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??
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I personally can not imagine that local authorities after this accident and the video's that are starting to pop up will have any choice but to shut this event down.
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Originally Posted by jimmystartup
(Post 3992263)
Jeez, I just ran across this video of the same event. Wow, that was close.
http://youtu.be/2AoHBQNqNSg http://youtu.be/2AoHBQNqNSg On closed courses, I would never suggest someone regulate anything anyone is willing to try. But on open waters, that include any type of spectators not policed to safe distances, I'm afraid it's going to end up in the inevitable, at which point we shall all be f$ched for good. |
Originally Posted by Trippin
(Post 3992254)
I have been boating & poker running on LC since I relocated here in 1998, and many years of experience previously, not just on Cumberland. While I didn't know Kevin, Brad or Jeff I do know that both runs on Lake Cumberland are managed, overseen, thought-out and governed by persons that are competent and knowledgeable about the "poker-run" scene, I know these persons personally. While it is truly unfortunate that a loss of life has happened it is none the less inevitable with this sport. Yes it is a sport. The organizers are not personally responsible for this tragic loss of life. The Coast Guard was on the water, a heavy presence of F&W was on the water and to me it was apperant that they made every attempt to keep some of the local idiots out of the way. They just cant do it all, there will always be someone that interferes on purpose or inadvertanetly. The Cruiser we all see in the video was IMO to close to the course, F&W missed them, or they moved closer after a F&W patrol passed. These things we cannot control. Stupidity and inexperience go hand in hand. Kevin, Brad and Jeff all had the right to run as fast as they wanted and felt comfortable with. They are gone but not forgotten, we all must realize that this is a dangerous sport/activity, we all love it and desire to not see it regulated out of existence. I don't see any reason why this event like all others like it will not come back next year. If I have any voice in the matter then it will stay.
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Originally Posted by danrad
(Post 3992277)
All this talk about speed limits on these poker runs and safety. Why do we have all these spectators at these runs? Everybody wants to see the fast cats run! I do and everybody I know does too! Would there be any spectators at a poker run with a speed limit, NO! Go ahead and put a speed limit of 60 on these runs and you would not have to worry about fast boats and spectators being hurt or killed because neither would be there. By the way the next time you are in your car on a two lane highway doing 55 and you pass another car doing 55 at about 3 to 4 feet, sounds pretty dangerous doesn't it?
Wanna be a spectator and see this stuff go to the races!! Watch these videos and tell me you'd be ok having kids on your boat and one of them blasts you like this!! |
Originally Posted by danrad
(Post 3992277)
All this talk about speed limits on these poker runs and safety. Why do we have all these spectators at these runs? Everybody wants to see the fast cats run! I do and everybody I know does too! Would there be any spectators at a poker run with a speed limit, NO! Go ahead and put a speed limit of 60 on these runs and you would not have to worry about fast boats and spectators being hurt or killed because neither would be there. By the way the next time you are in your car on a two lane highway doing 55 and you pass another car doing 55 at about 3 to 4 feet, sounds pretty dangerous doesn't it?
Also You are comparing a non fluid surface at far slower speeds. |
.....
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WOW is all I can say...after watching those recent videos...it is safe to say that certain people gambled their life on that run and also put the spectators at a huge risk. You just don't operate a boat like that on an open public waterway...period.
No one likes to hear about the loss of life in any circumstance however if you are going to gamble your life like that...bad things happen....real bad things happen........and they did. Everyone should be thankful that the spectators were not hurt or killer as a result of the actions of these boaters. |
Originally Posted by danrad
(Post 3992277)
All this talk about speed limits on these poker runs and safety. Why do we have all these spectators at these runs? Everybody wants to see the fast cats run! I do and everybody I know does too! Would there be any spectators at a poker run with a speed limit, NO! Go ahead and put a speed limit of 60 on these runs and you would not have to worry about fast boats and spectators being hurt or killed because neither would be there. By the way the next time you are in your car on a two lane highway doing 55 and you pass another car doing 55 at about 3 to 4 feet, sounds pretty dangerous doesn't it?
