|
I had a long article in response to post #32 above in this thread all written up and ready to post, when I discovered the letter of Miss G(#34). After reading it, I didnīt feel like talking about the difference between classical mechanics and fluid thermodynamics any more (and the AGT 1500 is especially complex, due to its preheater and its scroll combustion chamber. But well...). Instead, I printed out Miss Gīs article or should I say manifest?- and thought about it for a long time. And then came last weekend and the unlimited hydros were running in Doha for the Oryx Cup, and I was in such a good mood that I didnīt want to spoil it by posting to this forum.
First of all I should admit that I too am among those who hadnīt even noticed that Miss G had slowed down all year long. And how could I? The live video cameras and the race commentators pay so little attention to Miss G (Miss Geico is running her own race), that I actually would have had to compare their lap times in oreder to discover it. And itīs a good thing that I didnīt discover it, because otherwise I would have ended up all confused and thinking that physics doesnīt work any more. But Miss G is of course entitled to call me a bad student of offshore racing. At any rate, the Geico team appears to me like Kung-Fu fighters among a horde of Viking warriers:
Originally Posted by MissGeicoRacing
(Post 3549209)
We've been around the offshore course a time or two and have to deal with all the macho I'm a big bad boat racer/poker runner,I love the big water, listen to me roar crap.
Originally Posted by MissGeicoRacing
(Post 3549209)
It's easy to bash the yellow boat because we test we practise we go out of our way to accomodate and take the high road when confronted by jealous racers, bullies (no pun intended), gossip, backstabbers and adversity.
Now if they tuned down their engines in hopes to get a chance to compete with other boats, I would consider this as a rather desperate measure. I see their downtuning as a sacrifice they made for their sport, trying to somehow fit in. But the worst thing is, that they did that ALL SEASON LONG, and nobody (including myself) even took notice of it. Boy, must that have been frustrating for them! I hope that they at least could laugh once in a while about their tragicomical situation. But in distinction to others, this tactic of theirs and its outcome has not served to instill any hope for the future in me. They believe that they are the future, and I wish I could believe the same. But if they believe that, then they probably also believe in the continuous progress of our society. And that I certainly donīt believe any more. Because history has clearly shown that progress is not continuous, but comes and goes (most notorious is the decline of the Roman Empire, followed by 1000 years of the (dark) Middle Ages). I had already touched on nothing but the technological aspect of this in another thread, at http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ml#post3545628 . As an anthropologist and neuroscientist I could say much about the irrational nature of our species, and as a sociologist about the retaining forces of customs and traditions. And I do have reasons to believe that at present we are on a cultural downgrade again. But all of this would only serve to discourage Miss G, and that is exactly the last thing I want to do here. I am just afraid that on top of their troubles with the turbine class, they are also running against the trend of our times.So here I have another reason for leaving this forum (see below). As far as a tendency of race boats getting quieter is concerned, I would like to know more about these Gasse Merc 1350 boats and have googled for them, but couldnīt find anything. And far as CMS is concerned, I onnly found something about marine wastewater recycling systems. On the other hand, I hear that kids of today that are into airplanes prefer jets over propeller planes. This is what has motivated the organizers of the Reno Air Races to introduce the jet class, according to an interview I saw. And they say that it was a success. And kids seem to love the Miss Geico, because she just looks so cool (better not tell them that she is going slow, because they wouldnīt understand it). So maybe what it will take to get the turbine class off the ground is for the old farts to fade away and a new generation to take their place. Meanwhile, if I were Jeff (JBS) I would stop crying and get my ass over to the Geico workshop tomorrow or next weekend at the latest and ask for advice (teach me to race Iīd say, and I know they wouldnīt let me down). And among other things they would probably tell me to throw out my flame throwers, get a working and decent website (above all: no racing schedule of last year!) and look for sponsors advertising myself as a PROFESSIONAL RACE TEAM (We are a proffessional team pushing the limits with safety and performance... etc..). After all, who wants to sponsor a bunch of clowns? Nobody. I cannot see any reason why the Geico receipe should not work for other teams as well if they are willing to take the trouble. And after they have taught me how to dust them, I would attribute my victory to my teachers (logically, since it would be true). And in parting, I would just like to say one thing about boats like Big Thunder: The heavier the untrimmed overload in the stern of a race boat, the easier it is going to flip. Sounds logical, doesnīt it? So if it must be pistons, why not use two-strokers? After all, they have twice the power to weight ratio as do four-strokers (Wankels would be even better). But well, never mind: I know that technical fine points are not popular among Viking warriers.
