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How much is your boat insurance?
What are the average amounts of boat insurance are over the board?
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i pay $380 a year for the 24 mirage and $960 a year for the 26 scorpion. both through boat US. been pretty happy with the service and the policies from them so far.
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Too MUCH
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Originally posted by Tonto Too MUCH I'll bet!!!! and here I cry about my $250 a month.. ;) |
I have a batboat, 650 HP, 100+ mph, picture looks like a race boat (well it is after all) and nobody will insure it, but if they would they would charge $3500 and then cancel me when the main office sees the picture. This includes Dollar, PMA, whoever that advertises on OSO or Powerboat, Hotboat etc.
Another OSO member mentioned ANPAC and they cover me for $791. American National Insurance Company [email protected] |
Tom, I guess they havent ever seen actually how safe and stable those boats are.
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MARK... YOUR AVATAR IS BADAZZ!!!!!!!!!
VERY COOL BRO!!! |
Thanks man, and the actual cat is coming by spring..........And since we are talking about it, i guess i shall prepare for the insurance bill:(
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Mark
I've been looking at insurance for cats. It seems 100+ mph makes them nervous. Either they say no or just start throwing $$$ signs at you. A 110 mph 3100 AO was going to cost me $3000.00 a year. They also told me that if I lied about the boats top speed or made modifications that made more speed they wouldn't pay if there was a claim. I wonder how many claims boaters per year make and how many are from performance boaters. |
$650 per year from Allstate.
Never have had a claim in 18 years so I have no idea if they are worth it or not. Being honest (within reason) about HP and speed is a good idea.:cool: Craig |
3400.00
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$1786.00 with Allstate,the agent is a friend of mine and had some trouble getting them to insure it ,at all.At those rates I'm not sure how good a friend he is:eek: :confused:
Steve |
Boat-U.S. = $1300/yr for
12months, navigating entire U.S up to 25 miles offshore, Agreed Hull value, $250 deductible, 100k liability, 500k enviro. damage, unlimited towing, etc. |
$889 per year - 29 OUTLAW with 496HO X 2
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29, you have that through National in Annapolis? Just curious, seems cheap, They gave me the best deal on my Sonic at $600.
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Originally posted by Tonto Too MUCH |
just to make everyone feel like they get a great deal on ins mines 12000 so cheer up and merrychristmas
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12000? Good Guogly Muogly
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Originally posted by Mark in So. MD 29, you have that through National in Annapolis? Just curious, seems cheap, They gave me the best deal on my Sonic at $600. |
Originally posted by 46tomcat just to make everyone feel like they get a great deal on ins mines 12000 so cheer up and merrychristmas |
This is one of the reasons we're thinking about something other than an offshore for our next boat. Our last boat was a 28' Powerquest - 65 mph or so. All of the major insurance companies told me they wouldn't insure it, including Allstate (which has our home and trucks), State Farm ("we're not writing new policies in Michigan"), Progressive, etc. Boat US told me they don't insure performance boats.
