Towing with a lifted truck.....
 

I am seriously considering buying a GMC 2500 HD 4 door with a lift kit (up to 10") and tires.
The truck will have a towing capacity exceeding what I will ever need (22000 lbs).
My questions relates to stability when towing with large tires. I plan on using this truck to tow a 38 top gun with a triple axle trailer.
What kind of problems or handling issues would I expect with this kind of unit?
I would think the problems would be the same regardless of brand.
any ideas? Experiences?

It's been done...
 

I've got no experience with what you are talking about, but I did see this rig at the SEMA show this year. Thought you might appreciate it.

I've got two words...........Re-Gear.

Buck#183

You got an awlful lot of leverage working on that hitch unless you have the struts that go to it.

Seems like there would also be a lot of floating at the tires too?

I can tell you my OLD Chevy wonders and sways a lot more now when I am on the freeway running 70. I lifted this one with 6 inch Sky Jacker springs front and back new shocks and steering suff and put 37 inch Good Year MT on it. I sure a newer truck has less efect though? Charlie

What size tires are you planning on running???? If you stay with 37" or so you will have no problem. I run 37" Goodyears on an 8" lifted Super Duty and it handles extremely well. I consistently pull a 14000lb trailer.

Alot to ask
 

Hey Summer
May I ask what Chevy is rated to tow 22,000 I mean no disrespect, but my new Ram 2001 1/2 "V" 10 has 500 ft,lbs of torque at around 2,000 rpms. [ it has been tweeked] it is rated at 13,000.
Any way it will sway a bit with the tall tires, put a big strain on the "U" joints. like the other guy said, you will need sometype of support struts from the hitch to the frame. And a real beefed up dropped receiver. Man a 38 footer will put alot of strain on the TRUCK, is it a Gas engine ? or an oil burner. I would hope an oil burner. And I would check out the tow ratting of the engine, trans, gears, cooling system. You need a TON of low end Torque.
My experience was pulling a friends 33 Sonic on a steel MYco trailer with a 1991 3/4 GMC 6 wheeler, 4x4 Big Block. We did get a bit of wander , and the braking was a bit touchy. The truck was Not lifted.
I would recomend a NON lifted tow vehicle. How far and How often are you gona tow the Boat.
Best of luck.
Keep us informened.
Vin

Summer, first let me say, I am a Chevy guy till the end and own a 2500 HD and absolutly love it,,,,,, that said,,,Please tell me you did a typo and meant to say 12,000 LBS cuz if someone told you 22,000,,, i'll take some of what they are on !!!!!!!!

I would probably want to do some bracing on the hitch as well,,, instead of pushing and pulling right at the hitch, you have created quite a lever with a big drop.

Also handling stability might come into question,, many veriables there though,,, quality and install of lift kit, and tire sidewall selection. Your going to be pulling alot of weight and if it wanders and sways in normal driving,,, its going to be border line dangerous with a boat yanking the back around.

Heres a pic of my burban....11" lift on 42's, re-geared it to 496. You get alot of bounce around on a bias tires ANY time let alone towing. No one makes a tire bigger than a 38 in radial. The last I heard they were working on a 40" but I don't know if it's been done yet. You go big....38's or bigger, you definately will need to re-gear.


My girlfriends dad has a duramax diesel dually w/the allison trans....Thing is SWEEEEEET!! Tows like nothings back there.

I'm looking at getting a 2500HD duramax crew cab 4x4 (non-dually) slapping the whiplash 15" lift on it, another 5" of body and putting 44's on it....Stand by, it'll be sick!!:D :D :D :D

Heres a shot of my suburban.....


http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/a...postid=429031&

Tank, you are already sick !!!!!

:cool:

G$, You know how we do it dog!!

Pimpin aint easy!!!!:D :D :D :D

I have a 2001 F350 4x4 lifted 5.5" and it has 35" Mickey Thompsons. No probs what so ever. Actually the truck handles a hell of alot better on the highway than it did stock. No body sway at all. Pay the money for a high quality suspension kit, use sway bars and you should have no problems. Wardey

I tow w/ a Turbo Diesel Hummer w/ a 2 in. lift and 38 in. tires. A thing about the tires is that you should definitely go w/ the radials. I used to run Swampers but 6 ply couldn't hold up. I now run 38in. PJ Dirt Grip radials. All of these tires will really heat up while towing. Too much PSI is no good. Start w/ a low PSI.

IF you go big and want to tow a gun it will get hairy !!
I have had many trucks with 8-12" lifts . One with 27" !!!:D YOur rear suspension will be the weak point .Big lift blocks are bad for torque ,you can blow them out of the U bolts (DON'T ASK HOW I KNOW )!! and big arched springs are not much better , They will wonder side to side from the play and the twist in the shackles . Cornering , pot holes, grooved roads , road edges ,etc. will be a real hand full with that big gun behind it at speed . I know a few guys that have turned um over trying to trailer things not near as big as that Cig. I got mine sideways with 12" lift and 44's pulling a car trailer with another truck on it . Went by a truck and the air off of it was enough to make me do about 3 or 4 zig zags . PLenty of guys get away with 4-6 " but much bigger and you need some REAL custom and STIFF springs . A center link on the rear would also be a big help to keep the rear from walking .

