you forgot about grooming his dog and washing his truck:lolhit::angry-smiley-038::party-smiley-004:

It sounds to me like Mr G has the hot ticket with changing out the xr gears to x gears. Anyone know the cost of an x gear set?

you should put fresh XR gears in one of your drives and Mr g's x gears in the other and let us know which ones last longer :party-smiley-004:

Now that's a idea West cost!! That might just give us an idea what is what.
One thing, XR gears from 5yrs back, would hold up for a while. Usual time was 250-300hrs, with 600-700hp. I had one friend that ran 1170hp in a light boat and it was WOT passes all weekend long. He would get about 60-70hrs out of a set of uppers and lowers. Just regular maintenance for him.
I have over 300hrs on my B1-XR at about 700hp. The older gears were built better. They would last longer and the lash variation was minimal. These days, a boat like SD's should go 300hrs.. but they wont. The problem with the netforged upper gears is spreading to the lower gears also. I see the same results with upper and lower gears, pitting at an early age. It seems there are some that will live longer. That tells me they are not all the same. Different batches? Different suppliers? I dont know, I do know, they dont last long anymore.
Now the track record for the Imco SCX gears is much better. So why cant Merc sell the same type of gear??

SD, Actually the 1.5 ratio is made up with the combination of gears in upper and lower. The helical upper gears can be had in 1.36, 1.5, 1.65. And the lower gears can be had in 1.36, 1.5, 1.65. You mix and match to get a result.
When the XR gears came out, you can only get the 16/19 set. So they offered different lower gears to make the ratios that used to be made in the helical uppers.

That being said. The 1.5 helical upper X gears are about $980. The 1.36 upper gears are about $860. So you would think that would be the way to go. But the 1.36 upper gear teeth are narrower than the 1.5 (will call this a weak point). So if you want the 1.36 ratio, I put the 32/27 upper gear set (1.5) and the 15/17 lower gear set (1.36) to make a stronger setup. Now the hard part to swallow is that the 15/19 (1.50 is about $560 and the 15/17 (1.36) is over $850.

The least expensive way to go is the 1.5 ratio. If you are not in the top of the prop pitch range, you are better off with the 1.5, in my opinion. Some people have seen some likeable traits with the 1.36 in there combinations.. so the more expensive route is recommended.. Going fast isnt an econimcal sport.. :(

Now it is the Christmas season and it is time for us to all pony up for the bean counters at Merc. Every year the big ticket items from Merc get a price increase after the first of the year.. So all this talk about expensive gears will be a mute point when the are repriced and are even more expensive. Merry Christmas Merc!! :(

But are you confusing an X with an XR now? There are no helical gears in this drive.

So what I wanted to know is if you would have to certainly replace the lowers in my drive even if they are fine?

I would need a 1.5. Anything else and I have to re-prop all over again and it's expensive and time consuming.

Would the fact that the lowers are completely submerged in oil full-time have anything to do with them lasting longer or no??

The uppers are not submerged. The drive gear or "pinion" is about half way. The forward driven gear is under at slow speeds but it is pushing a lot of the oil off of it as it turns faster.

The reverse gear is out of the oil and just gets a light bath from the journals coming out of the cap...

Also, are the lower gears the same as the Bravo I and I X or does the XR have bigger lowers as well?

I've seen them both in hand and I can't remember the XR's being any different but I've only had one XR lower apart in my life.

And so far I'm convinced I can find the XR uppers without buying them from Merc. We'll see if I crash and burn.

I was referring to the X gears. Swapping from XR upper gears to X upper gears you would use the XZ gear set. They are the same as the X gears for the B1, except the pinion gear accepts the larger XR yoke.
The XR's ratio is changed in the lower. The B1's used to be changed in the upper, but the better way to do it is with lower gears.

If 1.5 is what you have and what you want to stay with, then the lowers would be the same in either case, and would stay.

If you can get gears from someone other than Merc, they are still made by Merc. No one as of yet, has successfully marketed a replacement set of gears.
I did hear of gears being made at one time a few years back. But they never showed up on the market.
If someone would do it.. it would be great!! For the cost of making replacement gears for the XR.. you could buy a truck load of SCX's.
That is the easy way out for reverse engineering the XR gears. :(

Hmmmm

The box of broken parts I have out of an X drive look the same as my XR parts regarding the input shaft and the other end of it. The gear looks like the only difference.

Could there be different versions?

Mercury doesn't make gears. They sub it out to contract and then resell it.

I know for fact the X gears can be bought at Kaman. I've not ever tried to buy the XR gears there. Regardless, someone is making them for Merc even if we can't get our hands on the supplier (may be under contract to not offer on open market).

When you put X gears in the XR case, do you still use shimming with merc part numbers etc or do you have to use your own secret formula??

What do you typically charge to do this?

And yes, I have 1.5 ratio.

Thanks Dick!

The X gears in the XZ drive have the same size splined shaft for the input yoke. Meaning an XR input shaft will fit the XZ pinion gear. The driven helical gears are the same. Only diff is the size of the input in the pinion gear.

You are correct, Merc doesnt make them, they have some one else make them. I am surprized that Kaman can get and sell them. Merc usually ties things up, so you cant. Be interesting to find out if they can get the XR's.
The shimming method is the same. Just different numbers on lash. The new method that came out with the hump backs is the common method for all the Merc Bravo's.

I will have to pm you on the last question.. :(

Dick