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-   -   Whipple 600sci upgrade documentation (https://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/general-boating-discussion/220230-whipple-600sci-upgrade-documentation.html)

gnorthga 12-05-2009 11:03 AM


Originally Posted by CB-BLR (Post 3001143)
The smartcraft wants to see between 30-50 psi at wot. If water pressure drops below 28 psi, with the motor being over 4800 rpm, guardian will kick in.

If you are having water pressure issues on either a 600 or 700, contact Dustin directly... he has fixes for this.

Chris

What is the statis on your project?

Sorry about taking over your thread, but you have helped me with a lot of questions

Thank you!

aTX427 12-05-2009 11:14 AM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001164)
Were the motors over heating?

No issues with overheating, because the pressure was within the design limits at let's say 20psi at 4,000rpm's, but as soon as the power increases over 4,200 the buzzer's went off because the engine went into guardian mode. I suppose there would have been overheating problems if the warning did not occur, but keep in mind that my engines are stock.

CB-BLR 12-05-2009 01:57 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001170)
What is the statis on your project?

Sorry about taking over your thread, but you have helped me with a lot of questions

Thank you!

You are welcome,

The motor should be running on the dyno sometime late monday. Dustin had to custom fabricate some parts.

Chris

CB-BLR 12-05-2009 02:01 PM


Originally Posted by aTX427 (Post 3001172)
The water pressure errors Dustin mentioned in his previous post have nothing whatsoever to do with his calibration. They are hard coded into the PCM from Mercury.

Dustin has the ability to change this calibration in the PCM... but it is probably not a good idea as opposed to fixing the water flow/pressure issues.

Chris

Whipple Charged 12-05-2009 02:46 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001061)
What kind of water pressure do you want to see

Do you agree that keeping the same props will keep some of the load of the NXT

Minimum 28psi @ 4800rpm, ideally like to see 32-35 @ 5200+.

Yes, same props will lessen load on the NXT and in the end, will be the quickest and fastest.

aTX427 12-06-2009 11:28 AM


Originally Posted by CB-BLR (Post 3001258)
Dustin has the ability to change this calibration in the PCM... but it is probably not a good idea as opposed to fixing the water flow/pressure issues.

Chris

Agreed

gnorthga 12-06-2009 11:43 AM


Originally Posted by Whipple Charged (Post 3001275)
Minimum 28psi @ 4800rpm, ideally like to see 32-35 @ 5200+.

Yes, same props will lessen load on the NXT and in the end, will be the quickest and fastest.

Are you saying the boat will excelerate quicker and have more
MPH with stock 6 blade harrings?

gnorthga 12-06-2009 12:02 PM

Do I have to do a pulley change and what is retail on the stage ? Kits
how much HP & torque will I have?

CB-BLR 12-06-2009 12:31 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001630)
Do I have to do a pulley change and what is retail on the stage ? Kits
how much HP & torque will I have?

On the 700sci Stages I & II:

PCM re-program
Water re-route

No pulley change on Stage I - 780 hp
Pulley change on Stage II - 830 hp

You will have to contact Dustin directly for pricing.

Chris

Coolerman 12-06-2009 12:59 PM


Originally Posted by aTX427 (Post 3001618)
Agreed - I have my pressure issues worked out. It was a rigging issue.

What about other people with the same boat? There are a fair number of fountains (38's, 42's) with 700's......... Fountain didn't help at all or get their chit together?

gnorthga 12-06-2009 04:16 PM


Originally Posted by Whipple Charged (Post 3001275)
Minimum 28psi @ 4800rpm, ideally like to see 32-35 @ 5200+.

Yes, same props will lessen load on the NXT and in the end, will be the quickest and fastest.


Originally Posted by CB-BLR (Post 3001643)
On the 700sci:

No pulley change on Stage I - 780 hp
Pulley change on Stage II - 830 hp

You will have to contact Dustin directly for pricing.

Chris

U think I need the pully

CB-BLR 12-06-2009 04:32 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001737)
U think I need the pully

Who doesn't want more horsepower?
This is an easy addition.