Got the run around everywhere, until I finally when through Worldwide Marine Ins. and got covered through Old United Casualty for around $1500.00 a year for an agreed value policy. Thank God we sold the boat last year, because I heard that Old United cancelled all "high performance" policies when they came up for renewal. Every time we start thinking about new boat, a little voice in the back of my head keeps talking about what a pain in the ass it is to find insurance. And what it will cost. Not to mention the possiblity of getting shafted by the insurer (cancellation or big $$ to renew). And the real pisser is that "performance boats" are statistically very low on the accident totem pole. I did a little number crunching with the Coast Guard numbers a while back, I'll see if I can find the post. Bottom line is, some balding eunich at "MegaInsuranceCo" makes an arbitrary decision that any boat that runs faster than 60 mph is an unacceptable risk. The people making these decisions probably have never been on a boat in their lives... Just discouraging and frustrating... ***************** Found my thread on accidents.... A couple of recent posts here and elsewhere got me thinking about boating safety. I think it is fair to say that the "cigarette boat" crowd gets more than its fair share of attention from authorities (sorry Troutly!). So, I decided to do a bit of research... The USCG maintains records that contain all sorts of interesting accident data. You can do some browsing yourself over at Office for Boating Safety website: http://www.uscgboating.org/ One of the interesting things I found on this is that recreational boating fatalities are down in 2002. If you really want to have some fun, go to the "Statistics" section and download the Boating Statistics file. I took a look at the year 2000 report, the latest one available. Some interesting tidbits: Percentage of accidents that resulted in fatalities, by boat type: Canoe / Kayak.................................65% Rowboat..........................................5 8% Open motor boat...............................8.4% Houseboat......................................... 5.4% Cabin motor boat...............................3.9% The CG recorded 701 fatalities in 2000. 540 fatalities, or roughly 77%, came on boats between 8' and 21'. There were 45 fatalities on ALL boats (not just performance boats) in the 25' - 40' range, or roughly 6.4%. More fun... out of the 429 fatalities that occured among propellor-driven boats, 328 (76%) came on boats that were powered by outboards, 49 (11.4%) came on I/O's, and 48 (11.2%) came on inboards. 14 deaths were on boats with "unknown" power. Must be all those maniacs running 28 Skaters... Now, I'm just a dumb redneck, but I'm thinking that if our local water police spent less time busting the balls of the guy with loud exhaust, and more time monitoring and enforcing the rules for folks in smaller, outboard powered boats, not to mention canoes, rowboats, and kayaks, they just might be able to lower the fatality rate even further. But what do I know... :rolleyes: |
Dockrocker,
That's some great info, thanks for putting that together. I fear, however, that it's not the deaths or total loss type of claims that they're concerned with....Maybe it has to do with Big Block Joe blowing up his motors and drives every 6 months and after the 12th claim, Insurer's tend to notice. But I'm with you 100%, I can't stand the arbitrary stereotype. You're right on as far as the % are concerned. |
Baja Daze,
I agree, there's more than the fatality rate - my original post was not directly applicable to the issue at hand. I wonder, though, just what the claim rate really is on performance boats vs. your average Sea Ray. I've seen statistics that put "performance" boats as something like 3% of the overall boat market. I have a hard time believing that the overall claim rate is high enough to justify 3 or 4 times the premium. Just thinking out loud here, but we have what, maybe 7000 members on OSO. Say we've got a 1000 regular posters - how many "blew my engine up and made an insurance claim" posts do you see? Not all that many - none that I can remember. And every weekend, I see cabin cruisers and what not being towed in to the dock. I'm not saying that this is necessarily a solid statement, I'm just have a suspicious nature. I'm guessing that there really is no empirical evidence to justifiy a higher rate for performance boats. But, the companies have a stereotype of "us" in mind, they know they can get away with it (think the local news is going to do a human interest story on the guy with a $100,000 loud boat who's getting screwed on insurance?), and so we get screwed. Any insurance-savvy types out there? Can you comment? |
When it come to boats and water, you have to have insurance. I had a relative and a close friend bring suit against my familly at one point. For minor injuries in a related accident. Needless to say I have nothing to do with either ever again. I cannot discuss #s related to the final settelement but lets say it was it made the original purchase cost of my boat look cheap.
two points, 1. Max your coverage 2. if you are ever involved in a accident, shut up, everyone is going to sue, no matter what they say. Hard lesson to learn.:( Sorry to make this statement, just hope that by reading this maybe I could save one of you the chit my family endured.;) |
That's a great viewpoint dock. I, too, would love to see that data compiled: #claims vs type of boat. Arguably, the industry that exploits statistics more than any other would have to be insurance. (Notice, I said industry...Otherwise it would have to be politics:D:D) Anyway, I'm sure there's a reason...I don't like it, but that's the nature of the biz.
I wonder if Reliability and maintainability are factors. |
OSO group coverage
Maybe we could arrange group coverage like they do for health insurance. With 7000 members we should be able to negotiate a great deal for all of us. Anybody have any resources or ways to look into it?
