GM Vortec 6000 Can it do the job?
 

I have been casually looking at new Chevy/GMC HD 2500 trucks and I'm wondering if the 6.0 with the 4.10 gears can get the job done.

I am real borderline with the boat and trailer weight at around 10,000 lbs and this number is around the max trailer weight in the book.

Anyone towing around this weight with one of these motors? Fill me in on how it performs and if you would do it again if given the chance.

Most of my towing is on flat land and I'm currently using a 99 GMC 1 ton (not a dually) with a 7.4 (454)

Thanks,
Cordell

Cordell, I have used the 2500HD with the 6.0 and with the 8.1L Vortec's.

The 6.0 with the 4.1 gears will pull the boat although will be out of over drive on hills. Overall, this engine /gear combo will give lower economy than the 8.1 with the 3.73 axle ratio.

THe 8.1L that I am currently using is a torque monster. It likes to be loaded and seems to continue to make power on demand. Itow alot from OH to FL & NC going through mountains with 6% + grades (I75) and from TN to AshvilleNC. I am up to 26K miles since December in towing miles logged (28 to 42 foot boats & Stacks of trailers up to 14K lbs in total stack weight).

overall, the 8.1L with the 3.73 gears is a awesome tow vehicle with the best economy loaded & Unloaded. It is really hard to compare the 7.4 to the 8.1.

Bottom line, go with the cubic inches.

If you are getting serious about a vehicle, we are ordering (at this point) 3 of the GMC Pro-Grade trucks (2 3500 and 1 2500HD) all with the 8.1L engines. These truck will have the small GMC Pro-Grade offshore racing logo's on them. Let me know and we can get you into the group promotional pricing through GMC Powertrain- Vortec engines. Studebaker GMC (Scott Studebaker) in Richmond, IN is the Pro-Grade administrator for handling the GM Powertrain (Vortec)discounts. The GMC Pro-grade program does include diesel applications as well although does not include the Vortec Powertrain division contribution.


If you prefer Chevy's ... we are setting up Jeff Layton (Lynn Layton Chevrotlet) - a Formula owner - for the Chevy Vortec program. The certificates come directly from GM and must be signed by an officer of GM.

PS: I have no monetary gain from this program other than enjoying the same discounts. Although I am supporting GM in their marine sponsorship program to even include trailer discounts with new trucks.

This is also a great way to let GMC know we all appreciate their support in Offshore racing.

Yea, but that is a $$$$ option. If your not towing full time, the 6.0 and 4L80E tranny will work just fine. And if you use 4WD low it will walk anything out of a steep boat ramp. Order it without the Onstar and that will knock some money off also.

6.0
 

I used to pull one of my 36 apaches with a 6 liter and it was okay. I got a duramax for my next 36 and what a difference, I pulled that 36 right thru the rockys on the way home from vegas with ease. I am getting a new 2004 dually crew cab tomarrow to pull my customers boats aswell as my next boat, and it will have the duramax and alison again. The 8100 with 373s is also avery good setup the 6 liter is a complete gas hog, I can get 13 mpg hualing 15000#'s the 6 liter gets 10 empty. I a have a cherry 2002 crew cab gmc 2500 that is loaded with leather and duramax and the allison trans. black with graphite int. for $34,900. New trucks are great.Steve

I pull my Sonic 7000lbs + and the trailer with a 6 litre no problem I have 410 gears. DONT pull in over drive ever with a GM truck unless you like to buy trannies.

I agree with just about all above. Do not order/get the Onstar. Waste of money and you will not use it. Everyone under the sun has a cell phone nowadays.

Also, go Big Block or go home. I have the 8.1, and while it sucks some gas mated to the 4L85E in my 2500 Avalanche, it is also a power monster. The Allison and a lighter foot will save you some gas mileage as opposed to my setup, as will 3.73s if you so choose, but I would go for 4.10s.

Its been said on here before, and I like repeating it:

"There is no such thing as too much truck."

