I called 700 WLW talk radio today to try to defend us and they put me on hold I never got through!! I told them I wanted to explain a few things about these boats from our point of view he said we will try to get you moved up instead they kept letting the complainers talk:mad: I wanted to let them in on this thread and hopefully get a little proper info out there. OH well I am going to type a nice email tonight and forward it around the media here.
Todd

Sent to Reid Forgrave of the Cincinnati Enquirer
 

Dear Mr. Forgrave,

As an owner of a "Cigarette" stlye boat (we normally refer to ourselves as "performance boaters"), I would like to say that, as a community, we abhor and condemn the apparent actions of the driver of the offending boat involved in Friday night's accident on the Ohio River. By all accounts, this individual has shown a pattern of less-than-proper operation, and this recent incident underscores his irresponsibility in ways that defy common sense.

Our hearts and prayers go out to those innocent victims who were simply out for a pleasant evening cruise and have had their lives so dramatically interrupted. We hope and pray that they all make a speedy and complete recovery.

That being said, I'd also like to take this opportunity to defend performance boaters against those who may feel that we are all irresponsible and reckless. While every demographic group will contain a sufficient number of those who behave badly, I have come to learn over the years that performance boaters as a group tend to be considerably more aware of their surroundings and treat their behavior on the water far more seriously than most boaters. This is only logical, considering the nature of the boats we choose to own. We understand that anyone who is passed by a boat going faster than himself tends to regard the faster boater with some disdain - this is simply human nature. We enjoy our boating lifestyle, and we feel that those who choose to purchase and operate a houseboat, sailboat, cruiser, fishing boat, pontoon boat or whatever have every right to enjoy their boats in an atmosphere of safety and courtesy as well.

There will no doubt be an outcry for new laws or regulations to prevent future accidents of this nature, but the truth is that every law, statute, rule and/or regulation required to prevent such accidents is already on the books. The sad fact is that you simply cannot legislate human behavior.

Oh, that you could.

Chuck Sprague
Reading, PA

PS - For an enlightening look into how performance boaters feel about this accident, visit the "General Discussions" forum area of "OffshoreOnly.com" and view this thread: http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...threadid=53302

Well said C, Allan and I are working on a list of email addresses do send around the city.

Nice job C....I wish I could be so brief....here is what I sent out to a bunch of local media. I encourage you all to send out e-mails as well.....


Dear news persons,

I will try to practice brevity, yet there is much to be said. Your attention to this matter is greatly appreciated. For those of you who know me, you understand my sincerity, for that I am grateful.

I openly hope and pray that the innocent victims of the hit-and-run boating accident last weekend on the Ohio River heal quickly, effortlessly and completely. As an avid boater I feel great horror when these situations occur, realizing that myself and loved ones could have been in harms way. However....blame is being cast upon the safest, most experienced group of boaters on our great waterways. The high performance boating group.

I have been boating my entire life. I am appalled, as are my fellow high performance boaters, at the actions of the driver who caused this horrific scene, then cowardly drove off into the night, leaving the injured for dead. Without question, no group of people, other than the victims and authorities themselves, have a greater sense of outrage than our group of boaters. Boats are life for us, and the river is our back yard. We use it, protect it, brag about it, respect it and love it. We finance it and cherish it. We feel it is a part of us....our lives revolve around it. We also are human beings first, and we want justice....this hit and run has taken place on our turf and we want the perpetrator prosecuted to the full extent of the law. Our waterways are safer without him, a stance we take with great resolve. However, we are getting hammered by the media and citizens due to the actions of someone we CLEARLY do not call our own. Infact, no one in our group of 20 or so even knows this boat. Rare for such a tight group.

In the 6 years I have been in high performance boating, there have been a total of zero accidents caused by any high performance boat on the Ohio River. Infact, I am told there has only been one accident of this sort in the last 10 plus years on the Ohio River. On the contrary, there are literally dozens of boating accidents each season on the river by smaller, quieter, slower, less flashy boats. Infact, just 3 weeks ago I pulled up to Schmidt Field ramp to find a severely damaged boat being escorted to the dock by Hamilton Country Water Patrol. It seems the driver had recklessly lodged the boat under the front of the Hooter's Resturant Barge for over 30 minutes!!....by some great miracle....every passenger survived, even the two 5 year olds on the boat.