Tom |
Re: OSO group coverage
Originally posted by Tom Maybe we coudl arrange group coverage like they do for health insurance. With 7000 members we should be able to negotiate a great deal for all of us. Anybody have any resources or ways to look into it? Tom Sounds like a plan to me :) |
Originally posted by dockrocker ....I have a hard time believing that the overall claim rate is high enough to justify 3 or 4 times the premium...... ....... I'm guessing that there really is no empirical evidence to justifiy a higher rate for performance boats. But, the companies have a stereotype of "us" in mind, they know they can get away with it............ Any insurance-savvy types out there? Can you comment? It's not that the claim rate is higher, but the pool from which to pay the claims is alot smarter. While there is well over $100,000,000. in "boat" insurance premium out there, the true "high performance" premium is under $20,000,000. Because there are fewer boats paying into it, the rates have to be higher. Secondly, the average claim for "high performance" boats is also higher than the average "boat"claim. A busted outdrive on a 50' Nor-Tech is alot more pricey than one on a 50' Sea Ray. You also have expensive graphics, exotic hull materials, etc. I am not a "baulding eunich at MegaInsuranceCo" but have been in the boat insurance business over 20 years; 10 years exclusively with "high performance" boats. I have developed three different national programs in that time, right down to assembling the policy itself. I DO know my business. I'm not defending the WHOLE marine insurance market......just those of us who take it seriously, and want to make sure that there will ALWAYS be coverage available for the "high performance" boater. Otherwise, this site would be called Bayliner Only........:D:D;) |
Risk Taker,
Thanks for the insight - and sorry 'bout that eunich comment - might have had one too many cups of coffee today ;) Let me ask this - why would the insurance pools be separated by boat type? I would think that if it floats, the insurance money would go into one account, not into separate ones. Can you clarify? Also, I can only accept the exotic materials deal so far. Seems to me that a Bravo 1 is a Bravo 1 - it's going to cost the same whether it's on a 25' Crownline or a 38' Formula. And I'd imagine a Bravo 3 is even more money to replace/rebuild, just from the added widgets and gizmos inside (obviously, I'm a technical guru...). As for hull materials, etc, is a Formula, Baja, or Powerquest really that different from a typical express cruiser? I can understand that, say, Rinker uses chopped strand under the surface coat of 'glass, and Formula uses hand-laid roving. But if both boats are put up on the rocks, isn't the repair comparable? (glassdave or sharkey, can you edumacate me?) I'll agree that there are some pretty exotic machines running around out there, but for every carbon fiber / kevlar / unobtainium Nor-Tech, there's got to be 10 or 20 regular old fiberglass Bajas. I really do want to understand how this works - I'm not trying to be a bad guy and bust your chops on this - just learning. I've been working some numbers for the coming year, trying to see if we can move our timetable for a new boat up a bit. Every time, I run into the black hole of insurance costs - just a bit frustrated. :) Thanks for helping clear some of this up (and if I'm really feeling down, I'll look at 46tomcat's bill again :D :D ) DR |
I`ve owned performance boats for 20+ yrs and what I`ve learned about insuring these things is that you MUST do your homework and shop,shop,shop around. I have a Top Gun and pay 1200/yr for inland lakes,with winter layup. Ive been quoted as high as 3300 for similar coverage. My boat is with Sy Goldberg at Total Dollar.
great thread by the way! 12,000/yr.......yikes:eek: Kurt. |
Currently pay $550/yr for the 27'.
Priced out a 32' at $778/yr. |
FYI!
I was recently notified that my insurance on the Fountain that is with the Fireman's Fund through Worldwide Marine is not renewable. My policy expires the end of January and that company is no longer handling Hi-Pro boats. Worldwide has other sources, but at this point I am going to shop around. What are the details on the Company that underwrote the Batboat for $750, maybe just a contact and tel #. I think we need to talk turkey, that sounds cheap. Midnight:cool:
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2003 Active Thunder 37 AVH, 496HOS, Sy Golberg at Total Dollar, $3,500, no layup.
