Oil temp/cooler setup questions
 

So after finally being able to run my boat pretty hard I realized quickly my oil cooler setup is nowhere near big enough. I am pulling the motor this winter anyway and I'm looking for opinions on my plans.

Motor is a 540 with 14-71 roots blower at 5 lbs running fuel injection. I found that if I run hard like 5K plus my oil temp jumps up to around 240 within 1/2 mile at most and I have to get out of it. My oil temp sensor is in my oil pan to see the best I can what's actually coming through the engine.

Current setup is a 7 qt oil pan and the stock oil cooler/thermostatic filter setup that came on my 525SC that was original to the boat.

Here's my questions....

I'm looking at the gen 5 hardin setup that claims it's for 1000 hp which I'm a little above that but thinking it may work?? Comes with a 3x24 cooler, filter head, filter adapter, and lines. My big question is should I go thermostatically controlled or non? Not sure if it will hinder its performance at all with the restriction of the thermostat??

Next question...being I'm pulling the motor to fix an oil leak either from the front main or oil pan...should I jump up to a larger oil pan? Like a 12-14 qt pan? I'm sure it will help with the cooling but damn those things are expensive for what they are!! If it's neede3d then it is what it is but if it's a waste of money I'll keep what I have.

I am also open to other options beyond the Hardin kit was just what I found. Any suggestions would be appreciated thanks!!

Stewart

I would definitely run a larger pan. More oil will help with temps. i see your from colder water temp area, Unless your having condensation problems a thermo wouldn't be needed. I am on the low end of knowledge on here but if i had the engine out i would definatly opt for a larger pan. How big are you lines running to the cooler?
Take pics and post. There are people on here that are near genius status (not me ) good luck

Oil lines are the stock merc lines....I transferred the whole system over from the 525SC...rubber lines probably 1/2-3/4 whatever they are, stock black cooler, and the black metal box that the filter/thermostat are in with the yellow "caution hot" sticker. I assumed at some point I would need to upgrade and that point is now hahahaha. Planning to go to probably -8 or -10 AN for the oil lines with all black fittings/hose so it matches everything else. As far as cooler water...I mainly run in lake michigan and if it gets to 80 its a HOT summer so yea pretty cool water. I did notice a little bit of milky oil in the puke tank but nothing that concerned me and the oil in the motor still looks new with 10 hours on it.

Thanks for the reply!

Stewart

Run a thermostat. Cold oil can be just as detrimental to an engine as hot oil. Condensation in cold climates like you are in is one concern, but just getting the oil up to temp (180) before loading the engine will drastically extend the life of the engine. You could probably get away without a larger pan, but the larger pan also reduces windage by getting all the oil further away from the rotating assembly, which keeps foaming / aerating down too. The benefits of more oil and better oil control outweigh a premature rebuild for wiped bearings.

Makes a lot of sense....that being said...my system as stated above I don't think was working properly anyway...I would idle out which is about a half hour of idle time to the lake and my oil temp gauge which starts at 140 would not move until I bumped it up and cruised a little. I was always under the impression that it should come up like a water thermostat would even at idle?? I believe the stock merc thermostat is 160 degree but I may be wrong on that?

Any suggestions for a cooler besides the hardin one? I'm also thinking of just getting a cooler, filter head, and adapter with making my own lines instead of that whole kit...may save me some money in the end??

Stewart

1/2 hour? dang. When you say 'idle' is that at idle, or just above? I always bump mine up to at least 800-1k RPM. It raises the oil pressure, and keeps the drive coupler from prematurely wearing out. I don't bring it up on plane until engines are at least 140+

Mine idles around 850-900 and it usually stays there for most of the idle time and maybe slightly above for some of it. That was my concern and being my gauge starts at 140 and I have a what I believe to be a 160 degree oil thermostat in it I figured I would see something on the gauge even when idling but I don't see the needle move till I get out of the no wake and slowly bring it up to 15-1700 for a min or so and it will start moving. Oil pressure is 70-75 at idle cold and drops to 35-40 when warm and idling.

Stewart

Go with -12 lines and get rid of all stock parts, block adapter/filter head. They are way restrictive.

Copy that..what would you recommend for replacements? Is the hardin stuff any better? I've bought a lot of stuff from them and some has been hit or miss. I'd only like to do this once so if I have to spend a little more on the front end to not have to redo it I for sure will hahaha. Also where do you stand on the thermostat portion?

Everybody says run a thermostat. I have Hardin stuff and very happy with everything I buy there.
As for sizing try contacting Ron Sporl Performance (member here on OSO) he is a big HP Blower motor guy/builder. He also stocks and sells Hardin products. He knows his stuff, currently located in Bessemer, AL.
Good Luck

I will try to look him up thanks!

Another option, back to the oil pan, I have several buddies that are welders by trade...would it serve the same purpose if I modified my current pan to a tee style bottom like the ones they sell instead of buying one? Could just add onto my current pan and add a little on the pickup tube and have my extra capacity unless there is some kind of magic inside of those things I'm not aware of??

Magic? Baffling and oil trap around pickup. Also the pickup height adjustment is critical, call Ron he is an expert.

Copy that thanks!

Ron Sporl Performance Marine 504-616-6005
Tell him Gary and Vienna say Hello

Perfect thanks!!

