Constructive Thread/racing
 

I been accused of not being constructive,so lets all post what you all think of what will make off-shore racing into a successful sport. Let's keep it simple and to the point and we can make this productive. Remember alot of the heavy weights monitor the board,this can be very productive. please jus responses,if we get into discussions it will get ugly. lets sea if we can all be productive. who's gonna start?

I will
 

Spell Check

Keep the racers informed and let them be a small part of the decision making. Keep the rules in particular classes for a minimum of 3 years. I could go on and on but it's a start.

thank-you good start,keep them comin

Outer42:

Let me start by saying let's not get into a rules debate on this thread. I know for a fact that some great things have forged ahead today in APBA Offshore. Man I am excited about this up and coming year! BH

Scott...no need to start this all over again. all the issues are already on the table. I really dont feel like going through it all over again.

Keith ...Good point and I think the racing bodies are listening to the racers. But it may be a bit too late for some.

Why dont we sit back, take a deep breath for a week or two and watch what happens. I think good things are coming.

i don't want a debate jus opinions.

I'll give you constructive
 

Just love the sport. It is what it is. The best thing you can do and still have you pants on. Smitty

Well......most of the time.:p

Don't take the sport too seriously.

At every driver's meeting we would hear "you are the best of the best". Well that may be partly true, but we were mainly "the few willing to spend the money and time to participate."

Offshore is a sport of the willing, not necessarily the select few who have qualified to race at the highest level of the sport. Pay your fees and go racing. No working your way up through the ranks in order to be the "chosen one" by a team owner. NASCAR we are not.

Because of that, the sport has less room for multiple big egos. I would love for one, and only one, sanctioning body to be in a position of approving racers based upon true qualification, not just their deep pockets. Wouldn't it be great if the sport was intentionally limited to 100 total teams and 400 teams were begging to race? Talk about checking your ego at the door.

What's the old saying? There ain't no "I" in TEAM, well there ain't no "I" in OFFSHORE either.

Just a few random thoughts. Not meant to belittle anyone's championships.

Honesty is best medicine!
 

Honesty in the sport needs to come to the forefront.
To many times in the last year and maybe more, the racers and members of the APBA have been lied to for one reason or another. Personal agenda's have torn apart an organization that has a 100 yr history. I read in this months Propeller, APBA is the holder of the oldest trophy in motor sports period, the the Gold Cup. It is being sent back to the manufacturer to be restored.

Lets see if we can restore the sport of Power Boat Racing. Lets work together to be honest with each other, share our goals for the future. Check your ego at the door and come down of your high horse, treat everyone with respect and show the fans and sponsors the sport is bigger than one category, class or team. I would like to see new idea's and new people involved in every aspect of boat racing and my ballot for APBA Bod & Council reflects this.

I don't have the luxury of having lot's of disposable income, but as my wife and daughter can attest most of my free time and some of my not so free time has been spent on the sport of boat racing. If you love the sport as much as I have come to love it don't abandon it, embrace it and show the sponsors and sanctioning bodies that we can come together as racers and have some fun, because if your not having fun why do it.

Just my humble opinion
Matthew Barrett

SOB's
 

Add the "True Entry Level" racing class of Single Outboard Vee Bottoms 21' to 24' and keep it affordable for the new racers to come race. We all know what happens once you get hooked onto this sport....;)

When you show up at the race, leave your "Ego" at the pit gate.:)
Vinny

Whatever Sanctioning body you chose to race, its your business and you have your reasons. Stop talking bad about the others. In the end, the strong will survive until the next debacle:cool:

To elaborate on Mark's post, I agree with the post from a national (Pro) perspective, less pro classes to contend with . But I think the APBA did a good job of this by running the "Pro" classes on Sunday.

In addition to that, the backbone of NASCAR is Saturday night racing (i.e. entry level). This is what needs development. If there are not 30-50 boats showing up to every POPRA, GLCS, OPA event, where are the "pros" of tomorrow going to come from.

Just my .02
Rick

Unification would be nice, but is not needed.

Never bash another racer or race group, it hurts everyone. Mostly yourself.