10K pounds of boat.
Then fill the tanks, add in your tools, anchor, etc. Then, add 4 people in the truck, and all your weekend gear.
Can't forget beer for the weekend too. You are now talking an additional 3K pounds of total payload.
You are going to be overloaded for what you want to be doing. Think about how pissed you will be (every time) because you could not pass that 18 Wheeler before the median went away and you dropped down to a 2 lane road from 4.

Don't be like a buddy of mine that towed his 32 Sunsation (single) from FL to VA with a 5.3 GMC, and had to leave the windows down the whole time in the dead of summer, as the truck could not handle towing the boat with the A/C on. His two friends in the truck will never let him live that trip down for the rest of his life. :D :D

I've been hearing horror stories about gas milage with the 8.1/ Allison.... maybe your getting better milage down the highway, but as a daily driver I'm hearing 7 mpg?

I could never part with my big block dually for towing.... I buy $1K cars to beat around to work and back.

2002 Avalanche 2500 with 4SPEED AUTO 4L85E, (not the 5spd Auto Allison, so this is not a perfect comparision); 4:10 rear, lighter, wider wheels, slightly bigger tires (245 to 265), true dual exhaust, K&N intake; 19K miles...

10.4 daily driving no matter what. Highway it will do better than that, but that is what my $3K Mazda is for.

BTW, I trust the opinions and information found here on OSO, especially about trucks and towing, moreso than sites like www.pickuptruck.com and www.thedieselstop.com, etc. I read about these 700hp/1100lb/ft tq, Duramaxs, PSDs, and CTD, and Big Block this and that. Truth be known, many, (not all), but many NEVER tow a thing with their truck. Maybe a garden tractor or something. Take what you read here pretty close to truth, at least about towing, as most of us here, really use a truck as get this....

a truck. (Yes Troutly, even those of us with Avalanches.)
;) :p :D

Team V.... you are probably hearing close to correct on the 8.1/4.10 axle package. This is designed for towing HEAVY loads.

New, I was seeing 9mpg - unloaded. Synthetic oil and now with 25K miles / 664hrs I am seeing 11.2 mpg unloaded @ 75mph and 13.6 @55mph. The engine is just now starting to get broken in.

I recently pulled a 42 Fountain from Houston to FL. Got 9.2mpg.

The 8.1/Allison/3.73 axle on the 2500hd has the same hitch tow rating. I am hearing 16 to 18 mpg on this combo. Someone on here has the 8.1/3.73 package ..... I am sure. The engine like to produce low end power and loves to cruise on this combo at 1800 rpm.

Probably should be a different thread ????
 

I have received several PM's on the program so here's how it works.

Note: We should have approved soon the following in addition to the Standard GMC HD Trucks.... 3500HD, 8.1 or Diesel, Allison Trans, 4.1 Ratio, True class V hitch, 15,000 hitch tow rating (Allison /GMC Pro-Grade Series). This will assist in insurance liability, warranty issues and match the rating of our "Allison" hi-tech trailers for offshore high performance boats.

1) Contact me with you contact information by PM or Email. I will contact GM for certificate approval and subsequent issue to administrating dealer. (Up to 2 weeks required) [email protected]

2) during this period select vehicle and which options you want .

3) make initial contact with dealer - dealer will usually contact you.

4) order vehicle and take delivery.

GMC Vehicles will have the Pro-Grade Offshore racing logo on them. Vortec vehicles (Chevy/GMC) will have the Vortec logo on them.

Of course thank GM Vortec for their support in ofshore racing....

Cool....

I had a friend just trade his in because of milage, not sure of how many miles were on it, but he claimed 7 mpg, it was a year or two old, low miles.
And I guy I work with just bought a brand new HD and is claiming 7 mpg.
Neither one of these two really tow anything... and of course are complaining because they thought they were buying a daily driver :rolleyes:

I've always owned full size 4 wheel drives and consider myself lucky to get over 10 mpg.

With the incredible advantages in fuel economy, low end torque, engine life and dependability from the new diesels, why would anyone consider a gas engine for a heavy duty tow vehicle today??

T2x

For me it is the $7,700 added cost for the Duramax/ Allison combination is why I am leaning towards a gas engine. I usually don't keep a vehicle for a long period of time so I just don't know for how many times that I actually tow my boat if it is justifiable to spend the added money.

I went out today and was looking at trucks and some of the prices were topping $50k.
I want to tow my boat and not have to live in the truck.

I did see a nice Chevy HD 2500 Regular Cab LS 4x4 with a 6.0 that had a tow package and heavy duty transmission for MSRP of 33k.

Thanks for the information and I'm still taking it all in. I know that for towing that the Diesel is the way to go but it is all the other little things that I'm also thinking about.

Cordell

I HAVE PULLED 38 TOPGUN WITH MY 03 GMC 2500HD CREW CAB 4X4 , WITH 6.0 AND 4.10 GEARS AND PULLS GREAT........................

I've been very happy with my 2001 Chevrolet 2500HD CC 8.1L/ZF 6-speed/4.10 truck. I can get the same mileage as the 8.1L/3.73/Allison trucks and have all the power advantages of the 4.10 gears. On my last trip I got 16-MPG running empty at 75-MPH and 12-MPG pulling 5,500 lbs. Best of all while towing at 75-MPH I have all the power I need from a nice quiet engine and 6 gears to choose from. I’m very glad I choose not to pay $4,000 for a noisy diesel engine and $2,000 for a mileage reducing automatic tranny.

I also towed a 12,000lb. load from L.A. to Flagstaff when the truck was new with 2,000 miles on the odometer. Coming up the hill from CA the truck got 7-10 MPG and pulled just as good as any stock diesel.

Counterpoint.......


1. The diesels gets 50% more MPG

2. The diesels gets at least 50% more engine life

3. The diesels have a higher resale

4. The diesels are faster while towing

But then again....I have a Powerstroke...maybe the Duramax isn't worth the money.;)

T2x

I have both 7.3 and a 6.0 litre Ford Diesels. I also have a 01, 190k duramax, an 02 duramax and just ordered an 04 duramax with the 310hp/590tq. If I could take the GMC powertrain and put it in my Ford Dually, I would be the happiest man in the world. I will be going to Vegas next week to also check out the new Ford 250's/350's and get hp/tq numbers and see what it will look like, along with the new GT, and Mustang.:D

Not to hijack this thread, but...on the other end of the scale, will my Astro Van (5400 lbs. towing capacity) pull my boat out of the water if necessary? Not interested in towing distances, just want to be able to pull the boat in the event of a hurricane....Up the ramp and a few blocks home.

Boat is 25' Corsa (Cigarette-type hull) with 454/330 TRS. Estimated weight is 4500 lbs. Not sure how much a trailer weighs...

Thanks,

D. Ocean
Pompano Beach, FLA

I went with the Tahoe Z71 with 5.3 3.73
But I have no intentions of towing anything over 25 with
it, I will just trade it in when I get a bigger boat which will be no less than a 29'

on number 1, mine doesnt. it pulls good, not great to me, and gets 10-12 in town, 13-14 on highway and 7.5 pulling a 27 boat with twins. It does have 35" tires, which i know will knock down the mileage, but i wasnt as pleased as i thought i would be. 2001 psd f-250

2,3,4 are correct :D

IF YOU PLAN ON TOWING A 10,000 LB BOAT W/ A 6.0 GET READY FOR DISAPPOINTMENT. THE 8.1 W/ ALLISON IS THE BETTER CHOICE. I TOW A 42' FOUNTAIN FROM OKLA. TO FT. LAUDERDALE BEHIND AN 02 2500 HD W/ THE 8.1 / ALLISON AND IT IS A GOOD MATCH FOR SOMEONE WHO ONLY TOWS LONG DISTANCE A FEW TIMES A YEAR.

DON'T FORGET ABOUT THE TRAILER YOU ARE PULLING NEEDS TO BE SET UP W/ THE BEST BRAKING SYSTEM POSSIBLE. I CAN DEAL W/ NOT BEING ABLE TO RUN UP HILL QUITE AS FAST AS I WOULD LIKE, BUT I HAD BETTER BE ABLE TO STOP GOING DOWN HILL WHEN I HAVE TO.

YOU WILL DO FINE AS LONG AS THERE IS A FELLOW BOATER THERE W/ HIS BIG TRUCK AND A GOOD CHAIN.

IT'S NOT THE ASTROTHAT WON'T PULLIT BUT THE LACK OF REAR TIRE TRACTION ON THAT WET RAMP THAT WILL KILL YOU

MAKE SURE YOU KEEP THE STRAP OR CHAIN W/ YOU SO MORE PEOPLE WILL BE ABLE TO ASSIST

Cgarrett,

I have a 2001 standard 3/4 ton (not HD) with the 6.0

It pulled my Top Gun all the way home from Ft Lauderdale to Toledo! My Friend who picked it up said the power combo worked fine, (he is also a truck driver by trade), he only wished for more brakes and suspension. Both are addressed when you purchase an HD.

Of course more truck is always nice but the upgrade to an 8.1 or a duramax is sizeable $$$$. Of course I would love a duramax dually but I also drive my truck everyday. I work for a Chevy dealer and my next purchase will be a 2500HD with the 6.0.

I trailer my boat a lot in the spring and fall, then I rack and launch in the summer. I also trailer to cleveland and michigan a few times during the year.

Hope this helps

Dan Burtscher

WARPARTY 36 AND I RECENTLY TOWED UN-ORTHO-DOCS TO SARASOTA FROM GRAND LAKE W/ DELO'S NEW 3500 DURAMAX INCLUDING THE TURBO KIT UPGRADE. IT IS A 47 FOUNTAIN ON A VERY HEAVY DOOLIE TRAILER.

THIS CHEVY IS A PULLIN' MACHINE.

I bought my 2500 in 99 before the 8.1 and Duramax were out. It pulled the 272 Baja with no problem.

When I bought the boat shop I was a bit nervouse it wouldnt pull the larger customers boats I would be dealing with. Not to worry.

It has pulled a 38 Sonic, a 36 Outlaw, and a 38 Donzi ZX (owner states 16,000 loaded and with the trailer ).

The Sonic and Outlaw were no problem. It definatly knew the Donzi was back there although I was WAY over cap for the truck too. I just took it real easy getting it going so I didnt hurt anything. Once it was rolling it went down the highway at 55 MPH no problem.

I would say anything under 10k and the 6.0 would do just fine. I get 15 MPG nontowing expressway. 10-12 around tow. and 12 MPG towing the 272 at 65 MPH.

It only has 38,000 miles on it and I have no intentions of getting rid of it anytime soon. It does just fine !!!!

I just bought a 2500HD Crew Cab with the 6.0/4.10. I didn't get the diesel because of the $$. I'm getting around 13 MPG empty. It's not my daily driver so the MPG isn't a huge issue.

I'd like to see some resale statistics gas v diesel. I started out looking for a used diesel. The price between used gas and diesel did not seem as big as the initial difference in price.

I have a 7.3 with 3.73 gears my buddy has a 8.1 Burban with 4.10.....Me..31 Bullet Him..312 Formula........
We tow together up to Lake Erie.....75-80 mph...
He gets me leaving stops...I get him on long hills..
When we arrive he is on E....I still have 1/2 tank of fuel.

Another buddy with a 6.0 gas with 4.10......He can run with me on the flat, although he always has the pedal on the floor {Cant be good}...Hills ? I leave him BAD !

Also...resale on the gas motors is waaaay lower & harder to sell.......You decide

Funny how these threads always end up in a gas vs diesel topic. Both have there advantages and each person has their own unique needs. Why so many boats for example. Some want no thrills go fast/some want TV /Fridge/AC/Genset,etc.

General Motors is putting there money where their mouth is on the vortec engine sponsorship program. They have developed an engine that will hold up to the rigors of racing and using this for R&D. I am thankfull they have chosen offshore racing for the 8.1L. Nascar usually gets the benifit of mfg. R&D.

The torque curve on the diesel is lower RPM thus lower gear ratio (numerically). The 8.1L torque cuve is lower than the older 454 although in the 3500 class is only availabe with 4.1 (due to the fact this is set up for the 16K 5th wheel load. THe 2500/8.1 is available with the 3.73. the 8.1L at 1800 to 2000 rpm gets awesome milage and pulls hard (a 42 Fountain is a comfortable tow).

Back to POST #1 - CGarrett - The 2500HD/6.0/4.1 will get the job done. If you can swing the 8.1L/3.73 you may be happier for both towing and everyday driving as you will be turning lower RPM. Gas milage should be comprable due to Lower RPM and higher torque on the 3.73 gears. You'll also jump from a 10,600 rating to a 12K rating (Same as the diesel).

Take advantage of the discount program and the savings should be enough to More than cover the upgrade to the 8.1.

OK, I'm interested. Tell me about the turbo kit upgrade!
BTW: 2500HD, diesel/allison/35"tires/ 16mpg city/19+ hwy/ 14+ towing 11,000lbs at 75 mph.
Never buy another truck without a Duramax/Allison.

Here are some average towing/empty numbers:

Gas powered:
60,000 miles/ 12.5 avg MPG= 4800 gallons x 1.75/gallon= $8400.00

Diesel powered:
60,000 miles/ 15.5 MPG=3870 gallons x 1.65/gallon= $6387.00

So, using the above example, you will save $2013.00 over 60k miles, not including the cheaper cost of maintenance (change oil every 5k miles in diesel)

Resale value will make up the other cost of upgrade over the gas powered truck, plus you don't have to drive a weenie mobile in the mean time!!
:eek: :eek: :D :D

Yes I know the above are some major assumptions, but tailor the figures to yourself! Who knows what fuel prices will do? I don't.

I pull pretty close to 14,000 lbs in my Chevy Avalanche 2500 with 8.1 Vortec and 4:10 rear end. No trouble pulling uphill and fast as hell without the damn boat.

A personal observation:

When towing with a gas engine and a overall 50 ft length of trailer ......

It's a pain in the A$$ to get into a gas station. Even truck stops can be a pain with 72 Feet of overall length.

Flying J is one of the only stops that have a GAS/DIESEL RV lane.

I still like my 8.1L ..... can run with any diesel through cumberland pass or the notorious Knoxville to Ashville I40 route.

Again ... not that it's better ..... it's personal preference....who knows ..next truck may be the Duramax. Either way, the GM is the most comfortable truck I have ever owned. It is equal in comfort to my Navigator that was traded

I've got a PSD 4x4....at 188,000 miles it has averaged 17.8 mpg non towing.... right at 14.8 mpg towing my 28 Skater.

Most of my gasoline powered friends.....enjoy about 2/3rds of those numbers..... v-10's get half.


T2x

ive always wondered if something was wrong with it. or if it was the 35's. ive NEVER seen 17.8 and would like to, and i dont understand 7.5mpg pulling 7-8k

do you have a chip?

35 inch tires have thrown your odometer off.....
You have traveled more miles than it says !!
This explains your crappy fuel consumption.....

i bought it that way, and i think they have the speedo recalibrated. its within 5% of the gps.

even at 5% better thats 7.9 towing
:eek:

If they did then there is something wrong.
I get about 10mpg.....Towing 11k +.....80-85mph
no mods.....I know it gets much better if i slow down:D

i bought an obdII computer to check it out wondering if a sensor or something was bad, jacking up my fuel mileage, but it checked out fine. i can get it down to high 6's with my foot in it towing.

I dont get it ?......I have a snow plow hook-up on mine that hurts the mpg even more plus I know i am on more hills than you ?.......What gear are you turning ?