As far as Comp vs. Crane.....I like the 114 LSA of the Comp, I thought it might get me what I was looking for- broad flat torque and the exhaust has a long way to travel, especially the inboard pipes, so also trying to limit chance for reversion.

Fact is I ended up exactly where I wanted to be; 640 was my hp goal all in below 5400. Torque- I didn't have a number in mind, only as much as possible starting at 3000 and continuing WITH NO DIP for as long as possible. Truthfully I'm surprised by the tabletop we ended up with and super happy! Overall boat performance goal is 40 mph @ 3500 rpm.....whatever I get on top is a bonus, guesstimating 57-60
I feel this build is about all the parts working together, the cam may be the conductor but the carb, intake and heads have a lot to do with the success too

I've over cammed many a street/strip engine back in the day.. old .590/322 Mopar solid lifter cam in a 440 with a rat roaster 6 pac intake.... thing was a bear from 4000-7200, but drop the clutch at 3200 and it would stop pulling fuel, fall on its face for a second, get a little air speed back and run like a freight train thru the lights, it was fun but taught me some lessons about what I absolutely don't need in a 15-17K lb boat ;)

Yes. Ditch Mopar and build 500+cid BBC's. Hah !

Easy turbo!!! The 432'' Hemi I had in that thing would eat these 540s for lunch!...however it's fun on the dark side these old porcupine heads are better than our wedge heads :)

Speed wise your guess is where I was guessing also


Maybe the hull will free up and get above 60

I agree also on the exhuast. It's still a cruiser, so lots of idle time

Well thanks for your thread. That same combo would be a great reliable package in just about any boat. You could not have done a better job for your boat though. Just all around good builds and so close to advertised rpm range as advertised.

No matter how you feel about me I am/was trying to help you!!

700hp wasnt , or isnt happening, with a 232* duration cam in a 540.

Simple!!

When a flow bench and dyno go scooting across the lake I will pay attention. His boat slowed down with parts that should have made more real power and it has nothing to do with .050" lift.

The problem is , he had a 565ci, and went to a 540ci. He dropped 25 cubic inches. He was sold on afr heads being so much better than the pro comp heads he had, that the head flow and cam would easily make up for the 25ci loss. He isnt going faster, and the dyno showed why he wasnt . The engine simply isnt making 100hp more than the 600hp 565s he had, although they were supposed to make the 700hp.

That 241/246 680 lift cam was dead by 5400. Its no surprise to me why his boat isnt going faster.

Ive seen a couple of these custom marine kinetics camshafts get yanked out, some had 50 hours on them, lobes beat to chit, valve seats pounded into the heads, as well as back to back tested against other camshafts, and simply lose there as well. So, they werent winning in the reliabilty, or power department. And these engines were built by pros, not some diy'er slapping stuff together.

I guess when you believe that a head has the best exhaust port in the industry, based on marketing claims instead of real world flow data, and cam the engine around that concept, its no surprise the results are less than expected. But hey, the guy who worked for roush, dart, and spent a good majority of his life modifying and improving cylinder heads, is called an idiot, by a guy who has never cut a valve seat in his life. Whatever sells parts I guess!

The OP made good power with an off the shelf cam? MMB please tell him to throw those engines in the garbage.. ****ing junk!!


:daz:

So, explain to me why I'm slower after listening and buying parts from Bob? he was HIGHLY recommended and I got screwed, I wish more guys came out with storys like I did before I used him...all the heat I took was WELL worth it... I mean the engines are built within 3 hp and .3 tq of each other dynoed on the same day... And those results SUCKED, all hate and BS aside, bob failed horribly at my target goals, I could have went to summit saved hassle and time with much better results...

I agree also on the exhuast. It's still a cruiser, so lots of idle time[/QUOTE]...you've obviously never ridden with me! Lol! Idle -docking and no wake zones only :)

I'm lost here. Did I miss something. Or does post refer to something else.

I've heard of similar experiences which are very unfortunate. Not long ago I heard of a fellow OSO member losing like 6-8 mph in a boat with some 565's or possibly even bigger. I thought he had went from the 651 cams to custom grinds with a lot of upsells from MK. I heard this 2nd hand but from a pretty reliable source. It's understandable to a point that not all can be spot on however it's how it's handled moving forward is key.

I pride myself in custom cam grinds as well as shelf cams. More so shelf cams. There's a lot of R@D out there with multiple shelf cam choices. Making them perform with the proper components is key obviously. i had a lot of great success and few I had to pull over the years. Certainly not afraid to share with others.

I think Bob has a lot of great builds out there as well as feedback. Unfortunately sometimes some simply fail for what ever reason. Just hope for his sake the mistakes are not from incorrect information coming From engine builder.

Not implying that at all here just getting it out there.

Also where did MMB come in the picture with this?

MMb thinks no one can make any power with an off the shelf cam :rolleyes:.(most of the Bob builders can`t pull out his cams fast enough and make more power)

Not all Butt Hurt bobby thou, Jones came up with some tiny cam for me too. It would have worked great in a ski boat I`m sure, I`ll stick with my 651.



Trash day is wednesday if anyone is driving by...:daz:


http://33outlaw.zenfolio.com/img/s12...22247347-3.jpg

In my case I am the builder, I used Bob because he was recommended to "design" my heads, cam, and valvetrain combo...I got a weak recipe and one for potential disaster. lifter to bore clearance advice I asked about was off, and the "custom made for me and marine use" heads were not made custom at all, just had Inconel valves... he bashed me to others behind the scenes and also guys said "any engine builder should know better" well I am not a builder by trade and Bob knew that, he should have made some different choices in advice knowing that....

it's over now, engines run great and I am boating, however to spend 35,000 and go slower sure still hurts...

with my situation? he told me I was an idiot and could not build things right, that all coming from a guy who wiped out 2 engines during the same time... love the internet lol

I'm STILL trying to figure out how Bob could design a cam that is "spot on" for my build but "miss" on yours.... :confused:
.. I keep wondering if there's something else going on we're not catching.. (ie: cam timing, rocker geometry. etc..)

I DO have 15 cubic inches on you (555 cid) but I think about a full point less compression (I'm at 8.6:1)
I believe we have the same heads.... AFR 325 cnc..
My cam is a bit smaller .644 in .629 ex. Lift. Duration 239 in 246 ex @ .050 as it's spec'd for a blower
and we made about the same power N/A.... I dyno'd mine wet with Eddie Marine exhaust...


Maybe it's because I essentially built my engine in my living room, and as ya'll say, the cam was designed at a kitchen table.. LOL


P.S. Congrats to the O/P on an awesome build :party-smiley-020:

How many hours have you logged on it since the dyno?

time for some new videos of the builds. you and joe on the water yet?

10 minutes.. LOL..

Fuel pump went out on the maiden voyage.. MY OWN fault.... :picard1:
hopefully be in the water this weekend though.. :)

Nothing being hidden, I can post every last detail down to every single clearance, ring gap, tq specs, chain clearances, cams degreed, compression specs, dyno proven identical to each other, yep it's my fault....

. Every detail was logged... Plain and simple he didn't do a good job on my builds...

Typical 540, afr 325 heads , almost same cam he specs within a couple degrees on most similar builds

So, where are the other 700hp 540 packages he has done? It be nice to see what you are missing.

Not saying you're hiding anything.. OR that it's necessarily your fault..
Was just thinking possibly something mechanical going on could be causing it to not pull on the top end...

Maybe his aim was just better when he spec'd mine.. (wait, wrong cam guy :) )

Not sure when both are identical or within 3 hp on dyno, same day... Same setup and through marine exhaust also...

How much did yours make without the blower?

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...hp-540s-2.html

And it appears this thread was when full force decided to go that way.

Was this same cam, or close, to what was sold to MER ?

...you've obviously never ridden with me! Lol! Idle -docking and no wake zones only :)[/QUOTE]

Pretty much the same, just my WFO is not all that impressive yet.

I plan on bypassing, or removing the water box. It has to kill some hp.

I did add a touch of rocker to the bottom thinking I somehow I was going to get to the magical 53 mph. Did gain 1mph

I started at a very disappointing 39 mph, with a list of WTF reasons why? now at 44

Now back to Cam talk

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p...psjc8p7gin.jpg


http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p...psqmpdrhuj.jpg

Looks very close to tims power.

Did you dyno with full accessories and marine exhaust?

One of SC'd pulls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_q-jIrPh44

One of NA pulls

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zs5ndha7MI

YES !

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p...psgqk3mh4l.jpg

I plan on bypassing, or removing the water box. It has to kill some hp. Removing it will be a biotch, it's glassed in. Bypassing was easy 2-4" 45s, 1-90 about 12" 4" fiberglass tubing
Hope to fire up this weekend to see how it sounds

SO N/A its nearly same as mine less compression and more CI, not a home run over mine, oh well I am up and running all last season and so far this one, it is what it is... F Bob...

I'm curious as to cam design for a blower and dynoed without.

I think Tims was a 241/246 112 lsa cam if I recall. Boatally, a 239/246 ? What lsa was it on?