Originally Posted by MissGeicoRacing
(Post 3549209)
Those that are stirring this thread really don't follow offshore they are just looking for controversy..
So in order to not be incoherent, my admiration for Miss Geico obliges me to leave this forum now. They are far more noble than I am, perhaps due to their unconditional love for offshore racing. But as it turns out, the yellow boat had lured me to a place where I really shouldnīt be. So moderator, you can eliminate my account. Good bye and all the luck in the world to you, Miss G. Peter |
Originally Posted by Turbofan
(Post 3554603)
I had a long article in response to post #32 above in this thread all written up and ready to post, when I discovered the letter of Miss G(#34). After reading it, I didnīt feel like talking about the difference between classical mechanics and fluid thermodynamics any more (and the AGT 1500 is especially complex, due to its preheater and its scroll combustion chamber. But well...). Instead, I printed out Miss Gīs article or should I say manifest?- and thought about it for a long time. And then came last weekend and the unlimited hydros were running in Doha for the Oryx Cup, and I was in such a good mood that I didnīt want to spoil it by posting to this forum.
First of all I should admit that I too am among those who hadnīt even noticed that Miss G had slowed down all year long. And how could I? The live video cameras and the race commentators pay so little attention to Miss G (Miss Geico is running her own race), that I actually would have had to compare their lap times in oreder to discover it. And itīs a good thing that I didnīt discover it, because otherwise I would have ended up all confused and thinking that physics doesnīt work any more. But Miss G is of course entitled to call me a bad student of offshore racing. At any rate, the Geico team appears to me like Kung-Fu fighters among a horde of Viking warriers: What Miss G is apparently trying to do, is to introduce sophistication into a sport, which is pervaded by an essentially barbarian spirit. And here they do have a problem: They do not only love offshore racing, but they also love advanced technology. And on a scene dominated by farter crazy (pardon: I know they like BBīs, but I donīt) Viking warriers they are bound to run against a concrete wall with that latter love of theirs. Now if they tuned down their engines in hopes to get a chance to compete with other boats, I would consider this as a rather desperate measure. I see their downtuning as a sacrifice they made for their sport, trying to somehow fit in. But the worst thing is, that they did that ALL SEASON LONG, and nobody (including myself) even took notice of it. Boy, must that have been frustrating for them! I hope that they at least could laugh once in a while about their tragicomical situation. But in distinction to others, this tactic of theirs and its outcome has not served to instill any hope for the future in me. They believe that they are the future, and I wish I could believe the same. But if they believe that, then they probably also believe in the continuous progress of our society. And that I certainly donīt believe any more. Because history has clearly shown that progress is not continuous, but comes and goes (most notorious is the decline of the Roman Empire, followed by 1000 years of the (dark) Middle Ages). I had already touched on nothing but the technological aspect of this in another thread, at http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ml#post3545628 . As an anthropologist and neuroscientist I could say much about the irrational nature of our species, and as a sociologist about the retaining forces of customs and traditions. And I do have reasons to believe that at present we are on a cultural downgrade again. But all of this would only serve to discourage Miss G, and that is exactly the last thing I want to do here. I am just afraid that on top of their troubles with the turbine class, they are also running against the trend of our times.So here I have another reason for leaving this forum (see below). As far as a tendency of race boats getting quieter is concerned, I would like to know more about these Gasse Merc 1350 boats and have googled for them, but couldnīt find anything. And far as CMS is concerned, I onnly found something about marine wastewater recycling systems. On the other hand, I hear that kids of today that are into airplanes prefer jets over propeller planes. This is what has motivated the organizers of the Reno Air Races to introduce the jet class, according to an interview I saw. And they say that it was a success. And kids seem to love the Miss Geico, because she just looks so cool (better not tell them that she is going slow, because they wouldnīt understand it). So maybe what it will take to get the turbine class off the ground is for the old farts to fade away and a new generation to take their place. Meanwhile, if I were Jeff (JBS) I would stop crying and get my ass over to the Geico workshop tomorrow or next weekend at the latest and ask for advice (teach me to race Iīd say, and I know they wouldnīt let me down). And among other things they would probably tell me to throw out my flame throwers, get a working and decent website (above all: no racing schedule of last year!) and look for sponsors advertising myself as a PROFESSIONAL RACE TEAM (We are a proffessional team pushing the limits with safety and performance... etc..). After all, who wants to sponsor a bunch of