This was exactly the responses I was looking for. I have seen and drove a truck exactly like I want to build in the Phoenix area. I think the lift kit is built there, but I will find out for sure. I know it is a very high quality (and expesive) kit.
The truck had 40" radials (I'm pretty sure) with a 10" lift and it drove just like stock or better!
The vehicle weight I was referring to was GROSS vehicle weight as printed in the GMC brochure.
It shows a 6084lb axle weight rating as well. I could not find a maximum trailer weight, but I think it is 12,000lbs.
I agree that tire sidewall would probably be one of the most important factors. I am researching this now.
I will tow probably 5-8000 miles per year.
I think if I can find a good weight distributing hitch and make sure the trailer brakes are in great shape, I would not have too much problem. My days of towing 85+ mph on the interstate might be over, though:D :eek:

The truck I am looking at has the Duramax and an allison trans by the way.



Any dealers want to trade for an '02 Denali loaded (including sunroof) with 22,900 miles?:D

Goodyear is releasing a 40" radial. It is the Wrangler format I believe. It was at the SEMA show. I think 37"s are about the limit when pulling large loads. I run King shocks which help tremendously. No, the truck will not handle a load like a dually, but for a single rear wheel application it works very well. The Chevy with an 8"- 10" lift looks real good with 37"s. My 02.

Cord:
No, this is a 2003 2500HD witha duramax and an allison.
never: 37's look great IMO as well. don't know if 40's would work too well for me.

I have a 2002 F250 PSD with a 6.5" lift and 36" Swamper 10ply Radials...

I towed my 29 fountain from NC to Havasu earlier this year..... I would advise AGAINST anything over 5" or 35" tires....

Here are my reasons...

Tire load...

Most of the tires on lifted trucks are not designed for the loads put on them by towing ... I got the 10plys because they were the highest rated tire I could find in that size. You might as well get a 1/2 ton pickup because that's what your REAL load capacity will be if you use the wrong tires!!

Even those tires were a handful while towing. Lot's of sway compared to the stock Steeltex's. Any kind of groove in the road turns into a white knuckle ride! I almost lost it in Arkansas... they had the left lane paved about 5 inches higher than the right ... no warning and I got over too far to the right.... I ended up in the left median after getting totally sideways lock to lock!!! Luckily the boat stayed on the trailer...

Hitch Load rating ...

I had a Class 5 hitch put on when I bought the truck... well with a 8"+ drop needed my towing capacity was reduced to 5000lbs... I had to get a pintle setup and put a 10k ball on that to get the proper drop and capacity. Even with that I'm still not too comfortable trusting my reciever.

Wind....

I got blown all over the road... from OK to AZ the wind was blowing about 20-40 mph ACROSS the road... It got real old real fast... It get's exciting when you are passing an 18 wheeler or two!!

All this adds up to Fatigue... with the tire noise the wind and the constant steering inputs... well it's not like cruising at 100mph in the beemer ya know?

Anyway... to answer your question... I flew out to Havasu for Labor Day and rented a boat instead of towing agin!!


http://www.division19.com/images/boat/truckboat02.jpg

Oh and one more thing...

Tire pressure... whomever said to keep it low for tire temperature is giving BAD info.. Low pressure + heavy loads = HIGH TEMPS and BLOWOUTS Just ask the many Explorer owners!

I run my tires at 45lbs emtpy and 65-70lbs towing... per the Tire Manufacturers Specs....

Thanks fever: We do have a fair amount of wind in my part of the world, so that is a consideration as well.
I was thinking I might want to look at a dually and a small lift if I am going to tow lots of miles.

Fever 500.

Bro, next time get ahold of one of us in SCOPE, we can work out some room in one of the boats. We're ALWAYS taking on people from the board/back east. Don't be shy to speak up and say you're coming out to Havasu. If one of us is there, you're sure to have a ride on a decent boat;) :D

Tank

Thanks Tank.. I will keep that in mind for Memorial Day 2003!!

Same goes for Lake Pacific :cool:

I read many of the replies but skipped on to the end so I may be redundant.

With the lift you describe, you will #1 raise the truck's center of gravity and roll center dramatically. This alone will make the truck less stable.

Second, the braced drop hitch is required, but keep in mind that when cornering, the tongue load will push the hitch in a manner to cause the truck to roll "into" the corner instead of "away" from the corner. This is because the point of application of load is below the roll center (a lot below it). While this will feel pretty cool in normal driving (sorta like a boat or bike leaning into a curve), in a cornering situation where traction is sketchy, the vehicle will not know how to react.

Whatever lift mfr you use, ladder bars will be an absolute MUST, to keep the rear axle from wrapping under load. Gearing should approximate the stock gearing (shoot for the same cruise RPM). I doubt that you will find low enough gearing to accomplish this.