Make sure the fun factor stays high at all times. If your not having fun, why are you racing?

Practice your interviews. If you're lucky enough to have a TV camera in your face, say something interesting.

If your not happy with a certain sanctioning body, don't come on here and tear them up. Find another one that is more to your liking and move on.....

Lots of great ideas on here, especially from Ron, Mark and Phantom..in my opnion.

Here is my .02...I have been very fortunate to grow up in and around NASCAR Winston Cup Racing. More-so from the business aspect then the tech aspect, which makes my experiences even more unique from certain vantage points, less unique from others. Now, I certainly do not have all the answers, but to me, we have the perfect benchmark in NASCAR. We are nuts not to use this to our advantage. They run 13 series in the USA....they are masters at promotions and putting on a good show. I see SO MANY things that work well for them that Offshore racing does not implement...and quite frankly, I think it is mostly due to the distain of some in the direction of stock car racers, more than the rejection of what will-or-will not work. I think that is silly.

When they put on a show...EVERYTHING is on time. Everything is black and white. If it is scheduled, it happens. Period. They have a uniformed schedule at each race. Everything is orderly, clean, classy and done to perfection. If there ever was a pinnalce, this is it. Race fans do not want to stand around for 45 minutes wondering when the race is going to start, it makes us look disrespectful of thier time, support and $. It makes us look unprofessional...as does canceling race dates. That is a MUST NOT DO.

The NASCAR team members are professionals who race for a living and their livelyhood depends on success, both on and off the race course. So, they have to do things right..all the time. There by, they must have the interview process down pat (like Ron said, practice, it is harder to get all the sponsor names into an interview than you would think:D ). They represent thier sponsors better than some of them would represent themselves. I rarely see boat drivers mention sponsors or put on a sponsor's hat for some national tv exposure. Why not? This is the perfect instance to help bring more $$ into the sport.

In NASCAR, everything is based around boosting image, which boosts fan support and ultimately boosts sponsorship sales, brings more $$ into the sport...and....the realtionship builds from there. They treat fans with enormous respect, even if they are in a bad mood, or they just wrecked or they do not feel like it (ofcourse there are exceptions). They take the time to look out for the betterment of the sport. Everyone is on the same page, it is a singleminded approach to growth and prosperity. When was the last time you heard a CUP driver make fun of or chastize the ARCA series? The drivers are the primary focus of all promotions, merchandising and interest...and they know that. Alot of driver's take speech lessons to practice public speaking, they are coached at this as they are driving. It, agian, all goes back to image.

If we all think in a little different manner, I think we can see great improvements. We are not talking about major overhuals, just a matter of doing things right, on time, with class...that's really about it. Put on a SHOW, not a race. NASCAR is SO fan freindly...one if it's major appeals and a big part of creating brand loyalty. When was the last time you, as on Offshore racer, offered to give autographs? Just put a Sharpie in your pocket and be accessable with the folks at the race. What about autograph tents or autograph signing sessions that are scheduled and annouced to the fans...then followed thru on? Make it MANDATORY for all racers to attend at some point and time...just like 1/2 hour or so...it would do wonders for the image of the sport. It may be mostly kids, but they have parents who will spend $$ and build brand loyalty. It may sound silly, but that is one way the loyalty is built (and winning certainly don't hurt:D ). Treat the fans with huge respect. There is a reason why NASCAR teams that have not won a race in 10 years still sign $15 million/year sponsorhip packages. It is the promotion OFF the track that has created this...again..all goes back to how you treat and respect the fans, sport and sponsors.

