climate where some people are starting to see a ban as a resonable solution. I hope we can come up with an alternative because as Jennifer has pointed out, success in one area will only encourage these people to select another target. Guess who will be next?
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Old 03-20-2002, 09:47 AM
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hey Shane,
that's some bad news, I would contact the PWC makers I,m sure they have some literature and some contacts to call, I would have hoped that NY state mandatory certification would have taken care of this, but the time frame is too long I think it is 2004 when all pwc drivers must be certified. Yes hi-performance boats are gonna be next, local businesses would be a good source as well, take a way pwc and take away business type of thing.
They should ban idiots and stupid people.
we have to remember when some one loses a privilege, your privilege might be next.
I will be at Lake George in June for a Donzi get together.
maybe we can have a brew !

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Old 03-20-2002, 09:52 AM
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SHANE.... I wouldn't get to excited... this same BS has been rumored for years.... last year we tried to track this bill down & it was no where to be found.... Problem is Joe Bruno, our beloved Republican Senate Majority leader, and summer resident on LG.... has not come out for or against? Get him to commit one way or another then relax, or panic....
 
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Old 03-20-2002, 09:55 AM
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Laster,

I guess everyones pm box is full. Anyway, let's find a date and make it happen. Great thought process and that is why we formed the Lake George Performance Boat Association, to combat the potential for restriction on high performance boats. Jason Saris is President.

Mattyboy,

Let me know when you are up. Would love to have a drink with you. I know alot of the people in the club. My uncle lives on Greenwood Lake and my parents still live in North Haledon. My uncle lives on the west shore just across teh border into NY. His house sits way up on a hill but he has waterfront property. His name is Jerry Wilson. Do you know him? He owns Haledon Auto Parts.

Sunseeker,

Thanks for the advice. We'll get right on it.

Remember, PWC's do not do any damage or problems in and of themselves. It is the IRRESPONSIBLE OPERATORS that cause the problem!
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Old 03-20-2002, 10:00 AM
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GRH, does the LGPC have the authority to do this unilateraly?

Shane, I joined the LGPBA when it was formed but never received any sort of renewal info. Should I talk to Jason when I am up?
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Old 03-20-2002, 10:01 AM
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No Shane I don't know him, he must live on Jersey ave or lake shore road, but if your down this way drop an email to me and a Donzi ride and drinks will be arranged.

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Old 03-20-2002, 10:07 AM
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Shane:

Start right here -

Joseph L. Bruno, 43rd District, 909 Legislative Office Building
Albany, New York 12247, 518-455-3191

368 Broadway
Saratoga Springs, NY 12866
518-583-1001

[email protected]

A complete list of all the NY State Senators is also on this site
http://www.senate.state.ny.us/
as well as the Governor and other officials and links and e-mail addresses to all public agencies.

Again, good luck.

Jennifer
 
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Old 03-20-2002, 10:08 AM
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Ok let me clarify,

I'm not into any ban and yes they are boats (sort of). The problems we see here are also "transients" towing down from our equivalent of the "valley". We call them Bennies here. I also ride right past Big Red Kawasaki (I still have a red Kawi - geez I'm getting old) with the PWC boxes stacked 10 high and deep. that sell directly to these guys and a few locals - you think they are educating them? I cringe.

Here, we have hardly any marine enforcement, everytime I see them, they have a PWC pulled over, we are overrun. The cops never patrol the ramp and the PWCs hold "races" in our end of the river buzzing the owners docks and waking everything out - with "No WAke" posted everywhere. I'd love to run at speed up the river, it would shorten my trip to the ocean, but I have respect for fellow homeowners equipment and property. Sorry guys, but there is a known [email protected]#$ You attitude that PWCrs have around here. This is why I built a fixed pier dock with a lift - no floaters, they get abused. What can we do? Hey, I actually thought of buying one once again. But my distaste for them has grown.

Again, what are we to do? Keep yelling "enforcement" when we simply don't have the resources? Hell, I'd love enforcement, for idiot boaters too for that matter. How about hefty $1000.00 fines that most people who own PWCs can't afford anyway? Again back to enforcement. Would I be willing to spend +200.00 bucks to register my boat every year so that we can hire more marine police to chase these idiots around? That won't fly either.

Unfortunately what we are witnessing is the laws of economics and influence at work. I boat, pay huge waterfront property taxes (which I don't mind sharing), etc. Yeah, I'd like the ability to own a PWC, but in the priority of things...

Here is where I throw it back to you guys who own these things. Want to change my opinion? Here's what, let me know what you guys do within your sport to address the common problems. I often see this topic come up on the board (5th or 6th time I think) and I see anger outward towards enforcment, homeowners, or boaters. How about some of that directed at your own ranks.

I think they are fun as all hell, change our minds...
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Old 03-20-2002, 10:31 AM
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It all comes down to "personal Responsibilty" operating any motorized vehicle takes care and resposibilty.
My buddy has lake front prop. and has 2 pwc's he also has to small kids, when you visit the pwc are yours to take ,AFTER he gives the do's and don'ts, along with a quick ride along before he lets you loose, and it you mess up or fool around no more pwc rides as driver you go to the back! but I can rent them, here's the keys be back in an hour! It is also the way they are marketed, do you see the guys in the commercials riding conservatively. NO way, they're tearing it up, jumping waves,going nuts.
I believe in all boaters having a license or certification for all forms of boats, sail,pwc,ski/runabout,hi-po and if you mess-up you lose the privilege.
It is very similar to the ski-snow board contraversy, first they were not welcome at all, then they had special areas, now they are along side skiers, this was more an economic factor for the ski areas to include them but thru rules and inclusion ski/snowboard are ok with each other.
there are aHoles in boats too! sometimes just cause they can afford it! let me see for my first boat gimme that 22 ft with the 400hp engine.
I have no problem with any type of boat as long as the OPERATOR uses care and common sense.
Ban idiots and jerks!

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Old 03-20-2002, 10:35 AM
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Shooter


Again, what are we to do? Keep yelling "enforcement" when we simply don't have the resources? Hell, I'd love enforcement, for idiot boaters too for that matter. How about hefty $1000.00 fines that most people who own PWCs can't afford anyway? Again back to enforcement. Would I be willing to spend +200.00 bucks to register my boat every year so that we can hire more marine police to chase these idiots around? That won't fly either.


Here is where I throw it back to you guys who own these things. Want to change my opinion? Here's what, let me know what you guys do within your sport to address the common problems.
[/QUOTE

How about this idea for the PWC owners who couldn't afford a $1000.00 fine - impound the boat for 30 days.

I, too think the more needs to be done within the PWC community.

I don't disagree that you have a major problem with PWC in your area. However, it is dangerous to generalize. The problem on Lake George is really minor compared to what you are describing. Our problem is we are dealing with an organized group who really want to return to the days of sail boats and wood power boats. We have to be constantly on guard against efforts to restrict us off the lake with draconian speed and noise restrictions. My point is please don't assume that your experiences with PWC are the norm here and make recommendations for US based on them. What is necessary to adequately address the problem in your area may be drastic overkill for us.
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