I was appalled. Tremendous driver error almost resulting in death, yet I heard nothing on the TV, Radio or in the paper of this accident. It simply did not exist. However, a boat described as a "Cigarette Boat" or a "Go-Fast" boat is involved in an incident, and the town is in an uprage....even the talk shows are covering the matter. Why is this so, I ask? Where is the justice? Why the prejudice and condemnation to the safest and most experienced drivers on the River? On any waterway, in fact. It's a drastic disservice, to be slight.

We are a group of people from all walks of life, from all income levels. We are firefighters, business owners, dentists, mechanics, sales people, computer engineers, college students and the such. Men and women who share a great passion for water. We take pride in our safety record, as well as a the condition of our boats. We take our shoes off as we board our vessles....We consider boating a part of our life and are the most experienced operators on the water, as well as the safest. We carry more safety equpiment than is required by law. Several of us are professional race boat drivers, trained and skilled. We are well respected by those who know maritime matters and most of us have literally 1000's of hours of boating operation to our credit. As well, we are completely enraged by the actions of this cowardly boat driver. The guilty boat was traveling 40-45 miles an hour at impact. Seeing as over 80% of the boats on the water will exceed those speeds, we are clearly dealing with a stupidity/sobriety issue, not a high performance issue. Any reasonable mind can make this determination.

I have read voicestrous reports claiming our boats are worth up to $1 million each....when in reality, I know of only a small number of these boats locally that even exceed $100,000. We are not rich, snobby, self centered, dangerous lunatics as we have been projected. We are normal people who have families and homes and jobs and love our waterways and take great pride in our boats, river and passion. I ask that you please keep this in mind as you pass judgment on this terrible accident and remember that high performance boaters, by the numbers, facts and by the statements of many in the know, are the safest, most experienced and most seasoned operators on our waterways and take great pride in our record. Also, I ask that you understand that we do not know this boat or driver and we are outraged at his selfish, cowardly actions of leaving the scene and hope he is never able to cruise our waterways again.

I invite all media personnel to join me and my fellow high performance boaters any day you wish for an afternoon on the river and see first hand the quality of people we represent. We pray for the victims and will help as asked to be sure this criminal is caught and punished.

Thank you and have a wonderful day!

Allan and C-spray,
Well said by both. Unfortunately, I doubt to see a lot of media attention from "our" point of view. What typically goes unrealized by both the media the enforcement agencies, and the general public is the experience the typical performance boater has. Speaking of myself, and I'm willing to bet that most of you have a similar history, I began boating 22 years ago. I was 10. I grew up on small cruisers (25'). I spent my summers on Lake Erie.
I have learned from experience how quickly conditions on the water can change ( weather, traffic, wind, rising water causing faster running rivers, fog.)
Early on I gained alot of respect for the water, and still have a fear for it. Sound strange to be afraid of the water after 20 years experience? Maybe I should say a respect for the water.
The point I'm attempting to make is the fact that it is rare for someone to go out and purchase a performance boat of this caliber without years and years of experience on smaller boats. Look at our forum boards here. Someone is always looking to "move up" to the next boat. These moves are 99% of the time in small increments. It's rare to see someone jump from a 19' ski boat to a 32' hi-performance with twin motors. We tend to move gradually to larger or faster machines - as our experience and knowledge allow us. Therefore we also tend to understand the conditions, and what our skills and hardware are capable of. To invest this sort money into something you love (the water and the freedom it gives) causes us to be even more cautious than most. We want our guests and fellow boaters to feel safe and enjoy the water as much as we do.
A simple sign of this is how meticulisly (sp?) we maintain our boats. Much less chance for breakdown or hazard to other boaters when we are certain our boats are in top operating condition.
Occasionally you have non-boaters that jump in with both feet and a large bank account and buy something they are too inexperienced to properly use. This is rare, but it does happen.
Plenty of people on this board have large fast boats, some with smaller fast boats, some with slow boats. The key to all of this, - if you have speed, you only use it when prudent, and the conditions exist that allow it. Many of the people "here" are looking to learn more about properly running and maintaining there boats.
The comments by Mr. Jordan make it sound like just anyone can jump in one of these high performance boats and run it wide open. I understand this is his sales pitch, but it is blatantly a lie. This goes for every boat on the water. You must have respect for the water, and understand the capabilities of your boat as well as yourself, and if you happen to know the machine and yourself fairly well, you will be smart enough to know when you and the conditions are proper to use your knowledge.
From my experience in performance boating, we as a community rarely use the performance available to us under the hatch outside of organized events (i.e. poker runs, races, etc..). Most of the time we enjoy tying up together to check out each others boats, or make a dinner run (at cruising speeds). Occasionally we'll make a short quick run, but it is always when conditions are safe, and plenty of others are around in the event something happens.
We, (as in every class of boat - not just Hi-performance) have a few idiots, that disregard the basic rules of common sense and current water conditions.
The accident this past weekend on the Ohio river is the fault of the driver, not the boat. Realization - this same accident could have been caused by nearly any boat on the water with an operator disregarding the basic rules of water safety.
I hope the injured family has a speedy and full recovery from this terrible incident, and I hope they go on to enjoy the water as we do. I also hope they (the family as well as the law) place the blame of this incident on the DRIVER - not the particular craft or type of craft he was operating.

