Scorpion rockers
 

My motors are about ready to be topped off. Heads are at machine shop. A while back I bought some scorpion roller rockers. What is everyone's thoughts on these? Who's running them problem free? Who's had/seen them break?

Thanks guys

Never owned them.

That said, you asked for thoughts, so here goes.....

Thinking they are no better or worse than any other domestically made aluminum rockers and that setup is going to make or break your experience with them.

Agreed there. What are your thoughts or experiences with domestically made aluminum rockers?

I've owned/ installed / ran aluminum arms by crane and by ford SVO. Never had a problem, but the cams were mild (230/ 230 .600 ish)

I'm going to be runnin 243/251 627/632

I have a set on my engine. Spring tension 150 on the seat 440 open. No problem yet. If you have after market heads you may need adjustable guide plates to center them.

You'll probably get quite a range of opinions, but I believe if you stay away from Chinese junk (scorpions are domestic and generally get good reviews) and set them up properly, they will be fine for what you're doing.

We're not talking about 8000 rpm and tons of lift and spring pressure here.

I have a set. 300 hrs. Trouble free. Nothing radical with my setup though. Spring tension 140/420

Thanks for the opinions. Keep em coming. Anyone with scorpion failures? If so what was set up?

50 hours on ours. 500efi setup. No issues. Knock on wood.

We went with the marine model. They chamfer the edges to clear the heads. Kinda nice. In talking to Teague, madara, etc. everyone recommended scorpion. They seem to have replaced crane gold series. Atleast that's how I see it...

I thought there was a thread about scorpions a while back. Some swear by them being failure free. Icdpepl runs them I'm pretty certain and also mike tkach. Send those two a pm. What seems to be getting reviews are the comp ultra pro magnums.

No refunds!!

Going with these on my mustang. These are the predecessor to the comp ultra pro magnums. These are made in the USA. (Don't think the new ones are)

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...psdsgozii4.jpg
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...pskdrvqhlb.jpg
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...psqpn5vzzi.jpg

Any more details on your build, will make a difference on opinions and recommendation :-)

What additional information do you need to form an opinion on the scorpion arms?

Nothing, I've formed my opinion a long time ago but like many am waiting to post or not going to post for some reason.......:party-smiley-004:

If you reread my post though I'm referring to his specific build, not just scorpion rockers in general.

A. Interesting tech discussion during these slow times
B. Showing genuine interest in a fellow members projects.
C. Without knowing his build specs how can we properly recommend a product

Anybody else submerge their rocker arms and lifters in oil for a day or two before they get installed ?

Everything you would need to recommend or not recommend the arms has been posted.
Again,what specific information that pertains to rocker arm selection are you missing?

Spring pressure, what heads, max rpm , .

I found the crane golds to have better geometry esp on aftermarket heads with taller valves . BudmanII had a good thread on it.

And THIS ^^^ is why our tech section sucks my friends

Spring pressure and rpm can be "ballparked" with enough accuracy to qualify the arms for the alplication by the cam specs given. IE. Is the OP in shaft mount territory or not.

I agree that the geometry can vary depending on the cylinder head and arm selection.

So, you've got nothing?
That's what I thought. :lolhit:

Someone define this.....no hijack intended, never mind I can see this coming into play with a bunch of after market parts that are being assembled for the first time, but when your going all OE parts in a valve train does this really come into play.

personally, I think anytime a valve train change is made a pushrod measurement should be made.

700sci with stage 2 upgrade with 50 hrs on my scorpions. I went with the opinion of a couple of engine builders that are using them them selves.

There isn't a set dimension from the center of the trunion to the center of the roller. Different manufacturers have longer or shorter arms. Some arms work better than others on different heads because of this.

I'm betting that the OP will be able to achieve good geometry with these arms on a relatively mild setup.

When the valve springs start getting larger in diameter and height due to more radical cams, getting arms to setup correctly becomes more challenging.

I'm thinking the Thead MT alluded to, is in regard to these variances in arms. Probably worth a search.

