525 Heat Test Results
 

Hey Guys, Need a little help here.. Took my heat out today for the first time since the swap and i was MAJOR DISAPPOINTED. Remember 525, XR, Sportmaster Lower, and stuck on a B1 28. The boat came out of the hole like a dog and spun out BAD!! Midrange response SUCKED!! and on top I was running 5400(so the tach said) RPM and 72 on GPS with the drive opened up. Two half tanks of fuel, ME only, and half the cushions out of the boat including the rear bench cushion. Sportmaster lower seems to be same depth as a XR lower. (my Measurements) Prop Calculator at Bronson Propellors website said 24% SLIP!!!! WTF!!! Shouldn't I be around 12-14%? Will a drive spacer help? Prop Work? What do you guys think? Also, 64 degrees this morn when tested, Elevation 880, 6" Chop, 10mph wind. Motor itself seemed great, I think it's just setup?? Gonna start drinkin early today!! LOL :drink:

Derek

Derek,

A one inch spacer and a Merc Lab 28 should put you in the ballpark.
If you don't want to go the spacer route... try a 26 pitch p5x.

When my 600sci was stock, (which is only about 40 more hp than you have), I spun a 27 p5x to 5400 which equaled 80-81 mph.

Chris

Derek,
Chris is correct. The factory had a good idea in trying higher (19-19.25"s, 18-18.25"s would be right) X dimensions on these boats. They just didn't do enough testing to see if it really works, and it usually doesn't. These boats need lift to run properly, and they won't without a spacer and/or a 5 blade. If you look at it this way, it could be worse.....most boats need a shorty lower to run well since their XDs are too low. A new prop or a spacer is much less expensive. It's easier to go down than up.
I would test the 5 blade 1st, since it's easier than installing a spacer, but you will probably need the 1" spacer too, if you are currently at 24% slip. That's way high............
I have a 1" spacer on mine, and I run a Hydro P-5X.
Regards,
Steve

Derek, if you can't get that 525 dialed in like you want, be sure you can just put it in mine before you send it out. I haven't even got the Heat from you yet and i'm already looking at new power options. I'm thinking the Raylar looks pretty interesting. Good luck on your set-up. I am thinking about having the boat hauled out this week, Thurs or Fri. Would that work for your hauler? Kirk

I have an 05 Heat with a 525 ....I am hitting 4900RPM with a 4 Blade 26pitch ...Just sent prop to BBlads a few days ago to get them to gain me about 3 to 400 more RPM ...I was hitting around 75MPH....

BTW this Heat came with a 496 HO ..then I did the Raylar (Long Story) now 525 and very happy

Well, I took the B1 28 to the prop shop to make sure it was OK(It was), and ended up getting the LH P-5 back just to try it first. We'll see how that adventure goes this afternoon!! LOL That is the only 5 blade he had that would even come close to working. I wanted to take a B1 30 too, but it was out on a test. I'm gonna take a B1 32 today with the P-5 just to see how it does while I'm there. That is the prop that came with the motor/drive package. I know it's a waste of time, but tonight I figure I will be ordering the spacer.

Derek

Sportmaster lower might also be slowing you down. They work great with some boats didn't on the Flame.

I thought about that too... I have a Shockwave for sale right now with a brand new XR on it and Really considering swaping it out because everyone knows so much more about setting up a XR with a standard Lower. Anyone think thats a terrible Idea?

Thanks, Derek

Hi Derek,
A general rule of thumb is the faster you run, the more a "nose cone" type gearcase helps. The XR does work OK up to 80/85. The Sportmaster is more valuable if you need to sell it. Obviously the gold standard is the Imco lower. Even though the sportmaster is not quite as sleek as the Imco, and probably has a higher drag coefficient, it is definitely sleeker than a stock XR housing. I would do more testing with propellers and a spacer before you send the Sportmaster down the road. Plus, it looks cool :).........
Also keep in mind you can swap your Sportmaster internals over to an Imco standard length housing.
Nordic Navy Guys, has anyone run a Sportmaster on a Heat???
Best Regards,
Steve

On Lake Texoma this time of year I would expect your Heat to run 74-75 MPH(GPS). So, your speed is not that far off. Just work with your props and setup until it performs correctly. I installed the 525 in BoatingBent's Heat last summer. It ran a tick over 72 (gps)on Lake LBJ in the summer heat with a labbed 26, turning about 5100 RPM. He's now running a stock 26 (in Minnesota) where it is a bit faster than here in Texas. Heats have a lot of prop slip when running a Bravo prop. I suspect you'll need that drive spacer to get the bow up.

Bob Lloyd
Full Throttle Marine

Hey Chris, I believe I bought that P5X from you. If anyone is interested I am selling it. Only used it once, wasn't right for my application.

I might be interested. How much are you wanting for it?

I might be interested in the prop as well... Let me know how much..

Thanks, Derek

Well Here are todays results with a 27 P-5 LH. (Drove Boat in Reverse)

3500 RPM - 44 mph
4000 RPM - 54 mph
4500 RPM - 64 mph
4900 RPM - 70 mph all GPS

It handled way better than the 28 B1, came out of the hole better, and had better midrange. It still Spun out Bad out of the gate..

