604 CI Build sheet
 

I have listed below my build sheet so any input on cams would be great. The goal is a low Comp motor running between 3000 and 5500 RPM.

604 CI motor build sheet
Below is a list of parts for the building of three 9:1 low comp motors

Merlin Aluminum blocks 10.2 deck 4.560 bore with cam bearings
Callies magnum pro series Cranks 4.625 stroke
Oliver billet rods 6.660 length upgraded bolts
JE pistons and rings JE tool steel pins
Cleveite H race M.B and R.B
Brodix Full CNC 332 oval port heads # 2038002
Inconel exhaust and stainless steel intake valves
Comp HYD roller cam and lifters
Jensel shaft rocker assembly
Billet timing set with Cloves alum timing cover and pointer
SFI balancer
Marine head gasket and SCE lower gasket set
Moroso oil pan # 20032 with pump and shaft wielded
Alum valve covers with cut corners to clear exhaust. No logo
Brodix intake spacers and distributor oil pump drives.

I think the heads are to small for an intial build. They are likely very good for your application now, but leave very little room for turning up the power. I'd like to see some flow numbers of the heads.

BP BB-3 XTRA O 332
(CNC Ported/ .200 .300 .400 .500 .600 .700
50° Valve Job) 2.300 Intake 153 231 300 354 396 424
1.880 Exhaust 130 177 239 278 284 290

Sampson why did you not go with the Donovan Alum 11.1 deck and use 7.5 lenght rods ??? looks like your Heads are gunna be too small ... good luck on your project need pics when ya get rollin :drink::drink:

I'm limited to HP by my ZF85A transmissions and they are the only one with a drop type trans that will work for my set up.
These are bolting to Arneson drives ASD-8.
My goal is 700HP to 750HP so I hope the cam selection works out. Do you feel I will not get there with these heads?

Could go bigger, but with the right cam, intake and exhaust those heads could make close to 800hp. The 351's wouldn't be a bad choice either, the bottom end should be about the same and they would add a little at the top. Any clue on cam specs ?

I like Profiler Cylinder Heads 375 Sniper Full CNC ported 2.350/1.850, 24 degree, 119 cc chamber, 375 cc runner

.200 .300 .400 .600 .700
Intake 2.350 153 239 300 410 445
Exhaust 1.850 137 182 226 298 306

These heads are $1,295.00 bare, for cost comparison. The larger runner allows the engines to be turned up at a later date.

I am working on a tight budget and my engine builder said they were more money.

they were more money:eek:


Yes indeed they are , good luck on your build and dont forget the pics .:drink:

What type of cam is going to get me at 800HP?
I was going to use a custom grind from Comp Cams. I do not remember the full spec but I think the said a lift around 640 to 660 and duration of 248? I'm just not sure.

I think your right on the cam info. I would use a 248I/254E duration @ .050 on a 114 LSA. Those profiles will support .660 - .680 lift with good spring durability.

Bob Medara !!!!!!! is your best bet to get the cam u need !!!

Ken those heads will work PERFECT for your application , and if you need more Hp at a later day put a blower on ...:drink: you'll need to add some duration to the cam shaft

I think you could use more than 248/254, the GM ZZ 572 runs 254/ 264 and makes peak HP at 5500. This is just an opinion, I'm not an engine builder.

***

Ken I have a cam that I just pulled out of my 598. It is a solid roller it is .730 lift Int. 262 and ext. is 269 112 ls and it made 827 hp at 6300rpm on the dyno if you want it give me $150.00It is a RM Builder cam

I have a Solid roller cam and lifter setup as well for sale. PM me if you are interested and I will give you some specs. Made 800hp in a 598ci N/A at 6300rpm.

Ken give Bob a call i think you'll like what ya hear, no need for a SOLID and the Xtra work that goes along with it ..He just dynoed a 1430 Hp motor with a Hydraulic .good luck

Sweeeet good luck on your build Ken we have a similar one in the worx :drink:

I have a project- a compound project:

600 inch BBC (4.505 bore x 4.625 stroke)

The Block is a Donovan 11.1 Aluminum block.

Crower crank with Olds style mains and center thrust, BBC rods, BBC oil seal.

Oliver 7.5 rods with pin oilers, good bolts.



8.8:1 static compression.

AFR CNC 357 heads.

Custom manifold.

Automatic Reseting (linear motion with Teflon for all fuels) Blow off/backfire valves.

Intake manifold EGT.

Exhaust EGT’s.

Two bank Wide Band 02’s

Isky red zone bushing lifters.

Custom Solid roller with appr. .750 lift intake and Exhaust with 290/300 on duration. 114deg CL installed +2deg.

14:71 Magnesium blower- my plan is to make 6lbs with that unit and run the turbos on top of the blower.



Currently Crane Hi-6 and crank trigger.

Hey RunninHot, what intercoolers are you using? Who's making the manifold? Sounds like a cool build (both you and Ken).

Who is Bob? Do you have a number?

We are not using an under the blower cooler.

The water/alky will still be there.

We are buying an off the shelf cooler to put after the turbos.

We are making the manifold inhouse .

Rob Madera 585-654-8583

Thanks. I just wanted to be sure I am ordering the correct cam. My engine builder came up with the below spec. This seems a little small to me.

Did you talk to Rob yest , sharp as a Tack :drink:

That would work nice in a 454

I did get to talk with Bob. However he was running out the door to catch a plane. I have decided to call Crane cam and based on my build this is what they came up with.
690 Lift 262/274 @ 50 LS 114 with 1.8 rockers.
I wish I knew enough to say go ahead. Bob will be back in town early next week so I guess I should wait.
Thanks

My recommendation was on the conservative side based on your rpm limitations. I use that combo as the maximum size hydraulic roller in a 572 application and have alot of good experience with it. The cam your builder proposed is very small in my opinion, it will make a ton of torque but I don't think it will carry up the rpm range. I consider 248/252 @ .050 the smallest duration I would use for your application. The 1.8 rockers are a great recommendation. They will put extra lift on the valve and allow a less aggressive camshaft ramp profile, keep in mind they have a net effect of slightly adding duration to the camshaft. Good Luck.

Ken wait it out a few days till Rob gets back ,and he's also a dealer for 30 parts companys so can he can save you some coin $$$$ i know your Antsy but whats a couple dayz ??

What he said :eek:

for some reason i just like Radical/agressive cams and adjusting Valve lash all the time .:party-smiley-004:

That's what makes boating truely special!!

That should make some good power. Hopefully you are going Hydraulic. the reduction in maintenance isnt huge, but in the long run they are much easier on the valve train as a whole.

The solid cam that I have is a .697/.697 262/272 @ 50 with a 112LSA. It also has the 7/4 swap. It made 800hp at 6300rpm in a 598ci.

Phil- didnt you end up needing a vacuum pump?

I remember talking about your monster BB earlier.

I would think Ken should likely provision for one as well.

"Uncle" Dave Sampson

Nope, the blowby I was getting was crazy. Even with 6" breather extensions it was still blowing a quart of oil out every two hours or so. I was thinking of installing a puke tank or a vacuum system to help with this problem that was, as per the builder, "just a little crank windage".:lolhit:

Best thing that happened was dropping a valve and forcing a rebuild. When i picked the motor up from Rudy Dryden last June, he handed me a bag full of the breather extensions and said "I dont know what you want to do with these, but you dont need them anymore." Turns out the top ring gaps were HUGE, and all over the place, resulting in 12-15% leak downs at 59 hours and massive blowby. After Rudy rebuilt it, it blows by ZERO oil, even during long WOT runs. What happened to the windage?? I dont know either.

So no, no vacuum pump for me, just a competent rebuild job.:coolcowboy:

Congratz BIG Daddy :drink: Rudy knows his stuff and he just finished another 1 just like yours that was Brand new & came from here in ill .

Ken you'r gunna end up with 250/258 @ 50 112 :ernaehrung004:

So are you also thinking less lift? I know when I talked to Bob he said 114 to 115 plus 6 LS due to the EFI set up.I'm not sure what the plus 6 means.

Advanced 6 degrees in the motor.

The plus 6 LS probably means a six degree lobe separation split between the intake and exhaust centerline. A 114 LSA camshaft as an example, would be 250 degree Intake / 256 degree Exhaust @ .050 lift (Thus six degree split) then the intake centerline would be at 108 degree and the exhaust centerline at 120 degree (Thus six degree split) for 114 LSA. I'm just guessing about his terminology, but this is common for custom camshafts. I don't use Bob Madera (Marine Kinetics) for my camshafts, but I highly recommend him for his knowledge and ability to provide competitive pricing on components. I would definately wait for his recommendations and compare them to the Crane info. He has extensive marine experience. Good Luck.

The plus 6 means there will be 6 deg. of advance ground in the cam. That means a cam with a LS of 114 will have an exhaust centerline of 120* and an intake centerline of 108*.
Eddie