With your #6 drives... I would think this would be a no-brainer.

Chris

gnorthga 12-06-2009 08:14 PM


Originally Posted by CB-BLR (Post 3001746)
Who doesn't want more horsepower?
This is an easy addition.

With your #6 drives... I would think this would be a no-brainer.

Chris

Well! I was hoping u say that
Thanks for all the help
I can't think of anything else I need 2ask

gnorthga 12-06-2009 08:30 PM


Originally Posted by Whipple Charged (Post 3001275)
Minimum 28psi @ 4800rpm, ideally like to see 32-35 @ 5200+.

Yes, same props will lessen load on the NXT and in the end, will be the quickest and fastest.

How much is to much water pressure

Bullhead 12-06-2009 08:35 PM


Originally Posted by Whipple Charged (Post 3000947)
I really don't know of anyone that's had any problems. We've had a few with water psi issues, but that was the same as stock. So there is no negative feedback to speak of.

Mark knows his stuff for sure!

What is the difference in hp gain between the PCM and pulley upgrade vs the PCM, pulley and cam upgrade?

CB-BLR 12-06-2009 10:05 PM


Originally Posted by Bullhead (Post 3001885)
What is the difference in hp gain between the PCM and pulley upgrade vs the PCM, pulley and cam upgrade?

We should know that here shortly.

Chris

CB-BLR 12-06-2009 10:07 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001880)
How much is to much water pressure

Merc says that over 50 psi at WOT is too much water pressure.

Chris

gnorthga 12-06-2009 10:15 PM


Originally Posted by Bullhead (Post 3001885)
What is the difference in hp gain between the PCM and pulley upgrade vs the PCM, pulley and cam upgrade?

Does your BoAt havE 1075?

aTX427 12-07-2009 12:24 AM


Originally Posted by saxman (Post 3001650)
What about other people with the same boat? There are a fair number of fountains (38's, 42's) with 700's......... Fountain didn't help at all or get their chit together?

Every boat is different. The Fountain factory was very helpful even out of warranty.

aTX427 12-07-2009 12:29 AM

It is a lot eaiser to go with more boost than changing the cam, but I will probably do cams, pushrods, lifters, springs and head gaskets at 250.

Beak Boater 12-07-2009 06:38 AM


Originally Posted by saxman (Post 3001650)
What about other people with the same boat? There are a fair number of fountains (38's, 42's) with 700's......... Fountain didn't help at all or get their chit together?

Sorry to hear about your water problems. Our 38/700 has never had any water pressure issues, have owned it 3 years. Their are also 2 other 42/700 boats that were bought last spring in our area that dont have them either. Glad you got it worked out.

Bullhead 12-07-2009 09:48 AM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001951)
Does your BoAt havE 1075?

I have 700's....the boat in my avatar,Saratoga Stampede, has 1075's (for now)

Bullhead 12-07-2009 09:56 AM


Originally Posted by aTX427 (Post 3001987)
It is a lot eaiser to go with more boost than changing the cam, but I will probably do cams, pushrods, lifters, springs and head gaskets at 250.

Cool....sounds like a more reliable upgrade than just adding boost....are you going to Dyno?

Whipple Charged 12-07-2009 01:26 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3001880)
How much is to much water pressure

50psi IMO

gnorthga 12-07-2009 02:34 PM


Originally Posted by aTX427 (Post 3001987)
It is a lot eaiser to go with more boost than changing the cam, but I will probably do cams, pushrods, lifters, springs and head gaskets at 250.

ARE WE TALKING ABOUT A 600 OR 700 MOTOR?

Whipple Charged 12-07-2009 06:10 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3002236)
ARE WE TALKING ABOUT A 600 OR 700 MOTOR?

This would be the 600, although were working on a camshaft change for the 700 too :)

Back4More 12-07-2009 06:19 PM

we're pushing the limits of the bottom end?

aTX427 12-08-2009 10:40 AM

Everything is forged, they have blower pistons and rings gapped for boost.

Back4More 12-08-2009 12:20 PM

I mean't the block...

