Stud girdles a good idea?
 

I’m curious how many people here use stud girdles. It seems like cheap reinforcement for a delicate valvetrain. My own build is mild 10:1cr, 525EFI cam that may see 6k from time to time. While it’s out it seems like a good idea to put them on?

I've always run them on the higher performance engines, particularly if I'm running solid rollers. The ramp speed is more significant placing a higher lateral load on the stud, and I've always noticed (real or perceived) that the valve lash stayed the same longer with girdles. You have so much money in them already, it's just cheap insurance as you said. Beside.....if some is good, more is better!

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these are the only ones I'll buy, Webster Industries, the fitment is spot on..

A good set of stainless shaft rockers is even better

I have Comp Cams magnum pro rockers.

Jessel shaft rockers are on my 598

I'm running TD shaft rockers on my 572's.

..... Baja R you can spend 275-300 bucks and accomplish what you want or 1600-1800 per engine for over kill for your engine

Agree, I was very happy with mine also..

If you have to start fresh, studs, rocker arms, guide plates and girdles. Yella Terra pedestal mount rockers are the way to go without going full shaft rockers. $800-$1000 Saw them at PRI a few years ago and will be switching to later, probably for this years builds.

to answer your question baja chicken,i see no down side to doing anything to help make the valve train more stable.imo shaft rockers are overkill for a 6000 rpm engine with a hyd roller cam,but it,s only money.

If you already have everything, the stud girdles are the way to go. But with a 525 cam, it's not crazy lift or spring pressure where the stability is that critical. You're also RPM limited. If you're starting from scratch, yeah the costs are similar so just go with shaft rockers.

Is it really overkill if it outlasts everything else on the market, stabilizes the valve train better than anything else, maybe.

it,s kind of like using a L19 arp rod bolt on a 5500 rpm 500 hp engine that an 8740 bolt would be all you need at half the price.is the L19 a better bolt,yes but again it,s overkill,just my opinion.

I absolutely think shaft rockers are superior, and have their place in many engines.

I do always see that guys say that they are not that much more money when starting from scratch over a traditional bbc setup. How so? A T&D shaft setup is 1600-1700 dollars. A conventional rocker, like a Comp Ultra XD, Crower, are in the 400-600 dollar a set range. Then stud girldle kit, lets say another 250. Then another 75 bucks for ARP rocker studs. So, 725-925 dollars, you get a steel rocker arm thats good for up to 1000PSI of open pressure, 8740 rocker studs, and a girdle that ties it in all together, vs 1600-1700 dollars, for an aluminum bodied shaft rocker setup. 800-1000 bucks is a lot of dough per engine.

All that for a hyd roller that isnt going to see north of 6000RPM? I could see if we were talking about a 800 lift 7500rpm 55-60mm cam deal, but.....

Bajaroost, how much spring pressure are you running? What pushrods are you running? What rockers?

I use the Comp Cams stud girdle. Always had good luck with it. Summit is like $250 per engine.

MT, I’m running Comp cams untra pro magnums with their push rods as well using their 525EFI clone cam. They call for 928-16 springs which have open load at 383 and 160 on the seat. Seemed kinda light compared to Cranes 741which requires much higher pressure.

I don’t actually have possession of the cam yet. Just now getting the short block back.

Comp is doing alot of spintron testing these days. They do alot for the marine bbc guys. I follow one of their head guys on facebook. With their HUC series of bbc lobes, which are hydraulic, they found that with those lobes, a 11/32 valve, the valvetrain is stable to about 7000rpm using a spring such as the #935. That spring nets around 200lbs seat, and 525-550 open depending on the lift. Above 7000rpm , he says things start getting a bit more tricky.

while 7000rpm is quite a bit higher than you will ever see , i still would increase the spring pressure over what that 928 will provide.

im running a 954 spring, which also is in the 200/500 range, and it pulls cleanly to 6500 on the dyno without a hint of valve float or bounce.

My head guy would like those pressures, and those are inexpensive springs!

imo the 928 spring is cheep and not a good spring,in my experiance they wear out much faster than the crane spring for the 741 cam.

they are reasonable. My reasoning for going with them, was cost. I could replace them 2-3 times before the cost of a set of isky tool room springs. I had the tool room springs prior, and they did hold up extremely well, and tested close to their original spring pressures after a couple hundred hours. That being said, myself, im not looking to try to get 300 plus hours out of valvesprings on an 800hp engine. Id rather simply replace them every few years, even if they only have 100 hours on them. Most 800 plus hp engines arent going 300 plus hours without being touched anyways. Springs are a disposable wear item.

As far as I know, there are only a handful of actual valvespring manufacturers. Most springs are relabeled . Comp cams owns crane cams. Id be willing to bet the springs are made under the same roof. The 928 spring, and the 99896 spring crane recommends for the 741, have a significant difference in pressures. Crane 99896 spring is 524lbs /in vs comp 928 at 354 lbs/in .

Spring setup is critical. Ive seen used heads with install heights all over the place. I had heads redone at a shop, and when i went and measured the install heights, I was shocked in how much variance there was. If i recall it was .050 to .100 variance among them. Of course they were not shimmed to make up the variance. So, what you end up with is different pressures all over the map. Not to mention they were setup a mile away from coil bind. The install, hardware, and overall fitment was way off. .050 doesnt sound like much, but can easily be 30lbs variance of seat pressure just from that alone.

One thing my new head guy does, is takes every spring out of the box, and puts it in the spring tester. Each one gets tested for seat pressure, open pressure, and coil bind, and records it. Heck, just brought him a set of merlin iron heads recently that were setup by another shop. No cups or locators, springs were set on top of a valve spring shim! The springs were eating the shims for lunch.

my point to all this, is spend the time setting up your springs. The best spring in the world isnt gonna save you if its installed improperly. In my case, the springs were digging into the locators, and eating away at the stem seals. The hardware needs to be a good fit. A locator with a .680 shoulder doesnt go with a spring that has a .740 inner spring ID.

It doesn’t look ideal for long term use. I’m hoping to get 500+ hours out of this one without so much as pulling a valve cover off. I’ll have a look at the Isky springs.

Tool room series springs from isky are around 500 a set right now. The crane spring, around 230 bucks, and 160 bucks for the comps.

Pac makes some high end endurance springs, manley nextek series, howards, lunati, all have some endurance style springs.

Imo, 500 hours is alot to ask out of a set of springs , unless its a low lift low rpm bbc. Like the 502, 454 mag engines that have under .500 lift stock and turn 5200rpm max. I doubt the valve job will go 500 hours anyways.

My head guy has only used Comp springs and cams (shelf or custom) for the 15+ yrs I have known him. There are some Comp springs he doesn't use and stays away from. I believe the 928's are one of them.

at one point, pac/peterson spring was supplying comp with their springs. Not sure if thats still the case. Psi makes isky springs i believe.

I hear ya on the setup. In my YouTube education they added a .05 shim and the seat pressure went from about 128 closer to 150#. That’s a pretty big deal.