I'd surely go to a PR with a speed limit, as a matter of fact, that's the only way I'll ever do one again, JMO. |
I was pretty vocal in the thread that was removed earlier today about what I had saw with the "Pure Platinum" Skater video. I received a PM from him earlier today, basically defending himself and even going as far to state he didn't feel he was going that fast..... Below is the conversation I had with him earlier today. I am not posting this to start an argument, while I am sure to some it looks like I am. I guess what I am trying to prove here is its a mentality that needs to be changed. In this case, with the PP skater, if the driver doesn't feel he did anything wrong, then it will continue. I personally don't know him, giving benefit of doubt he is probably a pretty cool guy. We all have experienced a lack of judgement and have made poor decisions, but as men (and women) we need to know when to suck up our pride, admit we made a mistake, and learn from these mistakes. God knows I have had my fair share of screw ups....
Originally Posted by low_psi
Originally Posted by GATORONE
Originally Posted by low_psi
It looks like you were trying to send me a PM but my inbox was full? I cleaned it out, so feel free to PM me again.
Everybody needs to stop assuming why we were near the spectator boats.. The question is what was on the other side of him. We're we running fast? No .. The second video is just past that one and it was my video.. You need to remember that everyone made a assumption after the first wreck video but once the second came out all opinions changed.. You weren't there so you have no idea what was on the backside ... Everybody wants to be a expert on this site but you have limited facts... I have on board cameras ... I know the real truth... Please think before you make opinionated attacks without facts.. If you search hard you will find the pics showing the fleet on the other side of the checkmate. Thanks Look I don't give a damn you you are and how skilled you think you are and how deep of pockets you have. That was reckless behavior, PERIOD. If I were anywhere near the group of anchorded boats, I would have found you and expressed my displeasure with you. Don't try and explain, defend or justify your actions with a PM to me. Your PM only solidifies my position your ego is seriously clouding your ability to make wise, safe decisions. |
Originally Posted by ActiveThunder
(Post 3992271)
Just because you have the most expensive, the baddest, the fastest doesn't make you a better man then the guy on a pontoon boat with a 20 year old Johnson strapped to the back. Instead maybe just a little more reckless.
BINGO!!! The crux of the problem here. |
Originally Posted by danrad
(Post 3992290)
No I would not, you are right, but I would not bring my daughter to an event like this! Remember this you are on the road with drunks and teens texting!!!!!
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Originally Posted by low_psi
(Post 3992297)
I was pretty vocal in the thread that was removed earlier today about what I had saw with the "Pure Platinum" Skater video. I received a PM from him earlier today, basically defending himself and even going as far to state he didn't feel he was going that fast..... Below is the conversation I had with him earlier today. I am not posting this to start an argument, while I am sure to some it looks like I am. I guess what I am trying to prove here is its a mentality that needs to be changed. In this case, with the PP skater, if the driver doesn't feel he did anything wrong, then it will continue. I personally don't know him, giving benefit of doubt he is probably a pretty cool guy. We all have experienced a lack of judgement and have made poor decisions, but as men (and women) we need to know when to suck up our pride, admit we made a mistake, and learn from these mistakes. God knows I have had my fair share of screw ups....
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How will the pokerruns be safer? I remember last year a few good fellas were killed at a sanctioned race. What changes if any were made? You can sweep the chit under the rug only for so long. After seeing the videos imo it is a miracle a spectator boat hasn't been taken out.
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There should several suspensions and or fines for this reckless deadly driving these drivers are participating in. 1 million dollar boat and not a dollars worth of sense! Seems pretty simple, a little control and hard guidelines {with consequences) would help 150%
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This THREAD was supposed to be about the EQUIPMENT options to solve possible problems. This is NOT a continuation of the removed one.
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Originally Posted by danrad
(Post 3992277)
All this talk about speed limits on these poker runs and safety. Why do we have all these spectators at these runs? Everybody wants to see the fast cats run! I do and everybody I know does too! Would there be any spectators at a poker run with a speed limit, NO! Go ahead and put a speed limit of 60 on these runs and you would not have to worry about fast boats and spectators being hurt or killed because neither would be there. By the way the next time you are in your car on a two lane highway doing 55 and you pass another car doing 55 at about 3 to 4 feet, sounds pretty dangerous doesn't it?