I think our prerace ceremonies in Offshore racing have ALOT to be left desired. Infact...we have no ceremony. We are missing out on a perfect opportunity. Why do we not have driver introductions or the National Anthem, pre race? What about flyovers, parachuters, free style jet skiers or wakeboarders...etc. Why do we not have a "Drivers....start your engines!!" There is no aura or excitement created around the start of our races...we do not give anyone a reason to be anxious about seeing this race. The fans look out and just see some boats driving around...it makes for no drama...no story line....NO SHOW. Heck, I think the Choppers buzzing around is just as cool as the race sometimes!! Build on that!! When NASCAR realized they were in the entertainment business, not the racing business....they went ballistic in growth. I think...I KNOW we need that in Offshore Racing. Hell, I'm a Offshore racer and I just learned on this thread we have the oldest trophy in Motorsports. That sort of stuff needs to be promoted! As well, I think the American flags on the bow is a GREAT jesture, but why have we not promoted the sport as ALL AMERICAN? Race fans eat that stuff up!!

Did you know that NASCAR is the only sport in the USA that has a prayer over the PA system prior to the race?

History....NASCAR...running moonshine.....OFFSHORE BOATS...running dope!! (atleast some of the boats and engineering). Everyone knows about the NASCAR history, no one knows about the Offshore history, and I think that is our faults. Our history is dramatic as hell and should be promoted...it worked for NASCAR!!

Why are the drivers TV or radio interviews not done right after a race when the boat pulls into the pits? I know for me I would give a much more animated interview right then than I would 2 hours post race. Helmet pops off and the driver, with sweaty hair and full of emotion tells you what just happened 3 minutes ago..that is 10 TIMES more exciting to watch than waiting for 2 hours. What about prerace interviews in the pits while the driver is getting into the boat, or, better yet...sitting in the boat. Give the fans at home somebody to relate to, somebody to cheer for, not just some boat. Watch the race team website hits increase after this takes place...!! I'm tellin ya, fans love this stuff.

So....sorry about the long post, and PLEASE do not misintepret my post as me banging on anyone or any Offshore racing people or promoters, I am apart of this stuff as well. I am not trying to make the APBA or GLSCS, etc...NASCAR, I am just trying to offer good ideas that are proven to work in the fastest growing spectator sport in America. Yes, I have only been around offshore racing for about 2 years, but I have seen what does and does not work as far as promotions in motorsports. I do not know it all, not even close, but I have some idea, I think anyway;) :D And my ideas are not necessarily original...the NASCAR boys have been doing this stuff for over 20 years.

We need to be conscious of putting on a show as apposed a race...and that means as drivers and team owners and crew members...we need to do things on raceweekend that perhaps we think are a pain in the rear...but if it improves the sport, then it must be done....that could also make the difference between racing for $2k to racing for $10k in a few short years.

Thanks for listening to my rambling, sorry it is so dang long.

Allan Hilsinger
Hilsinger Motorsports, LLC
P5-48 Offshore Racing:)

Well said Allen4!
Many of the ideas you've outlined don't even cost money. I still have my race programs from the mid 70's, autographed by Aoki, Halpern, Martin, Elswick, Arneson, Cook and many others. Perhaps that is one reason I'm still following the sport today.
Hope to see you on the race course!
Bob
P5-? Pit Lizard
OPA

Do not outlaw manufactures.

There is always references to Nascar and reality is the rules are like Iroc. Nobody watches or cares about Iroc.

Has anyone counted how many engine manufactures there are in Nascar?

Unless you open the rules to allow for any boat, engine, transmission, drive and proppeller companies to compete the sport will not grow.

Pat Weismann

Well said Allan - at least some people get it.

Allen is one of the few that truely gets it.

Mr Velocity

I really Respect what you say in all your posts .

I like to see what you have to say on this post.


Mike

Unification is what the sport needs!! But that will not happen for reasons that will not keep this post positive. Unification will bring with it more boats and how do they say it: "It's cheaper by the dozen" You could add a couple more classes (bare with me here) and still keep the over head down. Maybe single outboard and a open "run what you brung" class for V and Cats. Like Pat said, this will bring other manufactures to the venues that will help bring in more sponsors. I was always impressed in the old days with the stuff teams were willing to try to "build a better mouse trap". Yea, alot did not finish the race. but to a motorhead like me it was great to see what teams were doing as you walked around the pits.