clowns? Nobody. I cannot see any reason why the Geico receipe should not work for other teams as well if they are willing to take the trouble. And after they have taught me how to dust them, I would attribute my victory to my teachers (logically, since it would be true). And in parting, I would just like to say one thing about boats like Big Thunder: The heavier the untrimmed overload in the stern of a race boat, the easier it is going to flip. Sounds logical, doesnīt it? So if it must be pistons, why not use two-strokers? After all, they have twice the power to weight ratio as do four-strokers (Wankels would be even better). But well, never mind: I know that technical fine points are not popular among Viking warriers. It is true that I have been stirring up this thread, and I have already admitted to be a bad student of offshore racing. And yes, I have been looking for controversy because the old farts here just make me puke. So in order to not be incoherent, my admiration for Miss Geico obliges me to leave this forum now. They are far more noble than I am, perhaps due to their unconditional love for offshore racing. But as it turns out, the yellow boat had lured me to a place where I really shouldnīt be. So moderator, you can eliminate my account. Good bye and all the luck in the world to you, Miss G. Peter |
Originally Posted by Turbofan
(Post 3554603)
I had a long article in response to post #32 above in this thread all written up and ready to post, when I discovered the letter of Miss G(#34). After reading it, I didnīt feel like talking about the difference between classical mechanics and fluid thermodynamics any more (and the AGT 1500 is especially complex, due to its preheater and its scroll combustion chamber. But well...). Instead, I printed out Miss Gīs article or should I say manifest?- and thought about it for a long time. And then came last weekend and the unlimited hydros were running in Doha for the Oryx Cup, and I was in such a good mood that I didnīt want to spoil it by posting to this forum.
First of all I should admit that I too am among those who hadnīt even noticed that Miss G had slowed down all year long. And how could I? The live video cameras and the race commentators pay so little attention to Miss G (Miss Geico is running her own race), that I actually would have had to compare their lap times in oreder to discover it. And itīs a good thing that I didnīt discover it, because otherwise I would have ended up all confused and thinking that physics doesnīt work any more. But Miss G is of course entitled to call me a bad student of offshore racing. At any rate, the Geico team appears to me like Kung-Fu fighters among a horde of Viking warriers: What Miss G is apparently trying to do, is to introduce sophistication into a sport, which is pervaded by an essentially barbarian spirit. And here they do have a problem: They do not only love offshore racing, but they also love advanced technology. And on a scene dominated by farter crazy (pardon: I know they like BBīs, but I donīt) Viking warriers they are bound to run against a concrete wall with that latter love of theirs. Now if they tuned down their engines in hopes to get a chance to compete with other boats, I would consider this as a rather desperate measure. I see their downtuning as a sacrifice they made for their sport, trying to somehow fit in. But the worst thing is, that they did that ALL SEASON LONG, and nobody (including myself) even took notice of it. Boy, must that have been frustrating for them! I hope that they at least could laugh once in a while about their tragicomical situation. But in distinction to others, this tactic of theirs and its outcome has not served to instill any hope for the future in me. They believe that they are the future, and I wish I could believe the same. But if they believe that, then they probably also believe in the continuous progress of our society. And that I certainly donīt believe any more. Because history has clearly shown that progress is not continuous, but comes and goes (most notorious is the decline of the Roman Empire, followed by 1000 years of the (dark) Middle Ages). I had already touched on nothing but the technological aspect of this in another thread, at http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ml#post3545628 . As an anthropologist and neuroscientist I could say much about the irrational nature of our species, and as a sociologist about the retaining forces of customs and traditions. And I do have reasons to believe that at present we are on a cultural downgrade again. But all of this would only serve to discourage Miss G, and that is exactly the last thing I want to do here. I am just afraid that on top of their troubles with the turbine class, they are also running against the trend of our times.So here I have another reason for leaving this forum (see below). As far as a tendency of race boats getting quieter is concerned, I would like to know more about these Gasse Merc 1350 boats and have googled for them, but couldnīt find anything. And far as CMS is concerned, I onnly found something about marine wastewater recycling systems. On the other hand, I hear that kids of today that are into airplanes prefer jets over propeller planes. This is what has motivated the organizers of the Reno Air Races to introduce the jet class, according to an interview I saw. And they say that it was a success. And kids seem to love the Miss Geico, because she just looks so cool (better not tell them that she is