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Chadm
What company is that? ACE is one that Worldwide quoted me on, and Sy Goldberg at Total Dollar also can do. I don't think it would be ACE, would it? Haven't heard anything like that, unless it was within the last hour, and from what I hear is going on in the insurance biz, that might be the case! Mark |
Originally posted by 46tomcat just to make everyone feel like they get a great deal on ins mines 12000 so cheer up and merrychristmas |
What are the details on the Company that underwrote the Batboat for $750, maybe just a contact and tel #. Javier S. Magdaleno 9625 Black Mountain Road Suite 210 San Diego, CA 92126 USA (858) 566-8555 [email protected] They have been around since 1906, AAAAAAA+++ rated or whatever the hell it is. I guess one less plus is like a D. :) $80,000 value - $679 a year $300,000 liability $101 Medical $5,000 each $11 Total $791 They also cover my car, house and business and have a $1,000,000 umbrella that ups all the liability coverage for $143 a year. Car and house were about the same as my old Farmer's policy for 1.5 times the coverage. I don't know **** about it and hope mine is great, but nobody else would even talk to me so bad coverage is better than none I hope. I told him to join OSO and explain what they are about, but I think he is afraid to since he is not very internet savvy and does not want to make waves on OSO. |
Well insurance prices vary by your location, I called Sy Goldberg and he would not even cover me just because I live in a high risk area{near the gulf of mexico} I have perfect credit, no claims on any insurance, car, home or boat, my little h2x is 669.00 a year, no lay up, I called around on bids for a 1997 baja 29 outlaw, progressive was 1910.00 a year no lay up and PMA could save me around 300.00 off that if I layed it up for 2 months, if I moved to Austin it would cut in half
Mark |
I don't have the years in the business that Risk Taker does, but I am a commercial agent, as well as a waterborne adrenaline junkie.
The insurance business, just like the economy, is cyclical. Right now, it is tightening, and all of the carriers are raising the bar (read "premiums") ACROSS THE BOARD. It will ease up again, but it may be some time from now, and may NEVER back down to the rates we had enjoyed in recent years. The fact is, that when the carriers were making fortunes in the market, they could afford to "give" away coverage, and not get hurt. With returns lagging, they now have to fall back on premiums to operate profitably (after all, they are in business to make a profit). To further complicate things, many underwriters are pulling out of markets that push they may consider slightly higher risk. As a result, many of us, no matter how sober or safe operators we may be, get painted with a broad brush swung by a person looking at a computer screen. I'm not saying that insurance companies are angels or villains. It will be a challenge to insure our boats, particularly when 60 MPH is the cutoff used by many carriers. THose who will write you will probably charge accordingly. By the way, I suggest, while shopping, etc, that you learn from 27FOuntain's hard lesson: focus as heavily (if not more) on your liability, as you would on the value of your property. As 27Fountain has seen first hand, when Johnny Cochrane gets the phone call from the injured party, the fiberglass repair is gonna look like chump change.:eek: |
My boat insurance is reasonable at around 680/yr for an 89 Formula 272 thru allstate. My big problem with insurance companies hit me Friday with my new homeowners policy. Last year it went up from 551 to 690 per year and I was shocked by the 20%+ increase. New bill is for, get this...$1370. What the F***?? They say in their "We appreciate your business" BS letter that it's because of increases in building materials and weather related claims. We are coming off 2 of the mildest winters I can recall, I don't even remember the last ice storm we've had. And if they can show me that an AC unit, bundle of shingles, 2X4 or sheet of plywood costs 2X what it did last year, I'll eat my hat. Blood sucking Bastages
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Risk Taker
I thought you would see that :p . Just bust'in your chops. But seriuosly, I have been with Risk Taker for going on four years now and am very happy with coverage, service, explanation of coverage, rates, etc. I think that anyone shopping for insurance should contact you for coverage. Robert |
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