Non-Toxic antifreeze says "not recommended for boats"..?
Charter Member
10-05-2011, 07:47 AM
#12
Found West Marine has antifreeze that has the corrosion protection.
I ASSUME (??) that it is different than Auto antifreeze in some way.
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...classNum=10996
West Marine Pure Oceans -60° (-51°C) Marine Antifreeze provides the ultimate in cold weather and corrosion protection for drinking water systems and all engines. Its premium additive package prevents corrosion of aluminum, copper, brass and solder, but will not harm rubber, seals or hose materials. The 3X-died purple color provides excellent blow-through visibility. Formulated with nontoxic, virgin Propylene Glycol (35% Blend), it is tasteless and contains no alcohol. This product is ready-to-use; do not dilute it.
Provides burst protection to -60°F (-51°C) and freeze protection within a range of +7°F to +10°F (-14°C to -12°C)
When testing with a refractometer or with a hydrometer designed for use with PG, freeze point readings on the PG scale will range from +7°F to +10°F
I ASSUME (??) that it is different than Auto antifreeze in some way.
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...classNum=10996
West Marine Pure Oceans -60° (-51°C) Marine Antifreeze provides the ultimate in cold weather and corrosion protection for drinking water systems and all engines. Its premium additive package prevents corrosion of aluminum, copper, brass and solder, but will not harm rubber, seals or hose materials. The 3X-died purple color provides excellent blow-through visibility. Formulated with nontoxic, virgin Propylene Glycol (35% Blend), it is tasteless and contains no alcohol. This product is ready-to-use; do not dilute it.
Provides burst protection to -60°F (-51°C) and freeze protection within a range of +7°F to +10°F (-14°C to -12°C)
When testing with a refractometer or with a hydrometer designed for use with PG, freeze point readings on the PG scale will range from +7°F to +10°F
10-05-2011, 08:34 AM
#13
Registered
10-05-2011, 10:54 AM
#14
Everyone at our marina uses it. Used it for yrs, no problems. Too many people get scared if it isn't made by mercury. 
Can be bought at Menards $2.79/gal.
Can be bought at Menards $2.79/gal.
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bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.
10-05-2011, 05:10 PM
#15
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Stuff with Propylene Glycol is what you want to use. You DO want to make SURE it screams that it has corrosion inhibitors. Plumbing-based antifreezes, though, can have only "yellow metal" corrosion inhibitors. A "proper" marine antifreeze will have Propylene Glycol, Corrosion Inhibitors, and pH buffers.
Also, any ethylene glycol based auto antifreeze will keep your motor from freezing and will protect the metal, but it is a BIG NO NO to allow ANY of it to ever get into a lake or river. Closed cooling only.
MC
Also, any ethylene glycol based auto antifreeze will keep your motor from freezing and will protect the metal, but it is a BIG NO NO to allow ANY of it to ever get into a lake or river. Closed cooling only.
MC
I got enough on my plate to deal with.
10-06-2011, 07:52 AM
#18
Registered
I work in the Environmental, Safety and Health field. The company I work for makes de-icers and anti-icers for aircraft, and we use a huge amount of Propylene Glycol (PG)and Ethylene Glycol (EG).
Propylene Glycol has lower toxicity to humans and animals than Ethylene Glycol. That is why it is marketed for RV use in water systems, and why it is marketed as a lower toxicity alternative in the auto market.
However, there is no difference whatsoever in the two with respect to marine toxicity - ie, neither one is highly toxic in the marine environment, and both are easily biodegraded. Actual information, not marketing hype below:
http://www.riskworld.com/Abstract/19...p/ab6ad040.htm
To give you some idea of the concentrations used in de-icers, we are talking 70% solutions - higher than we typically use, and there is still no difference in toxicity. Both RV & Auto antifreeze use the same anti-corrosion packages, so there is no difference there.
So, it is perfectly fine to use auto antifreeze in your engine, it will not harm the aquatic environment any more then the pink stuff (PG) will. Just don't use EG in any system that humans will drink from.
Propylene Glycol has lower toxicity to humans and animals than Ethylene Glycol. That is why it is marketed for RV use in water systems, and why it is marketed as a lower toxicity alternative in the auto market.