Whipple Charged 12-08-2009 01:45 PM


Originally Posted by Back4More (Post 3002736)
I mean't the block...

Made 1000hp on those blocks for years with zero issues. Now if you had a big roots on there and tried to make 1000hp, thats different. Zero issues with the block.

Back4More 12-08-2009 02:54 PM

good

gnorthga 12-10-2009 07:47 PM

Well I guess we have got all the anwsers we needed from this excellent thread

Well what is up with your Motor, what kind of power are you making

We are all waiting,

Show us those dino sheets

CB-BLR 12-11-2009 12:22 AM

Some of the fabrication of parts for mounting the 4.0 took longer than anticipated at the Whipple compound.

The engine is back together and on the dyno.
They are in the process of re-programming the PCM for the new cam, and we should have the numbers soon.

Chris

gnorthga 12-11-2009 05:18 AM


Originally Posted by CB-BLR (Post 3004218)
Some of the fabrication of parts for mounting the 4.0 took longer than anticipated at the Whipple compound.

The engine is back together and on the dyno.
They are in the process of re-programming the PCM for the new cam, and we should have the numbers soon.

Chris

Are you using a sportmaster 2" shorty with your scx?

29scarab10 12-11-2009 07:22 AM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3004231)
Are you using a sportmaster 2" shorty with your scx?

Nordic heats do not need shortys. The hot rod bunch around here us standard or a standard with a spacer.
Allen

CB-BLR 12-11-2009 10:04 AM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3004231)
Are you using a sportmaster 2" shorty with your scx?

Standard length Imco SC lower.

I have done a LOT of testing, and my boat likes either no spacer, with a Hydromotive P5x, or a 1/2 inch spacer with a Merc Lab prop.
Below about 80 mph, the boat likes a 1 inch spacer.
With the old Whipple stage II on my 600sci, my boat did a consistant 92 mph with a best of 93.3 mph.

Chris

gnorthga 12-11-2009 06:44 PM


Originally Posted by 29scarab10 (Post 3004258)
Nordic heats do not need shortys. The hot rod bunch around here us standard or a standard with a spacer.
Allen

Thank you Allen that is one boat I really don't know anything about

gnorthga 12-11-2009 06:48 PM


Originally Posted by CB-BLR (Post 3004329)
Standard length Imco SC lower.

I have done a LOT of testing, and my boat likes either no spacer, with a Hydromotive P5x, or a 1/2 inch spacer with a Merc Lab prop.
Below about 80 mph, the boat likes a 1 inch spacer.
With the old Whipple stage II on my 600sci, my boat did a consistant 92 mph with a best of 93.3 mph.

Chris

My real question is why did you chose not to go with the scx lower?

Did you change the vertical shaft or use the cupler
to connect the standard imco lower

CB-BLR 12-11-2009 07:46 PM


Originally Posted by gnorthga (Post 3004589)
My real question is why did you chose not to go with the scx lower?

Did you change the vertical shaft or use the cupler
to connect the standard imco lower

I choose to retain my SC lower at IMCO's recommendation. They recommend using the SC lower on v-bottom boats, or boats that do not run the lower unit in full surfacing mode. With the lowers submerged (mine is 3.5" below the keel), the SC lower is faster than the SCX lower.

I swapped out the vertical shaft in my SC lower to a conversion shaft that IMCO makes for this purpose.

Chris

CB-BLR 12-12-2009 01:41 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Performance update:

Dustin is working dilligently on the re-programing of the Smartcraft PCM. Due to its individual cylinder ignition and fuel curve programs... this is quite a time consuming process... especially with a cam that is radically different than the original 600sci or 700sci cams.

As of last nite (9 pm), the motor is making 850 hp at 5900 rpm with 10 lbs of boost.

This is with the new cam, and the 4.0 supercharger.

Timing curves, fuel curves, and boost have not been finalized... Dustin thinks there might be more in there, and will continue to work on it.

After this round of testing, and finalization of the PCM program, Dustin will bolt the 3.3 back on and get it dialed in with the new cam.

Chris


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