Bouy

They are on to this Putz !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! he is expected to turn himself in today !!! How anybody could leave those people to die & not stop tp render aid is beyond me !!! Thank god they all lived.

They are beating us up badly in the press.."Cigarette" is all they can say. even pics of the 600 Cigarette all over the TV.
I think we all need to be more careful out there !!
stop the high speed passes through downtown & such......Otherwise they WILL harass us to no end......
As always in life....Afew ruin it for the rest

birdog -
I also noticed that that image of a "cig" was stolen straight from the OSO site front page. And has shown up on the news channels.
Hopefully this guy turns himself in - he should have done that yesterday. Take responsibility for your actions! - and again - the actions of the driver - not the boat or the "class of the boat".

Bouy

The people at Moscow boat ramp say it was a triple engine Fountain....1 drive hanging off......This POS is hiding in Columbus Ohio....I did'nt catch if he lives there ? his "Lawyers" have been in tough with authorities......I am going to direct my e-mails & such to the courts... NO PLEE BARGAIN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They need to bring "Maritime" charges against him...these statutes date back to the 1600s or so....."Failure to render assistance" I think they hang you.....

There was a 42 Fountain over at the shop last night with blown upper cases...mainly white with red and yellow stripes? No name on the back, didnt look like much damage. If it is him, I hope he has left already...Do you think they would try me as an adult or as a minor?

WOW! I haven't been able to catch much of the media coverage but this is friggin crazy.

FIRST....This guy must have the book thrown at him!

SECONDLY...The press is ignorant! The mere fact that they are calling it a "cigarette" pisses me off! At least realize that it was a "high performance" or "offshore powerboat". I agree with everyone here! This did not happan because the guy was a "cigarette" boat driver. This happaned because the guy had bad, really bad judgement!! That fact is, no matter what type of boat he was driving it could have happened.

I was with Allan4 when we saw this guy that could not maintain control of his boat and almost killed his whole family by getting lodged under the Hooters barge!! Of course....the media didn't get all over the pleasure boaters with 19-22 feet boats that buy them and have absolutely no skill or training. These are the guys that can't even back there trailer straight!! Yet they think they can go out on the river with their whole family and negotiate the current of the ohio river!!! I DON'T THINK SO!! These guys are a problem. Do you here the media chastising them? NO!!!

Well...I will stop here.......

Byron

Ditto !!! Nice Job.

Its never ceases to amaze me how much sensationalizing the media does in their reporting. Channel 12 does not even know the difference between a "Cigarette" type boat and a tunnel hull as evidenced by their report on the 11:00 Sunday news. Which stated; "A cigarette boat similar to the one shown here".....a tunnel hull!

I agree with all on the board that there was NO excuse for this guy to leave the scene of this accident as he did. However, we don't know all the circumstances surrounding this accident. I pass SEVERAL idiots every year at night WITH NO LIGHTS ON. It might not have been a factor in this incident...but easily could have been in many instances. When people are out at night with no lights on, any accident that results is MORE their fault in my opinion. Again, no excuse for this guy to leave the scene but lets wait for all the facts.