It's got a appt. tomm at 9am to get a 1" drive spacer installed. Does everyone kinda agree with that? Then try the B1 28 again?

Thanks Derek

Hi Derek,
I guess that shows even a LH 5 blade works better than a RH 4 blade at the elevated stock XD on these boats. Wait until you try a RH 5. Yes do the spacer. It will definitely make your boat perform better in all aspects.
When you settle on your props, some extra cup, particularly on 4 blades will also help with your slip %s.
Regards,
Steve

Well FINALLY got the spacer on and tested this weekend. Here's how it went....

1" spacer - B1 28 - 5400 RPM - 70mph same conditions and fuel

The boat still spins out really bad out of the hole, the nose goes way up, and it is sluggish in the midrange. Anyone got any suggestions? Thought maybe a B1 30"? I'm at the end of my rope! I got outrun by a baja this weekend:party-smiley-004: This has gone to far!! LOL!!

Derek

Spinning a Bravo 28 to 5400 rpm and only going 70 mph... something is wrong! That is near 24% slip.

Either that is a really screwed up prop, or your data aquisition is incorrect. (ie tach or speedo.)

When my boat was stock, (600sci), I spun a Bravo 28 to 5300 rpm and the boat ran 80 mph on GPS with a 1 inch spacer.

For that mater, I have never seen a Heat run slip numbers that high... even with a 3.5" prop depth and a 3 bladed prop.

I am not trying to be rude or harsh... just pointing out that this does not make sense.

Chris

I know!! I don't get it!! I got all new livorsi guages just like yours and the GPS Speedo said 69 and the GPS unit I took said 70. I actually took 2 bravo 1 28 props. I had one that I borrowed a while back and actually bought one in the classifieds a week ago. I tested the new one first and thought "This thing is screwed". So I pulled it off cause it was blowing out at 2000 rpm out of the hole and had terrible midrange and top end.

So, I took the 27 P-5 LH with me, stuck it in reverse and hauled ass!! 2000 rpm it spins to 4500 insantly and blows out. That prop only ran 65 at 4600 rpm.

Then I put the B1 28 that I tested with last time and it ran the same as the first B1 28. is a 30 to big? I have a 32 that came with the motor package that I thought was a complete waste of time and now I am wondering?

Any help is a appreciated!!

Derek :drink:

I just put a 26 PX5 Hydromotive on mine and I hit 75MPH GPS at 5280/5320 RPM I also have the 1 inch spacer on mine ...My Boat is a 05 Heat with a 525 ...I was alone in the Boat with a full load of fuel and Bow Cover on (Remember your Bow cover on should gain you a mile or 2 per hour)....
Now I did all that testing on Saturday .....On sunday I did it again I could not get it over 72/73 MPH .....I am thinking water was rougher on Saturday....
I am at Aproxx 1000 Foot Elevation

I will say this though ...That PX5 Really hooks up in turns and stuff ...

Derek,
Hydromotive 330-425-4266
BBlades 920-295-4435
P5-X, like Bent is using. Break out the plastic.
Steve

Something is out of whack. I've set up numerous Heats with similar power and they all ran low 70's on GPS at around 5100-5200RPM with stock 26" B1 props , 1" drive spacers and 1.5:1 drive ratio. I'd get a digital tach and verify accuracy. Check the gear ratio on your drive. The numbers work out about right for a 1.65:1 gear ratio.

Bob

5 Blades = about $200 per Blade

Yasser, but since your's is now a "demo", maybe you can save a little $$.......

I agree with Bob.. The gear ratio's are changed in the lowers on the XR drives.. the math works out to about 16% slip with the 28 bravo prop and a 1.65 gear ratio. That makes more sense... What then doesn't make sense is that the 27 P5x with no spacer.. doing the math with a 1.65 ratio gear.. equals 7% slip. I have never seen a P5x on a Heat with slip numbers that low... spacer or not.

Something really funky is going on here. I would check your tach for sure, along with verifying your GPS speeds again, and your drive ratio.

Chris

Surely the tach isn't wrong? I hit the rev limiter with the B1 28 with no spacer and the old gauges. I will check though. I'm also gonna take the lower off and check the gears today? Can I pull it apart myself or do I need to take it to my mechanic? So if all is right, I guess it's time to unass some money and find a p5-x? Next thursday it's gonna be setting on a lift 2 hours away, so i gotta try to get it right before then. Hope you guys can help.....