going slow, because they wouldnīt understand it). So maybe what it will take to get the turbine class off the ground is for the old farts to fade away and a new generation to take their place. Meanwhile, if I were Jeff (JBS) I would stop crying and get my ass over to the Geico workshop tomorrow or next weekend at the latest and ask for advice (teach me to race Iīd say, and I know they wouldnīt let me down). And among other things they would probably tell me to throw out my flame throwers, get a working and decent website (above all: no racing schedule of last year!) and look for sponsors advertising myself as a PROFESSIONAL RACE TEAM (We are a proffessional team pushing the limits with safety and performance... etc..). After all, who wants to sponsor a bunch of clowns? Nobody. I cannot see any reason why the Geico receipe should not work for other teams as well if they are willing to take the trouble. And after they have taught me how to dust them, I would attribute my victory to my teachers (logically, since it would be true). And in parting, I would just like to say one thing about boats like Big Thunder: The heavier the untrimmed overload in the stern of a race boat, the easier it is going to flip. Sounds logical, doesnīt it? So if it must be pistons, why not use two-strokers? After all, they have twice the power to weight ratio as do four-strokers (Wankels would be even better). But well, never mind: I know that technical fine points are not popular among Viking warriers. It is true that I have been stirring up this thread, and I have already admitted to be a bad student of offshore racing. And yes, I have been looking for controversy because the old farts here just make me puke. So in order to not be incoherent, my admiration for Miss Geico obliges me to leave this forum now. They are far more noble than I am, perhaps due to their unconditional love for offshore racing. But as it turns out, the yellow boat had lured me to a place where I really shouldnīt be. So moderator, you can eliminate my account. Good bye and all the luck in the world to you, Miss G. Peter Nice post!!! :drink::drink: |
Originally Posted by BUIZILLA
(Post 3550396)
exactly.... Bill would have stopped the race, and any further scheduled racing next year, until things get sorted out, guidelines are established, and standards are in place....
IMO, a Promoter has a legal and moral obligation to look after his racers FIRST, if 3 racers died in a NASCAR Sprint Cup, Nationwide, or ARCA race the same week does anyone here really think something wouldn't be done? This IS the World Series of boat racing right? There's no reason not to have World Class Safety IMO, JC should step up and lead this parade, or step aside.. it's not all about the Benjamin's You are so right. I have been waiting a week for someone to come out and state what was so obvious to me. Thank you !! Bob |
My perspective on competitive racing and the forefront of technology...Miss G has amassed years of data which was afford them through hard work and dedication and $$$. The problem is, for other teams to become competitive from scratch is possible but unrealistic, unless they have long long resources(unlikely today). Naturally dedicated hardworking racers (MissG)extend their hands out to fellow racers who need help in the spirit of creating a competitive race field resulting in less than lack luster results . I seen this scenario before and numerous times the classes folded and org's also failed, due to lack of competition which drew less spectators thus less sponsors resulting in less $$$.
Is it fair to MissG team to share their data acquired with competitors bc teams dont have the money or the dedication and $$ to bridge the gap??? It seems MissG Team is going to have to package their turbine program into an affordable(can affordable and turbine coincide in the same sentence??) and maintainable package where they can through their Team's hard work create a competitive turbine class? I dont expect them to hand out their privacy data so this is a possible option for them to be partially reimbursed for the $$ investment they made into the sport while ensuring the future of turbine racing.( No $$ can make up for their personal dedication just to be clear--thats whats makes people of a racing breed) Although I dont know where offshore racing is headed, this could be the future for Team Yellow Boat Miss G.!! Noone in the right mind should expect them to to remove the turbines! |
[QUOTE=Turbofan;3554603]I had a long article in response to post #32 above in this thread all written up and ready to post, when I discovered the letter of Miss G(#34). After reading it, I didnīt feel like talking about the difference between classical mechanics and fluid thermodynamics any more (and the AGT 1500 is especially complex, due to its preheater and its scroll combustion chamber.
http://www.honeywell.com/sites/aero/...165D399CBF.htm This turbine has been in the Abrams US Army tank since 1976 and has proven to be very reliable. It isn't as much rocket science as you imply. High school graduates with Army training and tools maintain this turbine 24/7. ed |
Originally Posted by MissGeicoRacing
(Post 3554708)
Please dont go.
Originally Posted by kilrbusa
(Post 3554954)
It seems MissG Team is going to have to package their turbine program into an affordable(can affordable and turbine coincide in the same sentence??) and maintainable package where they can through their Team's hard work create a competitive turbine class?