Bouy

You really need to cut and paste what you wrote and send it to the local press. Some great points and well explained.

I have e-mail addresses if you need them, just let me know.

Wildman, thanks,...I think C's is much better than mine, and bouy's also. BAJABOAT wrote some letters last night as well. It's great to see that I am not the only one upseted by this entire string of events. Next time I am out I an going to talk to the local law and tell them our stance and offer our help. They need to know we don't like this stuff and want this guy torched.

They respect us, for they know we are safe and responsible. That is why they leave us alone. They deal with the real issues everyday and know full and well the dangers that less experienced boaters create. I see it everytime I am on the river, and it is never a high perf guy....almost always a smaller run-about boat.

See ya guys. I am heading out Wed night, anyone want to meet up at around 6-7?? Maybe swing by party in the Park?? LEt me know, I got room for one or two more.

Thanks,

Allan

LOOK,

It's a Baja that they're looking at Looks like a 40 outlaw. I saw one out on Friday night at Gun and Knife club. Here's a link to channel 9. They name the guy.

http://www.wcpo.com/news/2003/local/07/01/boatax.html

It was docked at watertown when I was there a couple years back. I remember him buying it, 40 outlaw, 3X502.

News video
 

javascript:void(0)

No kidding!!!

That is not the boat I thought it was, but I have seen that boat out plenty of times. It's a sweet boat. I never thought about it as being the one invloved, they kept saying Fountain.

Well, I'm extremely happy this thug has been tracked down. He needs to be punished terribly. I am going to try to swing over to Watertown later to take a peek.

Looks like it will be forsale soon. Let's hope they repo it, that would be a good start for the punishment.

NICE JOB TO LOCAL AUTHORITIES AND BOATERS!!!! One less person to worry about on the water.

Allan:)

Be sure to take a camera. We want transom shots!

IS this the same guy everyone was discussing earlier ?

Allan,

They're moving the boat. Don't waste your time to going down there. Check out this link to WLWT news. Watch the video. There's barely any damage on this thing!! It doesn't look like it ran over a 21' boat.

http://www.channelcincinnati.com/new...65/detail.html

It sure doesn't appear to have damage worth noting. Lower skeg on middle drive is tore up, ever hit floating debris?

I could only hear audio on the video, so I did not see pics, but if you think about it...how much damage would occur if he just ran over the top of the boat??

I don't know. You would assume it would be significant, but maybe he just hit it right and sort of skidded over the top on the pad. It doesn't seem he had any direct decelleration that is consistent with major damage. Just a thought. You'd think it would be bigtime damage, but you are also talking about probably 12 or 13K lbs vs. 2K pounds. Maybe the same theory as the big truck with bumper damage and the Honda Accord that is totalled?

Just a thought. Sure wish one of us had been at the ramp to confirm if it was him or someone else. Anyone with an eye for these boats would know for sure what boat it was if they saw a pic of it again. I would bet this is the guy, however.

Stay tuned!!

Later....A4:)

Here's a better picture of the drives. It looks like it's torn off. Does anyone know this guy?

TOO OLD said, "I think it's important to remember, he's not a performance boater. He's a jerk off with a performance boat."




Good point!


The boat appears to be a 40' Outlaw looking at the vent covers on the rear.

I agree with TOO OLD!!

I remember having seen him on the river in the past. Hopefully never again........ if this is the guy!

My .02

I once had a small accident with a Rock at 3-5 MPH. Long Story but the boat scrapped the rock on the bottom. $2800 Damage.

This accident would leave a story behind. Hope all is doing well !!It is hard to beleive this guy would just leave like he did.

Sorry just seen the post of the Drive, the earlier pics did not show that kind of damage. Hope he gets the book thrown at him if it was him.

Didn't see that view of the drives:eek: A little more than "debris", I sure didn't see any railroad ties or telephone poles floating this past weekend:eek:

You all have seen him before. He has been on the river at least 3 years that I know of. I have been on the boat (dockside). He runs with two other boats out of Columbus that most of you would recognize. This is such a serious issue, I'll wait to hear what happens before any more comments.

