What makes the boats of today so fast?
 

Why are the boats today so fast? Even 15 year old boats seem slow. To get big numbers they seem to require astronomical power.

Personally I love (and in the past had a 38 scarab) but they are just so slow by today's standards.

Is it the hull design or is it more the manufacturing processes and reduced weights of today's models?

Hypothetically, let's say you had a 38 Scarab AVS and you made it with today's techniques and reduced weight and modern day engines and drives, could it be comparable in speed to the current boats of today? Or is it simply a fact that the hulls are slow?

me!


all bs aside i dream would be to pop out some molds of the older boats like the chris craft stinger 39x and really lighten it up with todays technologies..add stepped bottoms but leave the freeboard,,also make it a staggared boat..that audda make it a little faster..

Hmm, my quick synopsis is advanced hull designs (stepped hulls/notched keels), lighter weight construction, higher Hp engines, and advanced stern drive technologies that don't rob as much Hp, etc.

A 38 AVS is by no means a slow hull. Exactly what are you comparing it to????
Thye will run low 80's with 500hp's which is very close to many newer hulls.

hull design

Now days they are designed to run loose with little friction. And built like potato chips...

marketing and hype . . . . .

Propellers and engines. Then hull design and weight. Pretty much in that order.

That comes from just about every boat builder I've ever spoken with, including Peter Hledin of Skater.

and big fat wallets

that helps :D

The 40 skater classic hull has not changed in 25 years and a 1991 hull is still the lightest 40 classic hull, so not all boat models have gotten faster by technology, yes motors and props for sure have gotten more efficient and have increased speeds.

I was just using that as an example as today I was reading about a 38 AVS with I think 1000hp engines each side and it was running i think 95mph at 5000 rpm. Just compared to some other figures you see on here it seemed very low all things considered. Im sure I have seen boats with "just" 500hp a side saying figures at least equal to that.

It just got me thinking is it just the manufacturing processes of today that make them so fast as everything else from today can be replicated with a repower (set up, drives, engines, props). The two things you cannot really change are the design and how it was made. Just out of curiosity, how do the weights of modern boats compare to the older ones?

Really Jim Darr?? Back again?? Poof......

So take that 38 AVS, make it semi stag, give it some steps, add surface drives and there is your speed compared to today. You also have the aftermarket HP claim vs MFG claim. Are those really 1000s?

Black hair die and gold chains.:whistle:

I was reading the write up on Outerlimits in the Speed On The Water Mag Vol 2, and in talking with Mike Fiore he stated "between bottom technology, drive technology and propeller technology we are just leaps and bounds ahead of where we were". The new Outerlimits 36' runs 105 with twin 565s. While the original Outerlimits 37 only (I say only while my Velocity only runs 74...) ran 85 with twin HP500s.

$$$

LMFAO!

What makes todays boats faster? SPONSONS AND TURBINES...no sweat suit, gold chains or hair die required!

Makes me think I should revive the cat killer thread!

Take the evolution of the 35 Fountain for example.

The original 1995-ish single-stepped bottom 35 Ex with side-by-side HP 500's and 4 blade Hydromotive props ran around 81 and came up on plane in a snap.

In around 2000 Fountain introduced their new twin step design (with much larger steps) and with everything else constant the boat picked up 3- 5 Mph because of the advanced step design. The 35 Lightning now topped out around the 85 - 86 MPH range.

From 2003 on Fountain switched to 525's and the 35' twin steps broke the 90 MPH barrier. But about the same time advancements in design of 5 props allowed Reggie to start really raising the X diminsion on his Fountains and the speed of the 35 twin stepped side-by side-Lightnings crept up to the 94 range by 2006. However, as the X was raised getting on plane became more and more of a chore.

In 2007 Reggie introduced the Staggered 35 Lightning. He sacrificed a great deal of cockpit space in order to do the stagger but with 525's and now 6 blade Herrings the boat exceeded 100 mph.

Rigging plays a big part in it today as well. Staggered set-up, blue printed bottom's and drives, higher x-dimensions, placement of steps, better props (less slip), lower center of gravity/better balance, and of course bigger and more reliable horsepower (I use the term "reliable" loosely).