I dont expect them to hand out their privacy data so this is a possible option for them to be partially reimbursed for the $$ investment they made into the sport while ensuring the future of turbine racing. But your post inspired me to think along the lines of a much less risky project, which could nevertheless mean lots of fun (and work): The principal asset of Miss Geico Racing is their know how. And what better package is there for selling know how than - a book? So what I am thinking or phantasizing about is The Guide to Turbine Offshore Racing by M. Granet, S. Begovich, G. Stray, G. Goodell, J. Kapala and G. Slogar et al. i.e. whoever is willing and deemed competent enough to contribute (and how about a foreword by John Arruda? It always looks good to invite someone else for that). It should contain a general introduction to the sport and its history, an overview of internal combustion engines and their characteristics with a special emphasis on gas turbines and their peculiarities, chapters on dos and donīts in building a race team, selecting equipment on the market, etc.. One of the most important chapters would of course be on how to find a sponsor. The book should contain many pretty photos and good drawings, and be able to transmit the necessary technical information without becoming dry. This might perhaps be achieved by spicing it with anecdotical tidbits. But most of all, it should transmit the excitement of offshore racing and awaken interest in technologically inclined people (thatīs where the turbines come in). So it might well also contain a purely anecdotical part at the end. Anything that helps to make it lively. And why should it not at the end- mention the youth and the problems of the turbine class, and that it is a wide open field? At any rate, the authors should encourage the readers to get into contact with them in case they have any open questions. Even though I am not an offshore racer, if such a book were well made, I would certainly count among its potential buyers. And perhaps someday somebody with the right stuff (money included) would find it in a marine bookstore... So if the turbine class doesnīt exist, why not pretend it does? |
But your post inspired me to think along the lines of a much less risky project, which could nevertheless mean lots of fun (and work):
The principal asset of Miss Geico Racing is their know how. And what better package is there for selling know how than - a book? So what I am thinking or phantasizing about is “The Guide to Turbine Offshore Racing” by M. Granet, S. Begovich, G. Stray, G. Goodell, J. Kapala and G. Slogar et al. –i.e. whoever is willing and deemed competent enough to contribute (and how about a foreword by John Arruda? It always looks good to invite someone else for that). It should contain a general introduction to the sport and its history, an overview of internal combustion engines and their characteristics with a special emphasis on gas turbines and their peculiarities, chapters on dos and donīts in building a race team, selecting equipment on the market, etc.. One of the most important chapters would of course be on how to find a sponsor. The book should contain many pretty photos and good drawings, and be able to transmit the necessary technical information without becoming dry. This might perhaps be achieved by spicing it with anecdotical tidbits. But most of all, it should transmit the excitement of offshore racing and awaken interest in technologically inclined people (thatīs where the turbines come in). So it might well also contain a purely anecdotical part at the end. Anything that helps to make it lively. And why should it not –at the end- mention the youth and the problems of the turbine class, and that it is a wide open field? At any rate, the authors should encourage the readers to get into contact with them in case they have any open questions. Great idea! (BTW turbofan I'm glad you decided to stick around. Turbines need all the good press they can get. Just don't expect JBS to go groveling to MGR; not gonna happen). |
But your post inspired me to think along the lines of a much less risky project, which could nevertheless mean lots of fun (and work):
The principal asset of Miss Geico Racing is their know how. And what better package is there for selling know how than - a book? So what I am thinking or phantasizing about is The Guide to Turbine Offshore Racing by M. Granet, S. Begovich, G. Stray, G. Goodell, J. Kapala and G. Slogar et al. i.e. whoever is willing and deemed competent enough to contribute (and how about a foreword by John Arruda? It always looks good to invite someone else for that). It should contain a general introduction to the sport and its history, an overview of internal combustion engines and their characteristics with a special emphasis on gas turbines and their peculiarities, chapters on dos and donīts in building a race team, selecting equipment on the market, etc.. One of the most important chapters would of course be on how to find a sponsor. The book should contain many pretty photos and good drawings, and be able to transmit the necessary technical information without becoming dry. This might perhaps be achieved by spicing it with anecdotical tidbits. But most of all, it should transmit the excitement of offshore racing and awaken interest in technologically inclined people (thatīs where the turbines come in). So it might well also contain a purely anecdotical part at the end. Anything that helps to make it lively. And why should it not at the end- mention the youth and the problems of the turbine class, and that it is a wide open field? At any rate, the authors should encourage the readers to get into contact with them in case they have any open questions. Great idea! (BTW I'm glad you decided to stick around. Turbines need all the good press they can get. Just don't expect JBS to go groveling to MGR; not gonna happen). |
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