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-   -   BBC 509cid tunnel ram efi build. (https://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/general-q/381984-bbc-509cid-tunnel-ram-efi-build.html)

JaniH 04-08-2024 03:31 PM


Originally Posted by articfriends (Post 4895052)
You can always put it down .100 in hole and seal it then cc the difference too if in doubt

Actually i have no doubts, i think i am good with 9.8 or 10 to 1, DCR is under 8 to 1 with both, even if i advance the cam 8 degrees. This is calculated using the duration at 0.006" lift. Using the 050" duration and adding 15dg to intake closing point gives 8.2 with 8dg cam advance.

Brad Christy 04-09-2024 07:05 AM


Originally Posted by articfriends (Post 4895051)
The one video thats out there of racin jason at loto running 85 on sunday at shootout i think 3 years was the MPI 509 engine I dynoed and tuned that made 620/620 here. The announcer calls it a velocity in the video because he had a velocity the year before or something.

Smitty,

There was one I found of a 9yo kid at the wheel, dad standing behind him with his hand on the throttle, and the camera glanced down at the GPS at ~85. The description mentioned a "Built" engine, but wither I don't remember what it was, or it didn't specify. I did see the one you refer to, though. I was confused by the announcer, but now I get it.

At the end of the day, we see that the hull is good for it, with sufficient power. 85 is my goal. It will have to wait for time to refresh the 496, and I'll replace the pistons and bump the boost from the ProCharger. I'll have to upgrade the outdrive, as well, to handle the additional power. This is probably all probably a pipe dream, as the budget office is.... "satisfied".... with 77 and is pretty well convinced her knuckles are already white enough. :rolleyes:

Thanks. Brad.

JaniH 04-11-2024 11:31 AM

Looking for valve springs, Ron calls for 180-200lbs @ seat, and no more than 500lbs open. 2.3"/1.88", 11/32 stem valves. going set the rev limiter to 6000rpm. Would like to use my comp 741-16 steel retainers if possible? Those are heavy tough.

JaniH 04-18-2024 06:37 AM

Got the cam today, seems to be billet Core with everyewear gear. According to comp, the duration @.200" is 155°/160°


https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...c44221ac5c.jpg

JaniH 04-24-2024 02:13 PM

Starting to modify the intake. First we machine the holes for injector bungs, injector bungs are made from 40mm thick aluminum rod, and we try to fill the the intake port with the bungs, so we dont have to fill the port by welding that much. This intake is rec port, that will be modified to match flotek r-oval runner.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...c1820b1c72.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...2b1d1949cb.jpg

underpsi68 04-24-2024 02:48 PM


Originally Posted by JaniH (Post 4895959)
Got the cam today, seems to be billet Core with everyewear gear. According to comp, the duration @.200" is 155°/160°


https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...c44221ac5c.jpg

That doesn't look like a billet core. Billet should be gold/copper color.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...185a970c4b.jpg

Tartilla 04-24-2024 03:38 PM


Originally Posted by GPM (Post 4894696)
I don't, but what are you comparing them to ? they still seem small for a 509 that may get a supercharger. There again, that's only my opinion.

Pressure added intake and head ports don't need larger CCs.

The compressed air or F/A mixture will behave the same as NA for the most part.

Not my words...from Darrin Morgan.
​​​​​
290 Floteks have a smaller chamber, and roval intake ports. They flow very similar to the 315/317cc heads. Likely only notice a diff at WOT, where the engine may spend 5% of total run time.

Tartilla 04-24-2024 03:43 PM


Originally Posted by sutphen 30 (Post 4894852)
I've seen 630hp w/ a crane 240/248 ls112 for an 8.1L in a gen 6 502,cams a double swap,dart heads 10-1 compr. on an ego breaking dyno.:)

Awesome quote..."Ego Breaking Dyno"...

SB 04-24-2024 05:10 PM


Originally Posted by underpsi68 (Post 4896441)
That doesn't look like a billet core. Billet should be gold/copper color.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...185a970c4b.jpg

Depends on the type of steel core.

Rookie 04-24-2024 08:14 PM


Originally Posted by underpsi68 (Post 4896441)
That doesn't look like a billet core. Billet should be gold/copper color.

My billet Comp cams were also black.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...317a6b8d17.jpg

Rookie 04-24-2024 08:18 PM

Double

JaniH 04-25-2024 07:06 AM

Filing the ring end gaps, there is no instructions for marine closed cooling aplication. Should i follow the street moderate turbo/nitrous clearance? 10 to 1 compression.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...f9b9379d4b.jpg

boostbros 04-25-2024 09:29 AM

call total seal tech they are extremely helpful..... to loose is better that too tight!