Plan on losing a lot of torque converters if you can't approximate the stock cruise RPM. The starting load on a tall-effective geared rig will destroy a TC.

Axle shafts must be upgraded to aftermarket ones (Mark Williams or similar). Otherwise the torque will twist them in short order running huge tires with a TG behind.

Huge bias (or even radials for that matter) will cause the truck to wander uncomfortably with much of a load.

With that said - weigh the options and make your own decisions.

My vote is: lift the truck and find a friend who has a diesel 1-ton you can borrow when you need it...

mcollinstn:
I agree withyour assessment. I have found out the truck has a 11" lift with 37" tires. BFG load range D radials, I was told. They may have better tires out by now, I'm not sure.
The lift was done with ladder bars. I am told this guy knows his stuff. He is putting together a bid to fax me with all the components listed. His instructions were to come up withthe best possible combo for towing a 38 Top Gun. He is familiar with the length and weight of the unit, so we will see.

Lift kits, tires, wheels, suspension??????

Sorry guys, can't resist any longer........

:D :D

While we are on the subject, I am thinking of buying an 01 Ford F250 PSD with an 8" Skyjacker Lift and 38" tires. I tow a 2002 25 Outlaw. The boat and trailer weighs about 6000 lbs. Do you think I will have any problems towing this with this set up. It is not a 38 TG by far.

No............I posted a pic of my rig up top...similar set up. You wont have any probs;)

Thisistank,

What kind of drop reciever do you have? Does it have supports that go back up to the truck, like the pic of the truck from the SEMA show.

No, I just have the regular drop reciever, no supports. It's like a 15" drop. I dont really have any problems with sway too bad or the boat pushing me. My suburban stops better w/ the trailer than w/out!! I need to plan my day when stopping:D :D

I tow with a Excursion that has a 13" lift and 38" tires with no problems. The hitch is a custom 15k lbs with a custom drop. I also have been running the strut similar to the one a SEMA for over a year now.

I use to tow with a lifted Suburban. It had a ton of sway at highway speeds and that got old fast!! Don't get me wrong you can pull with a lifted truck it's just by the time you get there you will be worn out from driving your ass off!! The first time I towed with my dually I couldn't believe how much easier it was!! I could actually take one hand off the wheel long enough to change the radio!! Also, instead of driving my ass off at 60mph I could relax and drive at 70mph.

I would go with a mild lifted Dually if your really set on a lift at all.

Also someone brought up a good point, WIND!! As you know here in Kansas it get's a little breezy at times!!

Good Luck!!
What happened to the AWSOME Tow R/V built on a semi you had for sell? I would buy a truck for everyday and pull with that thing!!!

onesloryd,
Is that the PSD? Man that is sweet!

FunHome: That truck is for sale still. Last deal didn't work out and I didn't have time to mess with it.
It would be a great tow vehicle, but I don't tow enough miles to have something that big. Usually I need to drive around a bunch when I arrive. Plus, hotel have room service and bars!!

Here is the pic to refresh your memory:

http://www.offshoreonly.com/gallery/...c00055-med.jpg

I have a 2001 PSD Excursion Limited w/a 6" lift and 35's. I tow a 29 Baja Outlaw that weighs around 8K loaded. My X tows it fine, a little more wander, but nothing bad. Braking will take longer with any lifted truck. Regearing is always good with 35's or larger, not as critical with diesels unless you get up to 37's. You will recoup some of the gas mileage you lose with larger tires. Ladder bars are a good idea. I have been driving lifted trucks for 12 years, 2 Dodges, 2 GMCs, 3 Fords, and I think you are asking for trouble with that much lift for that size/weight boat.
Good luck.
P.S. DO NOT run the air pressure low or you will blow the tires due to excessive heat under load.

Well I drove the truck last night. It has 38" Super Swampers with 8" lift. When the truck is rolling slowly I can feel every knobby on the tire as it is rolling on the pavement. Is this normal? They are also very noisy.

If I purchase the truck the tires will have to go. Any suggestions on a not so agressive 37" to 38" radial tire?

I don't know if there are "New" Super Swampers, but I had a truck with them years ago in 36". For a daily driver, they sucked. Noisy as hell, rode like crap, and yes, at slow speeds you felt every lug. Swapped them out for 35" BFG's, and it made a world of difference.

OK, I finally got some more info on the proposed truck, so I am looking for some real detailed input here.
It is a Fabtech 8" lift, 2" body lift, Helper bags Torque tubes (ladder bars), 17" wheels, 37" BFG Mud terrains (load range D)' on a new Duramax 2500 HD 4x4 with Allison tranny and a chip (bullydog, etc.)

I am still thinking with the proper hitch and some caution, this thing would tow just fine, although I should be prepared for a bit more wander.
Does anyone have any dually ideas? I have seen a few pics somewhere of a lifted dually, but I can't remember where.