LMAO, and not like Ruffles, more like Lay's.

Talk to richie powers about this and you will be very surprised how little the steps make a difference. For example, take a straight bottom 38TG, build it to the same weight as the new twin steps, put 525's with ITS transoms, high x, and 5 blade props. I bet it would be very very close to running with the TS boat. Most likely 2-3 mph in perfect conditions.

My visual answer

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Great analogy with real numbers!

nice set of wheels really helps a bunch

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and the water has adapted to stepped hulls.

I think that 38 scarab AVS needs some fine tuning as Humpsters boat runs 92mph with 850 a side.

I agree great chronology with the 35 fountain -- how was the handling and seat of your ass feel as the hull was lightened and the larger steps produced more of a cushion of air underneath the hull?
I like speed and yet I've ridden in some boats that should not go as fast as they do ;0

what makes today's boats faster? More HP. My friend's old 1998 35 Fountain 600SC's with Blowershop blowers can run 100 with light load. We had it up to 96 [ clocked by helicopter at the poker run ] with 4 people on board and half fuel. Boat is pretty light given the foam core hull and step. Install some Merc 1100's or 1350's and it would fly [ literally apart, pun intended ] haha.
My 25'7" boat is designed in 1990 to run on a single BB to about 65-68. Got twin small blocks and it runs up to 76. No magic there, just more power.

http://www3.telus.net/spectrasonly/IMG_1137.JPG

Coolers full of Bud Light instead of Budweiser?

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The 35's evolution is a great example.

Steps, stagger, balance, etc.; but look how high these drives are mounted. Drive height and prop technology makes this one fast.

Kelly O,

I think that is the best looking 35' Fountain on the planet (have always thought so since you first posted pictures of your boat), with great hardware (transom picture). I am sure many others agree with me too, that is one helluva Fountain.

light layups.... steps... props.. not being real OFFSHORE capable

speed wax...

for some weird reason, all teh old offshore boats were built like tanks, well at least they were after aranow broke one of his race boats in half... it's kind of difficult to break a boat in half when you are racing in a white cap free area..

[QUOTE=ratman;3958040]im not buying dat chit... the new boats are all flat bottoms made to run in huge 1 foot seas...rm

there were a LOT of days that i went out in my mistress and was the only offshore boat out there other than freighters, cuz nobody else wanted any part of that big water i would run in... that thing beat the waves down, it ran faster in big water cuz less of the hull was in it... any 35' new boat with a single 525hp would out run me in 1 foot seas, and i was running 572's @ making 660hp a side...rm

WOW!!!

I guess what the other guy said about marketing is correct then. From what you hear around the traps steps are the be all and end all!

Whats the difference in weight from lets say a 15 year old boat to a current one?

It's not just the weight, it's the props (5,6,7 blade compared to 3 blade of yesterday), shorties (or #4,5,6, arneson/bpm) and "stock" (525, 700, 850, 1075, 1100, 1350) power compared to years ago...

Thanks Smarty. My posting here is to confirm some of the thoughts as to why the newer configurations add performance. Yes, this is a small boat but it amazes every person how well it handles slop and reasonable offshore conditions. Full stagger, balance, and big props keeping the boat hooked to the water allow it to outrun many larger hulls while remaining very stable. I am able to run very little trim at high speeds, making the boat's actual running surface greater than a larger boat that is trimmed loose in an attempt to find speed.

It is not all about total weight either, as this boat is listed at 9800lbs which is significantly more than my previous 03 35 was.

Kelly,

Is that with #6's or bravo's?

Seems heavy for what most are calling a 30-31 foot boat.:evilb:

I know the answer to the drive question: #6' Tim Sharkey had a thread with pictures of this boat, it is gorgeous.

Transmissions, #6 drives will add to the weight versus the Bravo drive type boat. If the layup is any heavier (bare boat versus bare boat) Kelly O will have to answer that. Good question. Would it have been laid up heavier to account for the heavier transom hardware ?