Allen you hit on alot of good points and I think APBA had some of this stuff covered. Seems like I always remember the National Anthem played before races if you were in a VIP section. They HAVE to broadcast something at the advents so people can follow what's going on that aren't within speaker distance of the VIP area. And get the word out so people know where to tune in to. Hell, half the people in boats in the spectator field don't even know what's going on. And I think we can find better color commentary from some other people out there. Prerecorded interviews would be great to fill in during the slow periods. Starting races on time sounds alot easier than you think, most people haven't got a clue what it takes to put everything in place. But other people around here that know better than me can explain why a race doesn't always start on time.

And last but not least. Try to incorporate a Poker Run into the weekend. I think this will bring out some Eye Candy to fill the void. I know thats easier said than done. But I think it will bring more people out and give some manufacturers a better reason to want to show up to sell their goods. Who knows? You might even get a couple more P class boats to run.

As a long time fan of Offshore Racing I sure hope someone can pull off a successful season this year. But time is running out.

Good Luck to the powers that are running this sport, just when you think you can see some light at the end of the tunnel, it always turns out to be a train!

I wish everyone a safe year racing where ever that might be, Pete

Doug

Great idea!! Maybe Ron P can give further input on that topic since he pulled of a heck of a live radio show from Marylands OPA race year.

Mike,
My views are the same as every other post I've made on the subject.
Lock in the rules for 5 years. A tweak here and there may be ok but you don't introduce a new engine package every year. 1 year notice of any rule change.
Less classes, at least for the "pros". The #1 complaint from our sponsors was trying to figure out who is racing who. There should be 4 pro classes and the goal should be to grow those 4 classes.
Seperate the pros from the weekend warriors. Much like it is today with races on Sat and Sun, but also in the pit area. Make the pro area have an admission fee.
Have a code of conduct for the racers including having them in the pits to greet the fans the day before.
Better communication between race control, the racers and the fans.
Consistent enforcement of the rules. Don't enforce the rules that are driven by the business behind racing.
End to end race coverage, highlight shows suck. This will also mean an investment in more cameras and $$$.
I think there is also a big misconception on boat count. More boats doesn't mean more sponsors. Sponsors will only deal with pros, remember when that sponsor's name goes on the boat you represent them. Being in uniform drunk at a titty bar will not bring sponsors. Many racers think this sport is one big party, to a sponsor it's strictly business. Racers must think of it as a business, it just happens to be a really fun business. It's a party for the fans.

It's not magic the problem has always been too many egos get in the way of making it happen.

You guys are right.
 

Ron P., I hear ya dude. I give up. I guess my passion for the sport sometimes overides my sense of sportsmanship. I guess it's my turn to simply shut up and race.
Fact is, I'm tired. I either need re jetted or tuned up.

SO, in honor of the new year, when I get off duty at 0700 Saturday morning, I am going in search of a butt-load of Captain Morgan and hopefully engage in a deeply religious experience with a hottie blonde.
Maybe I'll eat breakfast first...

Good input guys.

Mr velocity....I totally agree with your last sentence....IMHO, it is simply a matter of doing things right and using some common sense. Pretty simple stuff.

Too Old, I think you are right on target, as usual, as are alot of you.

Ideas are great, implementation is the key.

Be safe,

Allan:)

#1 make sure the customers (racers) are happy.
#2 Make sure Sponors are happy.
#3 Hopefully people enjoy watching the race
#4 When the race is over, make sure to thank the local sponsors and municipality. AND THE VOLUNTEERS.

It's all pretty easy. The hardest part is getting the sponsors, which is what drives the race dates and locations.

Anyone that's participated in an OPA race has seen all these elements come together without much fanfare.

This is all good stuff !

I think every team needs to have hero cards with the team available for autographing at a certain hour or time

There should be one trailer selling T-shirts for all the teams, say every team would have 300 t-shirts and there is 50 teams ,thats 15000 shirts ,i am pretty sure we would get one hell of a good price !

this is how i would break it down !
say the shirt cost 5$
and the trailer sells it for 20$

5$ goes back to the team for the cost
5$ goes to the association /race site/trailer
5$ to a children's charity
5$ to profit your team

This not only eliminates you having to stop wrenching on your boat because some guy wants to buy a shirt ,it also eliminates giving them away ! I don't want to sound cheap but every year i loose thousands of dollars because i always have some body wanting a shirt ,and i just give it to them ! By having this trailer ,you wouldn't' feel bad for one, because you can just tell that person wanting a shirt that a portion of cost is going to charity and all t-shirts are sold at one place !