However, there is no difference whatsoever in the two with respect to marine toxicity - ie, neither one is highly toxic in the marine environment, and both are easily biodegraded. Actual information, not marketing hype below:
AQUATIC TOXICITY
Most published studies are best characterized as acute or subacute exposures. Based on available data, the relative acute toxicities of EG and PG are very similar. LC50s values for freshwater and marine fish invertebrates and algae for EG range from 7,900 mg/L-111,000 mg/L and LC50s for PG range from 10,000 mg/L-79,700 mg/L. The acute toxicities of commercial ethylene glycol and propylene glycol aircraft deicer/anti-icer formulations are also similar across groups of organisms encompassing producer (algae) and consumer species (daphnids, minnows). The range of acute LC50 values across all taxa for propylene glycol Type I deicers (50% diluted, deicer formulations applied hot to aircraft to break-up ice which has already formed) is comparable to that for ethylene glycol Type I deicers. The ranges of toxicity reported for ethylene and propylene glycol Type II anti-icers (non-diluted, anti-ice formulations applied cold to aircraft to prevent ice formation prior to takeoff) are also similar, although Type II toxicity appears to be more variable. All Type I deicers tested are of very low acute toxicity (freshwater LC50 > 1000 Mg/L), while virtually all Type II anti-icers are more acutely toxic (50 < freshwater LC50 < 1000 mg/L).
Based upon the limited available data, no general distinction can be made between aquatic toxicities of ethylene and propylene glycol formulations.
Most published studies are best characterized as acute or subacute exposures. Based on available data, the relative acute toxicities of EG and PG are very similar. LC50s values for freshwater and marine fish invertebrates and algae for EG range from 7,900 mg/L-111,000 mg/L and LC50s for PG range from 10,000 mg/L-79,700 mg/L. The acute toxicities of commercial ethylene glycol and propylene glycol aircraft deicer/anti-icer formulations are also similar across groups of organisms encompassing producer (algae) and consumer species (daphnids, minnows). The range of acute LC50 values across all taxa for propylene glycol Type I deicers (50% diluted, deicer formulations applied hot to aircraft to break-up ice which has already formed) is comparable to that for ethylene glycol Type I deicers. The ranges of toxicity reported for ethylene and propylene glycol Type II anti-icers (non-diluted, anti-ice formulations applied cold to aircraft to prevent ice formation prior to takeoff) are also similar, although Type II toxicity appears to be more variable. All Type I deicers tested are of very low acute toxicity (freshwater LC50 > 1000 Mg/L), while virtually all Type II anti-icers are more acutely toxic (50 < freshwater LC50 < 1000 mg/L).
Based upon the limited available data, no general distinction can be made between aquatic toxicities of ethylene and propylene glycol formulations.
To give you some idea of the concentrations used in de-icers, we are talking 70% solutions - higher than we typically use, and there is still no difference in toxicity. Both RV & Auto antifreeze use the same anti-corrosion packages, so there is no difference there.
So, it is perfectly fine to use auto antifreeze in your engine, it will not harm the aquatic environment any more then the pink stuff (PG) will. Just don't use EG in any system that humans will drink from.
Last edited by apollard; 10-06-2011 at 07:56 AM.
10-06-2011, 09:34 AM
#19
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iTrader: (2)
I winterized the boat this year with antifreeze from my local pool place. It is either pink or blue -50F non-toxic, usually says R/V, pool, etc. This year it was blue, said Swimming Pool Plumbing Antifreeze. I put it in, but when cleaning up the bottles read the back and it said "not recommended for boat engines or auto radiators." Any ideas why? Ingredients include ethyl alcohol. I tried to reseach effects of ethyl alcohol online and can only find info about ethanol fuels. Is this bad for rubber? Bad for metal? Maybe it's ok? Thanks ahead.
I've always been told the "ethyl alcohol" will prematurely deteriorate rubber hoses. The alcohol can dry out the interior of the hose and would likely affect your impeller as well. Look for glycol based instead.
10-06-2011, 05:25 PM
#20
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