60 mph no but you don't need to go 160 on a lake with all this boats around if there are no boats around then go for it! |
Cash Bar, I hear you. But I think what a lot of us feel is the equipment that needs to be fixed or addressed is the attitudes and egos. Not so much the boats themselves....
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Originally Posted by Cash Bar
(Post 3992315)
This THREAD was supposed to be about the EQUIPMENT options to solve possible problems. This is NOT a continuation of the removed one.
The other one will be back I hope without the remove agenda. This is a HUGE part of the problem. :D |
Originally Posted by Cash Bar
(Post 3992315)
This THREAD was supposed to be about the EQUIPMENT options to solve possible problems. This is NOT a continuation of the removed one.
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If we want to talk about changing equipment to make things safer, the first sport I will bring up is NASCAR. When cars began to get too fast, and airborne too often, NASCAR implemented restrict or plates to SLOW the cars down. In NHRA, the nitro cars had gotten so fast, they were running out of track to safely slow down. So NHRA, shortened the run for nitro. This limited the top speeds again. The common factor is speed. We don't need to fix the boats, we just need to keep them at a safe speed.
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dont you think if this crap keeps up only matter of time before we have various water speed llimits??
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Equipment, as in the part between the seat and the throttles?
Sorry, but I disagree that it's an equipment issue |
i just dont understand how you can come 10 feet away from killing everybody in a boat and "not think there was anything wrong with it". ??????????
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Originally Posted by Cash Bar
(Post 3992315)
This THREAD was supposed to be about the EQUIPMENT options to solve possible problems. This is NOT a continuation of the removed one.
Might as well let it happen and moderate as it goes. |
I honestly don't think there is any type or kind of equipment that can or will slow these boats down!
The only thing that will slow them down is when the people that are operating them are in a court room with there lawyers trying to keep them out of jail for hurting or worse killing someone.. just my opinion First thing on my equipment list is COMMON SENSE! |
Originally Posted by Level III Chaos
(Post 3992323)
Greg.....did the equipment fail? Tell us which part and we'll talk about that.
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Originally Posted by US1 Fountain
(Post 3992328)
Equipment, as in the part between the seat and the throttles?
Sorry, but I disagree that it's an equipment issue |
Originally Posted by low_psi
(Post 3992324)
If we want to talk about changing equipment to make things safer, the first sport I will bring up is NASCAR. When cars began to get too fast, and airborne too often, NASCAR implemented restrict or plates to SLOW the cars down. In NHRA, the nitro cars had gotten so fast, they were running out of track to safely slow down. So NHRA, shortened the run for nitro. This limited the top speeds again. The common factor is speed. We don't need to fix the boats, we just need to keep them at a safe speed.
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This seems pretty easy.... Everybodys emotions are running high but here it goes.
First, its a poker run not a race so if the coast guard accidentally lets a boat onto the poker run course, the PR boats yield to him/slower boat and its a neutral course.... If not - disqualified. In Florida you have manatee zones (no wake zones) from the shore to a main causeway. In the causeway, you can run at speed. Spectators stay within 100 yards of the shore. All PR boats have to stay within 100 yards of the center line. If there isnt enough room, you are having the poker run in the wrong place. Some of the footage shows areas that seem pretty narrow for boats to go 3 wide let alone 3 wide with other boat traffic. Second, The PR committe has to designate some zones as caution or slower area. You dont obey and a ref sees you - disqualified. In wider areas designate it as that, a free for all. In the meantime you get DQ'd if the areas dont permit enough "room" to put 30 boats doing 150 MPH. Done, I am now sponsoring a poker run in Palm Beach thru all the Manatee zones.... C'mon Down. |
And another thing, Drag car parachutes pulling a shroud to decrease full deployment and/or a compressed air blast blast to blow it out. Drag chutes are less than $500. I find it hard to believe that this couldnt be a cost effective solution. Initially, it could be manual. But, I am 99% confident that they have a cheap gyroscope that would deploy the chute under pre-programmed conditions under $1000. On $500K+++ boats this would be less money than the GPS's in the dash and it would save your life.
There, I've laid it out for you.... PM me to get an address to send me royalty checks... |
me and my wife bought a new boat this summer. And yes its a fast boat. We decided to got to the cumberland poker run and enter. i blew a drive up the week before so i called and they were nice enough to refund me entirely. my wife has been a little leary about running in this type of environment. we ran all summer in different go fast situations trying to get her comfortable. so, she said she was finally ready! we were both crushed that we couldnt go, but were looking forward to next year. But after watching these videos she is SCARED to death to even spectate. i love this sport, surely there are rules and regulations that can be put in place to make driving and spectating alot more SAFE. i understand the RUSH and EGO but there has to be some limitations!!!!
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I am curious about what safety requirements Brad and Jeff had on? Did the have 5 point harnesses on? Is that a requirement at those speeds. We shouldn't treat the safety of this sport any different then safety of other sports. On the 1/4 mile the faster you go the more safety you need, helmet, 5 point harness, roll cage etc etc. My question is was there any safety measures that they could have taking so that they could of walked away. I mean come on 43 stock cars going over 200 miles an hour and they walk away, top fuel and they walk away, these cats should be no different.
I love the sport, we all make bad decisions in life. I'd hate to see speed limits. Boyne Thunder had Marshall boats that were flagged and there job was to warn everyday boaters that might not know what's going on. Does LCPR have these. I believe there mostly volunteers. |
Originally Posted by TBAG
(Post 3992213)
Unfortunately I think this is what will happen. Locally there was very strong talk after Kevin passed away during the 09 run of it being the end of the LC Poker Run. Now after this accident I think it will be done away with for good.
Too bad because we have one of the prettiest lakes in the country and its by far the greatest weekend of the year. |
Originally Posted by SummerObsession
(Post 3992343)
Actually you are incorrect about NHRA. It wasn't slowing down at the end of the track as much as the RPM it was Taking and the amount of fuel being used in the last 320' of the race track was causing an inordinate amount of violent engine explosions at speed, thus causing concern for driver safety at those speeds as well as long delays in track clean up lessening the fan experience. Totally different scenario.
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how many people would be able to tell the difference with the naked eye sitting on the sidelines of the poker run if the boat was going 120 or 160?
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Originally Posted by s022mag
(Post 3992349)
I am curious about what safety requirements Brad and Jeff had on? Did the have 5 point harnesses on? Is that a requirement at those speeds. We shouldn't treat the safety of this sport any different then safety of other sports. On the 1/4 mile the faster you go the more safety you need, helmet, 5 point harness, roll cage etc etc. My question is was there any safety measures that they could have taking so that they could of walked away. I mean come on 43 stock cars going over 200 miles an hour and they walk away, top fuel and they walk away, these cats should be no different.
I love the sport, we all make bad decisions in life. I'd hate to see speed limits. Boyne Thunder had Marshall boats that were flagged and there job was to warn everyday boaters that might not know what's going on. Does LCPR have these. I believe there mostly volunteers. |
Originally Posted by 88bullet
(Post 3992353)
how many people would be able to tell the difference with the naked eye sitting on the sidelines of the poker run if the boat was going 120 or 160?
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Originally Posted by low_psi
(Post 3992297)
I was pretty vocal in the thread that was removed earlier today about what I had saw with the "Pure Platinum" Skater video. I received a PM from him earlier today, basically defending himself and even going as far to state he didn't feel he was going that fast..... Below is the conversation I had with him earlier today. I am not posting this to start an argument, while I am sure to some it looks like I am. I guess what I am trying to prove here is its a mentality that needs to be changed. In this case, with the PP skater, if the driver doesn't feel he did anything wrong, then it will continue. I personally don't know him, giving benefit of doubt he is probably a pretty cool guy. We all have experienced a lack of judgement and have made poor decisions, but as men (and women) we need to know when to suck up our pride, admit we made a mistake, and learn from these mistakes. God knows I have had my fair share of screw ups....
Originally Posted by fleg1
Originally Posted by GATORONE
Do you know for sure it was to get ahead??? Or maybe a entire flotilla ahead with marine patrol boats moving them ...
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Originally Posted by jmoore1225
(Post 3992358)
I could be wrong on this, but the first 3-4 boats on the Cumberland run looked light years faster than anything else that came by!!
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