Last year, when I was rocker arm shopping, the Crane Gold rockers, were MIA. Everywhere. Nobody had them in stock. Apparently, production on them stopped, and rumor was, they were being outsourced. I always liked the cranes, but obviosly, if you cant get them, then that does no good. I then began really liking the option of a steel rocker arm.

One of the things I've seen , on some aluminum rockers, including my old Crane Golds, was the Trunnions split in two. The Trunnions on the steel rockers, like the Comps, or Crowers, are massive in comparison. I chose to go with the new Comp Ultra XD magnum rockers, based on some info I had got on them. Basically, they were a new and improved design, that alot of technology went in to. Lifetime guarantee against breakage is a nice feature as well. They must feel pretty confident in them to offer that. Another option they offer on them, is an upgraded Trunnion, if you were to decide to run 1/2" diameter rocker studs, instead of 7/16.

We all know steel has a much better fatigue life, and the weight savings isn't there when comparing to an aluminum rocker. Basically, I saw no benefit to the aluminum rockers over them, or the Crowers.

I simply chose the Ultra XD rockers, based on the fact they were 100 bucks or so less than the Crowers, and they were something new. I like new stuff to try.

Do it on a hot plate in oil 200* and let cool. You can watch the air come out as the temperature rises and oil will pull into all voids.

If I were buyng new today, I'd take a hard look at those arms you used MT.
Friend used them on a pair of 502 marine engines with edelbrock heads.

scorpian makes two different series of rocker arms for the bbc.race and endurance.the race series is a stronger setup and can take more spring pressure according to their website.i have used several sets of the endurance arms and had good results with hyd roller cams.i used a set on a pro charged build i did with a solid tight lash roller ,275 on the seat 600+0ver the nose.the engine sees a lot of 6000 plus rpm,it really should have a shaft rocker system on it.it broke an arm at about 25 hours.i had a replacement arm in two days with no charge to me.yes i bought them from bob madera and he got right on getting me a replacement as soon as i called him.in retrospect,this is really not the rocker i should have used on that application.if it breaks another one i am going to go a different direction.to sum it up,for a hyd roller setup they will last dam near forever and i will continue to use them for that application.i have not used their race series so i can,t say if they are good or not.

if my buddy,s pro charged deal break,s another scorpian that is what i am going to try.they look to be a really tough arm.

i like to soak the lifters in 20w oil overnite,i don,t soak the lifters, oops,i ment to say rocker arms i oil the trunion bearings and the roller bearing.i use assembly lube on the pushrod cups and the valve tip.i also spray a valve trane assembly lube all over the springs,rocker arms,and pushrod,s.it is made by comp cams.imo,the springs really need lube until the oil covers them after initial startup.

Hey mIke,
Is that spray real gooey like the old sealed power pre lube?

kind of,it clings to the parts.

Oven works well for getting oil in hard to get places also. I have an tendency to over clean parts if I have any concerns what so ever. If I have to reclean pistons and rods after assm I just set in the oven for 10-15 min at at 200 plus degrees. Engine assm lube works its way in btwn the pistons and pins very well. Roller Rockers I've used just a heat gun.

An earlier post has me thinking. Someone was mentioned from trunion to roller is different on different rockers. Would that be same ratio and different manufacturers or just different ratios? Maybe some of us can measure what we have for i formative purposes. Use a mic and go center on center. Unless someone already has this info.

You can purchase them longer/shorter. Does seem messed up from one manufacturer to the other that some will differ.

They do vary quite a bit from brand to brand, architecture wise.

They should make an adjustable roller rocker with precision measuring capabilities like adjustable pushrods. I'd bet most rockers are purchased during build and probably overlooked my many.

For a while, crane offered their "gold" rockers, with "TR" fulcrums, that were larger and stronger, then for the last couple years, made it standard on their gold series before they switched vendors or whatever. I had a crane gold rocker, crack exactly like this one did. The crane was made in 1985, was found cracked in 2010, with tons of hours on them, god knows how many. The scorpion in this picture, had less than 100 hours if I recall. It was on a hyd roller setup.