332 boats in the classified s
 

I noticed that yesterday.

the site will be totally changed in less than 10 years. It will be outboard related and CC boats or totally gone. . I/O s boats will be non existing especially I/O sportboats. Majority members here -- own 15 to 32 year old sportboats currently. The members are aging and so are the boats. At some point in time many boat owners will not find it wise to keep pouring money in 25 to 45 year I/O sportboats.

I have been dealing with this same exact issue year over year from I/O rec boat owners and 4 sure the sportboat owner.. Their boats are getting older and older. The wakeboard boat owners - they are the only ones buying brand new boats about every 4 to 10 years, trading them in to get the latest greatest wakeboat. This has been the norm and growing numbers for the past 11 years from the wakeboard crowd. The sportboat crowd has been declining hugely year over year..

Less than 10 years from now USED sportboats will be extremely had to find for sale because 11 straight years nothing has been newly made. .

Yeah, add Freedom Boat club to the mix. Down here they are adding more and more boats over 30 feet and you can use points for wave runners. It makes it a no brainer on cost, ease of use and simplicity.

Another example is the Miami boatshow. That has changed so much. Its majority CC boats and if anyone noticed wakeboats to. The wakeboats out number all combined I/O s in the show. Keep in mind there is only like 8 wakeboard Boat Manus ONLY in the USA. Man the show has changed hugely. Just saying.

The listings always go down this time of year. They have also declined steadily over the past 10 years. IMO, pretty simple reasons why.
1. Way fewer performance boats for sale and being sold compared to CC, toons, etc.
2. Lots of free places to list boats for sale now, especially on Facebook.

I agree with this. I also think the younger generations are less enamored with the outdoors, it's easier to sit and stare at their phones.

^^ This. Although, you have to weed through a lot of trolls and dreamers. I've been watching the boat count too. I thought it normally hovered around 800-1000. Not just the classifieds but the other sections too. Used to post something in the morning and it would be on page 2 by noon.

On the I/O argument, look how many long time OSOr's have switched to OB's and aren't switching back.

I was kind of shocked to see a 2018 Top Gun appear in the classifieds, but at 500K I would think you could build a brand new one for that.

As far as still producing I/O vee's it seems Outerlimits seems to be the only one putting out new ones but to be fair, it is their clients that are ordering the boats to be built.

Hi Bup,

I get the OB's are much more reliable but sport boat OB's are not catching on either. AT tried it,,,, nothing. Outerlimits built one?

I do have a question, you work on a lot of the wake board boats and they are selling, how reliable are those? It's not like they are a outboard. I will need to repower soon and will not cut up the boat to mount outboards so I have been looking at the wakeboard power plants and wondering about those. Like the 550 PCM XS7 makes.

Kind of like the Seven marine Outboards, its still a car motor.

Actually the core Harley crown is getting very old and a life's worth of aches and pains plus the costs of ownership only to ride a few times a year are causing them to leave the market.

The airport in Traverse City has two boats on display, both Mastercraft ski boats. Drive by the two major boat dealerships and the inventory and storage lots are filled with ski boats. There's a gazillion inland lakes with a gazillion summer homes in northern Michigan and you don't need a lot of water for a slalom water ski course. ed

100% agree......unless they start making outboards that sound nice I/O sport boats will always exist. Nothing like a strong V8 or V10 with pipes start up. It's like a tesla or a v twin bike with stock pipes. It's just hard for me to get excited without the sound, it's one of the biggest things for me.

Same thing was said about 10 years ago about Outboards.... their dead everyone predicted.... just goes to show what goes around comes around.....

when the new tech outboards start breaking down and they will in due time. These engine, the latest 4 strokes and systems are not do it yourself friendly period. For one - owners can not hop online and buy from rock auto nor auto parts store for parts. These engines will have to go to a trained dealer for proper repairs and buy ONLY the OEM related parts. The OEMS and dealers are hugely over joyed with these set ups because it completely takes out the do it yourselfer and internet parts buyer.

Next - If one would look at the MANY service bulletins that the verado s had since intro - it was many from lower unit failures, many FSM issues, power head bolts breaking, steering issues, SC issues and so on and so on. Of course many got iron out as time goes on but they all still have issues and will down the road. They do have good warranties and one reason for that is because OF THE MANY OUTBOARD MANU's - there is about 10 outboard manus if not more when one counts the smaller hp outboards. Competition -- NOT like the I/O manus inwhich is ONLY TWO - Mercruiser and Volvo and thats it for the gas side.

Propshaft breakage has been the latest talked about issues for Verado's. Outboards are not failure proof period. They still require huge fuel system maintenance, fuel injectors maintenance, cooling related service, oil and filter changes and so on.

Don't know if you missed my question about the wake board motors and how well they seem to be holding up? I see PCM offers a 5 year warranty.

So how the heck can outboards run without closed cooling and no issues? Salt water is salt water.