Derek :drink:

Guys,
I think 1:65 gears in a Sportmaster is unlikely. I just checked the specs for a 525 with XR and Sportmaster housings, and they are only offered in 1.26, 1.35, and 1.5 ratios. Someone could have have changed the gears out, but that seems unlikely too. Maybe that's a question for the guy you bought your engine and drive from.
Derek, I think you have a bad case of propeller slip, and/or bad information from one of your gauges.
Regards,
Steve

Anyone try a bigger diameter prop? My Prop guy mentioned a maximus? my 496 would smoke this all the way to the top and its killing me!! LOL

Derek

Just curious, is this the only Heat running a Sportsmaster lower?
I have heard some stories on these and they weren't exactly good ones. Only hearsay though.
Dou you happen to have access to a standard lower that you could try?
Dave

The only guy I know of running a sportsmaster lower on a Heat, was the 1st guy with a 600sci on his boat, who lives near St George Utah. He could only get the boat going 78 mph. He tried spacers, props, etc. I on the other hand had an IMCO lower and when I put a spacer on, along with a 28 Bravo, hit 80-81 mph with my open bow boat, which is supposed to be about 2 mph slower than the closed bow boats. I could hit the same speed with a 28 or a 30, just different RPM's.

I think there might be something to trying a different lower unit.

Chris

Guess I'm swapping the sportmaster with a brand new (Very Low Hour) XR off a Shockwave I have. Gonna start with a B1 28 and take a few others (B1 26 and a B1 32) that I have. The sportmaster was 4 3/8 below keel with the 1" spacer and this one is about 3 3/8 (I think). I will measure tomm for sure!! Hope this works..


https://www.me.com/ro/bullittcustoms...12745864010001
Her's what I took Off...
https://www.me.com/ro/bullittcustoms...12745864860001
Here's What's Going on..
https://www.me.com/ro/bullittcustoms...12745864370001
Halfway there!!!
https://www.me.com/ro/bullittcustoms...12745865160001
There it is!! Finally Something that someone knows about!! Guess we will start all over Going to the Lake in the morn with a huge smile and a good attitude!! LOL!! Let me know if you guys think this was a good move... It didn't take long so its not that big of a deal...

Derek

Did those pics show up to everyone? I have a damn apple and its diff...

Derek

I cant see the pictures :(

Chris

oops!!! Trying something different.. That one is what I took off with the spacer.

Here is What's going on!!

https://www.me.com/ro/bullittcustoms...12745864860001

At Halfway!!

https://www.me.com/ro/bullittcustoms...12745864370001

Done, Just needs a bath!!

https://www.me.com/ro/bullittcustoms...12745865160001

X2

Dont worry you will get to the bottom of it. When I put the Whipple on my 496 I had a hell of a time trying to get the setup right. I was running a 28p bravo at 21 to 22% slip. My stock setup with a 24p bravo was 14 to 15% slip. I run a xr standard lower with dwp. My x is 3.5 bellow the bottom of the boat. When I picked up my 26p p5x my slip went from 21% to 14% with no spacer. I picked up 7 to 8 mph just with a prop change. You will get there, it just takes some time and trial and error. The Nordic Boys hear are more than helpful and have been down the same road. keep us posted

I swear I'm not crazy. The pics show up on my apple, but not my dell shop computer... LOL I'll get it right maybe..

Derek

I got my 26 4 Blade back from BBlades Saturday and today I tested them both ....
So my test was 26 Labbed 4 Blade Against 26 P5X ....
my Boat is an 05 Heat with a 525 and a 1 inch spacer testing was done on the mississippi River with about 1/2 load of fuel with my Bow cover on.....I made the excact same run with Both props .....

Top speed with the 4 Blade GPS was 74.9 and just under 1/2 Trim ....If I trimmed any higher I would hit the rev limiter ....So at 74.9 Just under 1/2 trim I was at 5300 RPM ....But the Boat was real Unstable with that Prop in comparsing to the P5X..

The P5X top speed was 73.9 GPS at 5250/5300 RPM ...trim just above the 1/2 way mark....But the Prop keeps the Boat so much more stable .....

So my Decision is to Buy the P5X .....the prop just hooks up so much better then the 4 blade ........I felt I really had to keep both hands on the wheel at Full throttle with the 4 Blade where the 5 Blade I was much more relaxed .....The 5 Blade is expensive but well worth it I think .......

Anyone interested in trying one BBlades will let you try one for 14 days for $40....

Oh BTW I don`t see the pictures either ....

And Derek I don`t mean to hijack your Thread but thought this might be good info for you as well

Everything Helps at this point, thanks....

Took the boat to the lake today with the standard XR and the 28 B1 that I've been testing with. WOW!!! BIG difference. The boat came out of the hole really good and FINALLY didn't blow out. Still alot of slip, but a noticeable diff all through the rpm range. Throttle reponse was pretty good, and the handling was WAY better. Not sure how just the sportmaster can make that much difference, but IT DOES!!!

Prop is currently 3 3/8 below keel - approx 880 elevation - 82 degrees

Boat ran 74mph (garmin gps) at 5300/5350

Well, Were do I go from here? you guys are the experts and my brain is overloaded at this point. One thing is for sure, I am MUCH happier with the standard XR even after one test run.

I did have a B1 26 with me and didn't test it, should I??

Thanks, Derek

It sounds like you are right there. If the boat handle well then the next step is to try a p5x to bring the slip #'s down. These boats seam to run and handle the best a 12 to 14% slip. If you can find the right combo to get there?? Prop or spacer?? I would get my hands on a prop frist. Then spacer. Nice work:drink: