ezstriper

ran their carb on my top sportsman camaro race car, and now using one of his on my procharger set up...both were damn close out of the box...Patrick knows his stuff...PS never seen the grooved throttle shaft in several years now...

mcollinstn

Sometimes you roll the dice and it pays, sometimes it does not.

You seem to have a pretty cavalier attitude about "other people's money". The insurance company doesn't WANT to pay out on a boat loss, but they will as long as there is no reasonable way out for them. A $30k boat has a shorepower receptacle short out and cause a fire and sink, they will have the receptacle examined to see if it was installed properly and grounded and fused properly. If so, then they will pay. If a $30k boat blows the engine hatch off at a fuel dock and sinks to the bottom, they will determine whether you were using your bilge blowers properly, and what might have contributed to the explosion. If they find non-marine components in the fuel system, you're looking at a problem.

If it happens to a $300k boat, you're looking at an even bigger problem.

They don't have to prove the carb caused it to sink. The wording in the policy is such that they can deny the claim based on owner-installed-unapproved-engine-modifications if they wish. Some policies can technically be considered void from the date of the unapproved part's installation, causing the loss to have occurred "during a time of noncoverage" making it completely irrelevant whether the carb CAUSED anything or not. Don't EVER act like you can intelligently predict what the insurance company WILL or WON'T do. It's far more productive to educate yourself on what they CAN and CAN'T do, and to be aware of the area between those two extremes when making decisions about this sort of thing.

Most insurance claims go smoothly with no problems. There are, however, some that do not. The insurance company is not in business to cover losses. They are in business to provide financial security to the owner in case of an unexpected covered loss. They are banking on the loss NOT OCCURRING at all, and if the owner makes changes to the boat that THEY deem to increase the risk of loss, they can certainly deny to cover loss if it occurs.

As I said, you can flail your hands around saying you've never seen a claim denied for a non-marine carb, but I believe it to be irreponsible for you to be advising people to dismiss this element from their decision.

I had lots rather make sure people understand what CAN happen, and then let them make their own decisions about it.

MC

WOTW2E

Excellent information and perspective mcollinstn. Nice post. Thank you.

HaxbySpeed

Thanks for explaining how insurance works.. Your new scenario is a little different then your first explanation which is what I responded to.

Strip Poker 388

iTrader: (6)

Im betting most of the big blower motors with carbs are not marine carbs ,especially the dominators.

I hate insurance companies,but ya pretty much got it have it,like mcollinstn said they look for reasons to deny,especially if your not the named insured

"Thats a non covered loss"

mcollinstn

Hax,

Roll your eyes all you want. I still stand by my FIRST comment (the one you responded to). I don't give a rat's shiny rectum whether you need informed how insurance works or not - bottom line is that YOU are giving advice that SOUNDS like you are ENCOURAGING people to IGNORE the FACT that using a non-marine carb CAN DEFINITELY result in a BAD outcome.

I've had boats with non-marine carbs, I've had boats with marine carbs modified in such a way as to make them noncompliant. I've had boats with other noncompliant modifications. I've had boats that have sunk, that have caught fire at one or more occasions, or have been stolen. I've had lucky dealings with insurance companies, and I've never been denied coverage when I needed it - BUT I made any and all of the choices related to the above with FULL KNOWLEDGE that I could indeed be on the short end of the stick regarding insurance if the pendulum didn't swing "my direction".

Your post, and some others, seem to insinuate that you have "inside knowledge" and that it is "unmanly" to bother with such small nitpickings.

Lots of people read these forums and take your advice as gospel. Heavens knows that nobody should make critical decisions based on forum chitchat unless they run it by somebody they personally trust, but they do. I think it's great when people get advice here, but I don't like seeing advice that CAN get people into trouble.

I have zero problem with guys making informed decisions that put them at risk. I just don't like seeing advice on the forums that can lead to UNinformed guys making decisions that they do not KNOW might be putting them at increased risk (for safety, reliability, insurance coverage, or whatever).

To try to cement my position here, I know there are LOTS of marine applications that are better served by using a carb that won't have a marine certification. I just want the average guy reading this to know that doing so technically does put the insurance company in a position where they CAN deny covering a loss.

I keep picturing some guy new to the forum - freshly purchased 1978 Wellcraft in the garage needing a motor. Guy collects parts and cobbles together his motor. Is still missing a carb and runs across your post. Sees that you are a professional builder, and decides to ignore the marine carb thing. Puts it together with what he can find and later suffers a bilge fire that puts his boat on the bottom. It also catches the commercial dock he's tied up at on fire and a kid who can't swim dies. The guy had insurance on the boat cause, while it wasn't a high dollar boat, it was all he could afford. The death of an innocent brings in professional investigators and police investigators and it is discovered that the boat was not rigged properly. You can fill in the rest of the blanks, but the bottom line is that it is NOT COOL to be a contributor to a chain of events like this.

That's all.
I'm getting off my soap box.

I like you Haxby. If you hadn't felt the compelling need to add the rolled eyes I wouldn't have felt compelled to further elaborate.

Everybody have a safe New Years.
MC

HaxbySpeed

You should probably stay indoors, a kid who can't swim might fly through the air from his exploding boat and crush you!

I understand your point and I'm sorry if you found my post to be too cavalier. I found your post about not being insured if your boat sinks and has the wrong carb to be a little reactionary. I deal with insurance companies, claims adjusters, and engineers on a regular basis. We currently have seven marine insurance related jobs on the go. I have been to court both for and against insurance companies. YES, if your carburetor that is non certified is the direct cause of an incident you're gonna have a tough time talking your way out of it, insurance companies look for any excuse not to pay.

As far as the carb thing goes.. A lot of regulations haven't changed for 30-40 years but, the quality of the components used in modern marine engines has vastly improved in some key areas like fuel and ignition. The tests that a "marine" carb needs to pass are very easy for any modern, quality carburetor to pass as well. There is always some risk and possibility of a chain reaction of unfortunate results resulting in some disaster. I'm not advising anyone to do anything. If you want to go online and check out the marine carb requirements it's all available, make your own decision and be responsible for your own actions.

No hard feelings MC, if we ever meet I'll buy you beer, or scotch, or whatever the hell you drink.

Sledge Hammer

While I agree about the safety comments on the Auto v Marine carb, the comments relative to insurance are not accurate. Insurance companies are heavily regulated by each State Insurance Department. The only way to deny a claim is if there is a specific exclusion allowing them to do so. Go read your policy and take note of the exclusions in the Comprehensive portion of the policy. I wish someone would read their policy and quote the actual exclusion. Quote the page number and any identifying section numbers. Then identify the name of the insurance carrier. That way we will all know which carrier to avoid. My policy carries no such exclusion. People throw this insurance stuff out all the time, but their opinions are usually based on urban legend rather than actual facts. They have a friend of a friend that they heard his claim was denied. Do your self a favor and read your policy, specifically the exclusions. Don't buy these comments about the "insurance company will deny coverage" unless a specific exclusion from your policy can be quoted. Without such an exclusion there are plenty of attorneys that would go after the company and get you more than the cost of the claim plus cover their fees if the carrier denies without a specific exclusion. Sorry for the long post, but I have seen this sort of thing on this forum too many times.

Baja226sport

iTrader: (28)

So anyway....I guess that paying the extra $ for a marine carburetor is worth it just to avoid the insurance arguments.....

smiklos@sunprint

iTrader: (1)

Most I have read say something to the effect that. Vessel must meet all state federal and local laws and be USCG compliant.
Steve