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Old 04-13-2006, 06:24 AM
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Default oil filters....

thread running here about " loss of oil pressure" and cause has been traced to " bad fram oil filter".... followed by comment " never use fram again" and various commentaries elsewhere about oil pressure probs vs oil filter manufacturer....

question is.....or more accurately argument and diatribe starter is.... do you really believe that a major manufacturer of filter products ... a 100 million dollar company that has been in the filter business since the beginning of time is actually manufacturing products for sale that will CAUSE you motor to lose oil pressure.... do you REALLY believe that ?

assuming the correct filter for the correct application....and an apples to apples test....

can some filters have a better "micron" rating ? sure

can some filters have different materials and design ? sure

but are you really suggesting that a mercury or wix or napa or autolite or ANY manufacturer filter , installed correctly on ANY appropriate and correctly operating motor will make different internal oil pressures ? really ?

now the observation was made that if the filter becomes clogged ( with what ? i might ask ... ) that the oil will by bypass ( true ) and run hotter and thinner and thus pressure will drop... which is true. but i would respectfully suggest that if your oil filter is full of trash then that trash is the immediate and proximate cause of the pressure drop. sort of like saying that when the rod goes thru the pan that the pan was of bad quality because it now has a hole in it.

i will simply say that i have run every manufacturer of oil filter on every type of engine completely interchangeably for 20 years... from 2500 rpm thumpers to 12,000 rpm screamers with absolutely no dicernable difference in performance and not a single solitary failure of any type from ANY manufacturer.

i would suggest that if mr smith did a back to back test between those two filters now he would find no difference.... that the person that suggested the chk valve being stuck was probably correct and that when the new filter was installed whatever caused it fixed itself.

think of how hydraulics work.... the oil pump is a positive displacement device... if the filter is clogged and the chk valve sticks closed, the oil pressure gage pins and the filter explodes off the motor. if the filter is clogged and the chk vlave works then the gage shows the pressure as a function of flow rate vs viscosity.... i.e. it will start out high and then as the oil gets hot it will go down... if the filter just flows BADLY as in partially blocked then it will be a combination of both.... but the bottom line is that the filter itself can not cause low oil pressure in a motor that has a bypass in either the motor or the filter.

if the relief valve and bypass are miss matched then thats a motor issue... not a filter issue.
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Old 04-13-2006, 06:43 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

Thanks.
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Old 04-13-2006, 07:33 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

I have been using fram filters and few others longer than 20 years and have never even heard of a filter having this kind of problem off the shelf. But when the experts including mercury racing tell me that it is a bad filter, and I change it and every thing goes back to normal. Thats what I believe it is. Did fram and allied conspire to get me. I don't think so. Will it ever happen to me again, probably not. Is it just fram, probably not. But being an american, I can choose a different filter from now on. I choose to also drive a chevy truck over a ford. It is not that I think a multi billion dollar company like ford is out to get me or that if they were compared side by side that one would be hands down a better truck. It is just my choice. Just like the fram filter. As far as mercury racing engine with 32 hours having some kinda problem that was causing this and not the filter. I probably not as smart as you and only have common sense to guide me. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it may be horse, but I'm going to call it a duck for now. Thats just me though.
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Old 04-13-2006, 07:49 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

Steve, if you are going to come on here and accuse people of spreading ignorence and bs, you should have your facts straight. Some research has been done. http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...erm+oil+filter

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Old 04-13-2006, 07:55 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...ram+oil+filter
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Old 04-13-2006, 08:11 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

I've used Fram oil filters my entire life...and I'll continue to use them. You can pay now...or pay later. It's up to you!!!

There is still alot of good information that can be obtained from this website, but lately, you sure do have to weed through alot of "internet experts", teenagers and people who full of chit (who don't even own a boat) opinions to find it. This is just my opinion and it's not directed at anyone who has posted on this thread.


Whew...I feel alot better now!
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Old 04-13-2006, 08:56 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

i am not accusing anyone of anything.... i am simply pointing out or trying to that sometimes the conclusions drawn are not supported by the material facts or even the relevant theory....

its the frog joke.... when you cut off all a frogs legs and yell " jump" and he doesn't... it isn't because he didn't hear you.

i am not saying that mr smith changing his filter didn't solve his problem... what i am saying is that the statistical likelyhood of the filter itself causing the problem is really remote....

and in light of that low percentage, it would be nice to know what the truth is.... in an objective and technical sense.

changing the filter may have fixed the problem... but do you really believe the filter... THAT manufacturer part number ,type, and design are really the root cause ? thats the question... basic , technical and non personal...

if you have a technical argument to make for that.... im happy to hear it.

tell me why and how.

and to pat... i just looked at those threads you sited.... not a single objective technical fact or reference in any of it... none...zero.

Last edited by stevesxm; 04-13-2006 at 09:02 AM.
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Old 04-13-2006, 09:23 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

call me simple but I like the frog joke. If you cut off his legs and yell jump and he doesn't. It could be that he does not listen so well or that he is VERY stubborn, but I'm saying that I think he does not jump because he has no legs. Same thing on the filter. When every thing is fine and the only thing you do is add new filter and lose oil pressure and the great people on oso and the techs at mercury racing tell you that it is the filter and I change it and that fixes the problem. It may be the type of beer that was in the cooler or maybe like the frog, it could be just a stubborn motor or maybe it was the fact that it was a saturday in april, I'm going to call it the filter that was causing the problem and the frog isn't jumping because he has no legs. You are free to call it what you want. I'm just happy that its fixed.
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Old 04-13-2006, 09:29 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

On the original Oil Filter Survey thread it was said that they had a problem with the elements collapsing and blocking oil flow. Unfortunately the link no longer works. I posted those threads anyway because they are full of good info . It does say that Fram standard filters are not reccomended. If I can find that info I will post it. A few people on this website have posted the same thing. I think Frank, 10x on the board, said it happened to him.
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Old 04-13-2006, 09:36 AM
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Default Re: oil filters....

Here is a theory for you guys. Is it possible that, because of cold water temps, there was excess condensation in the oil and the oil temps hadn't risen above 212 degrees to boil it off causing the element in the filter became wet and reduce flow? I do remember that someone had said that the element in the Fram filters is made of a different material which people thought made it unacceptable for marine use.
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Last edited by OldSchool; 04-13-2006 at 09:39 AM.
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