JaniH 04-25-2024 09:46 AM


Originally Posted by boostbros (Post 4896520)
call total seal tech they are extremely helpful..... to loose is better that too tight!

My rings are speed pro.

JaniH 04-25-2024 01:34 PM

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...82f9279239.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...ad8e10e5a.jpeg

Rookie 04-25-2024 06:39 PM

That's a lot of work. You can buy universal fuel injector bungs for $40.
Any reason you didn't go with a single monoblade LS style tunnel "ramish" intake?
Don't get me wrong, I am a fan of the twin throttle body tunnel ram. but...
This was on a 780HP 565.

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...2b078a5f79.jpg

JaniH 04-26-2024 04:50 AM


Originally Posted by Rookie (Post 4896564)
That's a lot of work. You can buy universal fuel injector bungs for $40.
Any reason you didn't go with a single monoblade LS style tunnel "ramish" intake?
Don't get me wrong, I am a fan of the twin throttle body tunnel ram. but...
This was on a 780HP 565.

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...2b078a5f79.jpg

At first i was going to use carbs, thats why. Is that intake made by jimv? If so that is where i got my inspiration to efi. Nice looking intake btw 👍. The reason for thick injector bungs is that i can fill the runner with the bungs, less welding to get it match to oval port head.


articfriends 04-26-2024 03:59 PM

On a low hp 502 (500/550) with thermostat and typical 4032 pistons and plasma moly 1/8 1/8/ 3/16 ill go 24 top, 26 second with a , if customers a hot dog or abuses it, light boost etc, Ill go 26 top and 28 second, until you go well past 40, its been proven has negligible effect on leakdown/power fwiw.

JaniH 04-27-2024 03:55 AM


Originally Posted by articfriends (Post 4896644)
On a low hp 502 (500/550) with thermostat and typical 4032 pistons and plasma moly 1/8 1/8/ 3/16 ill go 24 top, 26 second with a , if customers a hot dog or abuses it, light boost etc, Ill go 26 top and 28 second, until you go well past 40, its been proven has negligible effect on leakdown/power fwiw.

THANKS, 0.026"/0.028" it is then. Rings are 1/16".

Rookie 04-27-2024 10:32 AM


Originally Posted by JaniH (Post 4896585)
At first i was going to use carbs, thats why. Is that intake made by jimv? If so that is where i got my inspiration to efi.

Yes, that is JimV's old intake. It was on his old 27' Fountain. He now runs Single plane throttle body injection on his 38' Fountain.

JaniH 04-27-2024 11:41 AM


Originally Posted by Rookie (Post 4896669)
Yes, that is JimV's old intake. It was on his old 27' Fountain. He now runs Single plane throttle body injection on his 38' Fountain.

Did you use IAC for idle correction?

Rookie 04-27-2024 06:18 PM


Originally Posted by JaniH (Post 4896672)
Did you use IAC for idle correction?

Yes, I use IAC in conjunction with timing. I found that timing is faster than what the IAC can react. In gear I would stall often until I redid my idle timing tables.

JaniH 04-28-2024 06:11 AM


Originally Posted by Rookie (Post 4896693)
Yes, I use IAC in conjunction with timing. I found that timing is faster than what the IAC can react. In gear I would stall often until I redid my idle timing tables.

Would be awsome to get base tables for ignition and fuel, but at this point i have a long way to tuning 🙂. My ecu does not have the driver for gm style 4pin stepper motor, so i am going to use the bosch 2pin fir 19mm hose.

JaniH 04-28-2024 06:18 AM

36-1 Trigger wheel is ready for some paint.
Trying to find cost effective Bbc bracket for crank sensor, cherry Hall sensor.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...522b7485cf.jpg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...1f87a06803.jpg

Rookie 04-28-2024 09:19 PM


Originally Posted by JaniH (Post 4896712)
Would be awsome to get base tables for ignition and fuel, but at this point i have a long way to tuning 🙂. My ecu does not have the driver for gm style 4pin stepper motor, so i am going to use the bosch 2pin fir 19mm hose.

I Didn't do much with my fuel at idle. I believe I'm around 13.5 AFR target. When warm my IAC runs at about 0-2%. The key is adjust the throttle blades so it does not need to use IAC at idle. (calibrate TPS after adjusting blades) I have my timing at 36° from 0-1000 RPM (target idle 800 RPM) and I allow idle stabilization timing to throw +/-8° timing to catch the engine at in gear transition with the help of the IAC to open +98% if need to stabilize the idle. I also have the IAC set to fast react.