I will say, for what its worth, he certainly is no kid and has been boating many years. Absolute Shame:(

check out cincinnati.com then click on enquier and it should be on the top page. It has a photo of the boat and the a**hole.

I have seen this boat a few times out as well never have talked to the guy. As long as he has been around it is hard to believe he would try to run and hide that boat but we will see what happens. I did not remember that it had tripps or I would have thought of him sooner.
On a side note we have to be even more careful and courteous than we usually are from now on. Let everyone out there know that we are not just a bunch of spoiled rich guys (thanks Jordan) and that we do care about the river and everyone that is on it.
They need to get this guy in jail and keep him there whoever he is!!

And their still referring to this boat as a cigarette boat. I know that pisses a bunch of you guys off!

On www.cincinnati.com they refer to it twice as a 40' Fountain. All the media seems to be good for is spreading rumors. Some people around here even doubt whether or not this is the right guy.

The boat owner and his attorney certainly are doing a good job creating alot of media doubts. I tried to call into WLW today, but they did not get me on before Willy went off the air. The authorities will sort this out, just give them a little time. Like Kentz said...this is serious stuff, so I guess speculation is not the right thing to be doing, I have spouted off enough as it is, so I'll pipe down a little....HeHeHe....

The Cincy Post will be on my boat tomorrow at 5pm outta Schmidt, so if you see my boat, stop by. THe reporter and camera man (still photos) will on board. I am going to give them our perspective of the matter the best I can. 12 news has also contacted me and I hope to give them an interview sometime soon as well.

I hope to drive home the fact that we are not reckless, filthy rich, arrogant people who buy "toys" for millions of $ and drive up and down the river like maniacs. However, tell them we are just normal folks who love boats and so on. Pretty Simple.

I'll keep ya posted. Thnaks, Allan:D

Team Baja : You are correct...The Cigarette stuff is getting OLD !!

Way to go Allan !!! We need to tell the other side of the story !!

This putz is already trying to Muddie up the water....Actualy..his POS lawyer.....They will have to prove he was driving

Allen4, I know you will let us know how it went. If I were you I would have someone you know also video it. That way if they try to spin it, you will have your complete video of what went on. Hopefuly what you say & what they put on the air will not be taken out of context.

Turbo,

Good point. I told the reporter that I would only do the interview if he promised me that this would be a straight up deal and no spins. That he would talk about my/our perspective, otherwise, thnaks, but no thanks. He promised me that would be the case. I trust him.

Thanks....I'll let ya know. I would assume it will make the Cincy Post for Thurs the 3rd. That address is www.cincypost.com

See ya:)

I know someone that works in the national media. Start out TRUSTING NO ONE. Do you think they would say anything difference? They in there mine might think they are giving a no spin story but ?

Good luck & I will be looking forward to the story.

Allan4 -
Go ahead and post the e-mail adresses you are sending to. I'll send in my opinion as well - I get the feeling it is fairly well supported by the group we have here. I commend you for inviting the media onto your boat for another perspective of "hi-performance" boating - (as opposed to all those "cigarette" or "cigar" boats out there - yeah guys, that has been pissing me off too...). I also hope you don't get "spun" on what you have to say.
I'd take you up on the open seats, but Wed's is a bad night. Would love to meet up with you and get on the water, - being new to the area and currently boatless. Let me know when you're going out again - I'll bring the cooler (FOR BACK AT THE DOCK!!).
Hope things go well tommorrow, and I'm very curious how the latest news will pan out.
And once again, I hope the family is recovering well. It kinda pisses me off that the media attention is barely mentioning the family now and are simply going after that evil "cigarette" boat.
My prayers to the family.

Bouy

Guys Allan and I want to do this we are very aware of what might happen if they spin the story. We are going to give them an honest and fair representation of the hobby that we all love so much. We feel that this is necessary to help the media understand a little about what we are doing when we are out there.

I'll be looking forward to seeing the coverage - and from the posts I have read from both of you, I trust you to represent "us" well. Have fun and of course ( not that either of you wouldn't...) be informitive. Educate them on what this is all about. I just hope they give you the courtesy you deserve.
Good luck.

Bouy