Back to Nascar comparisons. IMHO, Nascar my have 13 classes, but they don't all race on the same track the same day. I find this the most confusing thing in racing. I follow the sport and still half the time I can't tell who is racing who.


I'm sure this won't be a popular view, but there doesn't need to be a class for every type of boat out there.

I think a circuit with just SuperV and SuperCat would cut down confusion, streamline the whole event, and would be easier to sell to sponsors. Yeah sure everyone wants to race, but it's just not realistic. I don't see Nascar running F250 Diesels out there just so I have a class to root for or run in.

Lobersterboy, that T-Shirt trailer thing is a great idea.

I also like the t-shirt idea. Controling this may be an issue, but there are ways around this for sure. I too give away tons of freebies and it costs $ to do so. A central area for people to buy merchandise (the BIGGEST $$$ maker in NASCAR) is a great idea....one or 2 trailers...etc...set up an autograph tent right next to it and people can get thier new hat/shirt/poster/etc signed by their favorite racer. I mean, guys racing $5k dirt cars have this stuff figured out...why don't we?

As for Hero Cards, I think that should be left up to individial teams. They need to learn how to promote themselves and their sponsors....if 10 of 15 teams have Hero Cards...5 teams are missing out. They need to step up to the plate, if they indeed want to. All goes back to individual responsibility of each team. We have to learn how to market our team, sponsors and sport correctly. I am telling you, it is not brain science, really it is just a matter of doing things correctly and with class, in my opinion. The more of this stuff that is implemented correctly, the more $ that comes into the sport.

Cuda...my reference to the 13 NASCAR series was more to demonstrate that they really know how to entertain...it is not just Winston Cup (er...Nextel Cup), but I agree with you, I sometimes have a hard time following a race myself. 5-7 clasees max would be my thought. And run them in 3 races or something like that...ON TIME!!

In Cup racing (I know I am refering to it alot, but that is where my experience is, I am just trying to pass it on) you can't just buy pit or garage passes. You basically have to be a team member or a VIP of a certain team(even though it has gotten liberal enough to seem like they sell passes to the general public). So, to charge to get into the dry pits I think is certainly fine. Even the local dirt track charges to enter the pits. A general admittance of $10-$12 will get you into the grandstand, but it is $20 to enter the pits at most normal Sat night roundy rounder shows. I think something like that is fine. As well, it helps lesson potential security/liability isssues, becuase everyone who is in the pits has signed a waiver/disclaimer and there is some control of who is going in and out of the pits. That being said, the drivers need to be accessable both in and out of the dry pits for fan interaction. That does not mean in every instance, that means when reasonable. I would not let fans inthe wet pits...on the perimeter yes, but not inside the wet pits. You don't see fans on pit road or on the staging lane at a Top Fuel race, do you?

Just some more thoughts to kick around.....

Well stated Allan.

I know the APBA was working on the T-shirt trailer a year back, hopefully it will make it's way back to the front of the ideas.

Speaking of positive....how about this for positive:

http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/religion...533298,00.html

Good stuff. What is the latest on your new boat Ken?

Very neat article...

MRO is a big part of the NASCAR family, infact, they hold church service in the garages at 10:30am raceday...just about all the drivers and crew chiefs go.

Okay guys, I promise I will stop the NASCAR references, I am sure it is getting old:( ;) :) Just trying to pass on info ;)

Great story Ken, Jim has been there for all of us.

Phantom1,

The new boat is coming along just fine. Will is in the middle of rigging and we'll be testing props with Matt & Julie in February. Life is good....thanks for asking.

Can't wait to see it......hint....hint....photos?

Phantom1,

Try this:

Phantom 38 Progress Photos

Now,

Back to your regularly scheduled programming.....