JaniH 04-29-2024 04:04 PM

What you think about the valve stem clearances for N/A, closed cooling, is 0.0017" int, 0.002" exh ok?

Rookie 05-03-2024 11:09 PM


Originally Posted by GPM (Post 4894361)
In my opinion and from trial and error, less than 8 degrees of split didn't work that well on N/A or blown BBC


Originally Posted by sutphen 30 (Post 4894872)
will be interesting to see how that 5° split does for power.

Look what just appeared in my Youtube suggestions...


JaniH 05-04-2024 12:12 AM


Originally Posted by Rookie (Post 4897222)
Look what just appeared in my Youtube suggestions...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEoGwr90SPk&t=646s

Interesting, i quess the results would be different with marine exhaust manifolds vs those good flowing headers. I would never add 16 degrees duratiton to gain 10hp, when reversion and valvetrain stability is a concern. I think that the marine manifolds benefits more from the larger duration split.

sutphen 30 05-04-2024 01:04 PM


Originally Posted by JaniH (Post 4896845)
What you think about the valve stem clearances for N/A, closed cooling, is 0.0017" int, 0.002" exh ok?

thats fine,good valve seals will control the oil

GPM 05-04-2024 02:39 PM


Originally Posted by Rookie (Post 4897222)
Look what just appeared in my Youtube suggestions...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEoGwr90SPk&t=646s

I would bet different engine combinations would react differently, but it was a good video.

JaniH 05-04-2024 02:48 PM

Should i use this type of seals on exhaust and intake?
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-517-16

sutphen 30 05-04-2024 04:25 PM

does flotech give you the guides top cut dia. for the valve seals.viton is what you want.

JaniH 05-05-2024 02:31 AM


Originally Posted by sutphen 30 (Post 4897270)
does flotech give you the guides top cut dia. for the valve seals.viton is what you want.

According flotek site, the valve guide OD is 0.500".

JaniH 05-05-2024 02:33 AM

Found these runner extensions for weiand tunnel ram. 2" and 4" available.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/23550828552...4AAOSw2GlXKNCR

Mbam 05-05-2024 08:47 AM


Originally Posted by JaniH (Post 4897297)
Found these runner extensions for weiand tunnel ram. 2" and 4" available.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/23550828552...4AAOSw2GlXKNCR

Back in the early 80's I had a pair of engines built by a big name guy near Detroit. Had those same intakes. Made good power but in order to lower the RPM band and increase torque he made some spacers like that. Worked great on the dyno. However first run out on the lake it broke one balancer clean off. On disassembly found the other one seconds away from the same fate.

Only thing we could figure was that the spacer really screwed up the air/fuel distribution.

articfriends 05-06-2024 09:33 AM


Originally Posted by Mbam (Post 4897316)
Back in the early 80's I had a pair of engines built by a big name guy near Detroit. Had those same intakes. Made good power but in order to lower the RPM band and increase torque he made some spacers like that. Worked great on the dyno. However first run out on the lake it broke one balancer clean off. On disassembly found the other one seconds away from the same fate.

Only thing we could figure was that the spacer really screwed up the air/fuel distribution.

would be interesting to see on a dyno with 10 o2 sensors like mine has, I see some stuff thats almost unusable as far as afr delta!

JaniH 05-06-2024 01:28 PM


Originally Posted by articfriends (Post 4897401)
would be interesting to see on a dyno with 10 o2 sensors like mine has, I see some stuff thats almost unusable as far as afr delta!

My plan is to make the first dyno pulls with headers and 8x02 sensors, and see what cylinders needs more fuel, and then change to my stainless marine manifolds and do the final tuning. My last engine Lost 19hp and over 40tq, with Sm (dry to transom risers) vs long tube headers.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...9878950615.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...f8345f7cad.jpg

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...b64f311792.jpg

JaniH 05-06-2024 01:55 PM

Some progres today, i set/cut angles for the injector bungs, still needs quite a bit welding but not bad.
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...bee4b85016.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...506bf23a22.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...3b7b49390f.jpg

JaniH 05-09-2024 02:08 AM

Made a good deal of 8qt milodon full kick out pan. Dont know if it is any improvement over the merc original 8qt with scraper, but it looks cool.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...22fbe0a76d.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...3014d761fd.jpg

JaniH 05-15-2024 03:35 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Heads are ready. ferrea 6000, int 30dg backcuts, new seats, bowl/short turn blend, good port had too high air speed @.600 and up, trimming the head bolt pump fixed the problem. 1=good port, 2=bad port, 3=exhaust no pipe, 4.5" bore adapter.


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...85a78e85e8.png


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