Alot of outboards have to be pulled away from the transom to be worked on for room. Sometimes its a must for steering cable replacement even for single engine apps. removing the outboard away from the transom. Even pontoon boats single engines at times because the room is poor but NOTHING like I/Os very limited room.

IMO stag I/Os are great to worked on. Twin or more outboards can be limited room to work on. I really do not work on outboards but prob can hold my own. I work on only about 5 outboards per year. But 2012 and back when I had techs -- we would see about 200 outboards per year. Johnson / E rude - Some Suzukis 2 and 4 stroke - Mercury 2 strokes - very few 4 strokes- alot of Optibombs aka optimax. a ton of Yamaha;s 2 stroke - HPDI - V Max and few 4 strokes. -- Keep in mind 4 stroke outboards really took off sales wise in the past 6 to 7 years. 2 stroke outboards are dead period.

If 4 stroke outboards did not make this huge push and advancements -- I do not believe their sales would be huge like they are currently.

You need to attend Mercury Tech classes just to get the hood off of the new OB's..... they are no joy to work on....and very, very expensive.....

So, soon this site will be called On Shore Only?:D

My neighbor's dad has bought a new Harley every year for the last 25+ years. Same model (Road King) and from the same dealer. 2 years ago he got a new one and it didn't have a CD player but an IPOD cord and navigation instead. He rode it for 5 months and the next spring he went back to the dealer and asked if his old bike was still for sale (it was). He traded back and took his last years model back (CD player and no navigation). The rear tire was thinner on the new bike, he didn't like that either.

He said he has bought his last Harley Davidson. Now imagine the 40 yr old execs at HD trying to figure out why they have lost all future sales to a very good customer! Now add in the guys that are too old to ride, too cheap to upgrade to a new bike and you will get the picture of why HD is in so much of a slump. Don't get me started on the idea of making the bikes in Asia instead...............that was simply crazy talk!

If one looks at the way they are used - extremely well for holding up. Indmar did their homework. PCM not far behind Indmar. The wake board crowd spend the money regardless - they use the crap out their 100 K to 200 K boats period.

They are used with 1000 to 2500 lbs of ballast - most wakeboats are loaded with people -- 6 to 12 on board. huge towers with speakers all over the place and some with a ton of batteries -- again added weight. -- the engines are lugged around all day with boarders and wake surfers.

The age group whom buy wakeboard boats and again 6 figures price tags range from 32 to 52. This is the norm and MY customer base for these BOATS only - My customer base FOR REC I/Os and sportboats age is 48 to 62 It seems 60 and above age --- most want out of these style of boats. They end up buying bass fishing boats - and or pontoon boats fish N ski style --- both apps with outboards. Or they completely get out of BOATING. This is the huge norm --- they get out of boating completely after owning I/O rec boats and or I/O s sportboats never to return.

Last year I worked on 296 boats.

5 of them outboards --

136 true V drive wakeboats ---

12 true direct drive inboard SKI BOATS -----

27 TRUE sportboats I/O's - single and twin engines. No trip engines. --

24 cabin cruisers 16 with bravos and volvos -- 8 true cabin cruisers inboards -- single and twin engines

3 jet drive boats with basically a hot rod 454 -- one with MEFI 4

89 - REC boats I/Os -- Mercruiser and Volvos.

My area is one of the largest wakeboard buyers / ownerships in the USA and has become many boat service shop MAIN BUSINESS is my point here and the reason for the break down. Inland marine service shops rely on their business. For me thank goodness for the wakeboard boat owners because basically its my main business currently. I do not own a wakeboat period but use to sell them brand new and used. Easy sale for the past 13 years. Before that not as popular

I'm not a bike guy, just was being told the story by an old guy that loves Harleys. He specifically didn't want the nav and had no idea what to do with the ipod connector!

Jupiter, H/D hasn't actually built a bike in the USA for many years, they are assembled in the USA. Currently and in the past, bikes that are assembled here have components shipped in from manufacturers all over the world. Wheels, suspension, brakes, electronics, even engine components. I'm in the motorcycle industry and recall an article that the Honda Gold Wing was more "built in the USA" than current H/D, let that sink in. Honda moved that production back to Japan about 10 yrs ago.

Mercruiser I/O's THE CURRENT --- 4.5 and 6.2 and 8.2 engine blocks are made by a foundry here in the USA, the 8.2 has been made by this same company since 2010.. And the Merc racing 1100 and 1350 and the others have parts made by another Foundry in the USA. I talked to them last year in person. Merc makes alot of their own outboard parts. All their engines except the lower hp outboards are assembled in house.

For new I/O engines Merc claims not one GM part is made nor on their engines period

this video might help and possible answer some of the questions about outboard corrosion. Watch it fairly interesting

I didn't know that!

That was very cool. I guess mercury has made the choice to not use a lot of this technology on I/O's which in effect is one reason people are moving away from them.