13 Plate Remote Cooler Assembly - Hardin Marine (hardin-marine.com)

Hardin Marine - HP Engine Oil Cooler 3" Diameter, 25" Overall Length, 1" NPT Connection (hardin-marine.com)

Looking at these two options for a cooler. I can't mount either above the bell housing due to interference with my exhaust so I will have to make some mounts or figure out a way to mount them elsewhere....what's everyones thoughts on these 2 options? Square or Round basically hahaha

I went with the smaller square. Easier to mount from a real estate perspective and you can change the internal element if needed. Very easy to plumb.
I don't make near your HP so smaller works great for my application.

Good point with the real estate perspective...haven't had a chance to call Ron yet but maybe he can answer that question too

I've seen the square ones on some of his blower builds, I don't know what size, that's the experts call.

lol fair enough

My 1150 Potters with 14-71's have these and -10 lines.

Teague Custom Marine | Dual Oil Cooler Bell Housing

Right on...I have no way of mounting those as I have a bravo setup...well IMCO but same difference

Teague Custom Marine | High Performance Engine Oil Cooler

There is this option from teague.....not cheap but if I need it I need it I suppose??

Stock T stat in a 525SC is 140*

Probably explains why I wasn't seeing oil temp on my gauge at idle since it starts at 140 hahaha

Surprised you`re not getting oil aeration of the oil and dropping oil pressure.
7qt is not enough. Definitely lose the pan or modify but a deper pan would be best if you`re swinging a 4.25 crank.
Not sure what a stock set up looks like but couldn`t you just add a round secondary oil cooler without redoing everything? In series?
I run -12AN lines. id upgrade whatever is there , seems undersized

Kinda where I'm at...just get rid of it all and replace....Have another thread started about the blower as well...finally got her running with most of the kinks worked out so time to start replacing more things hahaha

I just went through the small block version of this. I had the engine apart and found the inside diameter of the oil pump feed lines and used that as a guide. Using some logic I have seen in OSO I made sure to use smooth bends a bigger oil pan and a high volume pump. I bought an adapter to take off the oil at the engine pad and put a thermostatic sandwich there which fed a big block cooler and also routed the oil to a remote mount just in front of my port riser. I used -10AN (5/8" id) which is fine for my NA small block.
It never gets hot enough to drop pressure now, my oil pressure used to take a dive at idle after a bit of running over 4k rpms. And Ot runs warm enough that there's clear oil without any water emulsified in it.
My stuff is nice in that it's modular and I can repair and replace individual bits. But that Hardin adapter with thermostat looks like a great piece.
Fragola makes a temperature and oil resistant push lock line that can be used. It's supposed to not need clamps but I chickened out and did the Oettinger clamps. Those are the one-time use clamps like you see on a car cv boot.
OP if you decide to do your own be sure to check all your fit clearances. I was so hot to put mine together that I didn't leave enough space for my hatch actuator. So I had to move my remote filter mount inward a couple of inches after the motor was back in my boat. Thankfully I was able to keep the same lines and just fabricate a bracket to go a little bit to starboard.

NHguy, rule of thumb is 10 psi oil pressure per 1000 rpm is adequate per GM. Although we would like at a touch higher. Mine runs 12-14 psi idling right after a long hard run.

The cleaner looking oil running at higher temps is worth a million bucks to that motor. If it has no brown(not milkly either) look, and not as much of an acidic (typical boat oil) smell, that's great for thee engine and you are good to go..

Very informative guys thank you!!

I do have one more question...I am going to run the hardin marine remote oil filter adapter on the block because I got a deal on a new/used one. I'm planning on buying the hardin thermostatic remote oil filter head and still up in the air about the cooler. My question is in regards to the block adapter...do I need to do anything with any of the valves or whatever that are up in the block or just bolt this adapter on, plumb everything, and roll?

Attachment 577426
Attachment 577427
These are what I'm referrring to and planning on using

1. just buy the 13 plate cooler from cp/hardin
2. buy a thermostatic filter head
3. Replumb it all in -12 so any bends, etc arent a restriction
4. Buy a 14 qt oil pan, you can run 12 or 13 and it wont starve and oil will always be off crank
I ran the 3x 24 on my bloiwn Baja and it really wasnt enough, a local guy runs the 9 plate on 950, its not quite enough sometimes.

this is mine, nice , compact and clears the transom bolts
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...880dfda80b.jpg

I have plenty of room to change the filter so i kept it simple. Mocal s16t billet sandwich thermostat, jic 12 fittings.

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...21c28ba366.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...2dffc05337.jpg

Here is good picture of the difference between jic 10 vs jic 12. I have understood that AN fittings are better, but there is big differeces between a same size AN fittings, depending the manufacturer/type of the fitting, so look carefully when you choose the fittings.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...d1c42fdf2f.jpg

Great info thanks guys!! Aren't there some kind of valves or something in the block where the original filter mounts? Do I need to do anything with that?

There is few ways to do it. Anyhow in the center passage, under the filter adapter should not have any valve. Some removes the filter bypass valve and instal plug instead of valve, mine has the stiffer 30psi valve. Dont know wich way is better.

To be honest I have no idea what is in there now....I will have to verify what's there once I pull the motor. Never really gave it a thought when I was building/installing the motor.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...76e04b45c6.png
This is my 13 plate oil cooler an Daytona ignition.

I'm thinking I am going to have to mount everything down on the stringers due to my exhaust....it's already super tight with the stock setup and I don't think there's any way that will fit. My exhaust goes in towards the center of the engine and exits right above the intermediate housing. Looks awesome and sounds awesome but kinda a pain in the arse hahaha.