38 avenger vs. .38 special
 

I am selling my 290 and am going to move up to 38. I have found 2 boats that have piqued my interest and wanted to get some opinions. I know what I will get is biased :D but still wanted opinions

Both boats are 99s both have genny, AC, ext hyd steering, k-planes etc. both are fresh water boats

The PQ has 502s and bravos
The .38 has 525SCs (good and bad) and XZ drives and has the boss package

Both boats are under 100k sitting on a trailer

Thanks :drink:

I have been in both and the PQ wins hands down even with the smaller engines. The ride and performance of the PQ are noticeably better. If you look past the performance differences the attention to detail is the next major difference. The Baja just does not compare when you look at the finish of the fiberglass or the interior. I am biased on PQ but that is only after trying out all the rest (Fountain, Baja, Sunsation, and Formula).

Comparison
 

I agree with the commemts from Powerfull Adiction but if what you are looking for is cruiser type space the Baja wins. However the PQ has the best interior space available in a true go fast. ( short of Black Thunder) The Baja is kind of a cross over with a slow bottom and fat middle. You will never get much speed out of it . In addition the ride in the PQ is fantistic.

I really like Baja's, but the "Hump" on the .38 Special looks bad from a lot of angles.

From what I have seen I think I will like the PQ better (I am used to my 290) but I do know that the .38 have a lot of fans as well. My biggest drawback is the 525SCs, I am used to the 502s in my 290 and that all I have to do it turn the key and go and I like the lack of $$$ maintinance that blue motors require over blacks

I am still waiting on more ideas, opinions :eureka:

Yep, I never liked that hump. Makes me hate the whole boat. I'd go for the PQ

In 2001 I looked at both boats very closely and had the rare opportunity to test both boats within minutes of one another; so the water and weather conditions were the same. There was an in-water boat show ending, and I had both dealers hook me up at the end of the show.

The Baja has a great cockpit and is better suited for more riders. However, the space you gain in the cockpit is lost in the cabin. The u-shaped seating area is very small and only very young kids could sleep here. Also, the Baja had (at the time atleast) several areas around the galley area that had sharp edges. This was a big drawback for us and our small children. Cabin height is better in the Baja, but not bad in the Powerquest.

The Powerquest had better fit and finish. All wires were better supported and the rigging was cleaner.

The test ride was a real eye opener! We were out on Lake Michigan (Racine Wisconsin) and there were 3-4' waves that were very mixed-up, so waves were coming in from everywhere. Both dealers had guys manning the stick that had a lot of seat time in the boats, so I felt that the driver was even. I was able to drive each boat for about 5 minutes, but the dealer drove for about 10-minutes. The Baja was first, and it did not perform well. Not from the aspect of speed, but from the inability to handle the conditions. The taller center of gravity cause the boat to run poorly and it also pounded several times very hard. It was not very responsive to controls (felt like a big whale). I personally would never buy this boat for Lake Michigan boating; we were very turned off by the ride. Next, we were in a 38' Powerquest. The Powerquest handled the water MUCH better and offered us an comfortable and safe ride. The driver was running with a lot of tabs and we even bow steered a bit, as the nose was really down. However, I set the boat to run flat and the boat really performed well with this setting. Overall, the Baja was below my expectations and Powerquest met my expectation. The 38 Powerquest earned a few nice honors from Powerboat magazine in 2001, so take a look for the article.

In the end, we did not buy either boat. However, if we did move up to a bigger boat, the Powerquest would have earned our money between the two (easy choice!!!). With that said, we bought a used 40' Hustler and loved the boat (HUGE cabin) and its performance. I also really liked the ride of the 35 and 38 Formula.

Have fun shopping!

The Hump
 

But It's The Hump Tha Gives The Baja The Extra Room. Without The Extra Room The Baja Has No Advantage Over The Pq
The only Advantage Of The Baja Over The Pq Is The Extra Headroom And Cabin Width.

The baja is not even in the Avengers class, other that it being a 38 is not close in any other way. If you want that kind of boat look at a Wellcraft Exclabibur.

Never had the opportunity to ride in a 38 Powerquest.. But, we really do love our .38 special..

The extra width of the hull, the extra height in cabin (6 foot) makes it a great boat for hauling family and friends around. The gen and AC are just icing on the cake for us when we cove out.

The weight of the boat does make it slower but alows you to crush a few waves here and there... :D

We usually have 9 in the cockpit on most weekends.. and are not crowded..

Never ridden in a .38 Special, but Baja's quality was hit an miss back in the late 90's. If you go that route, really check the boat over closely. Some where good back then and others not so good. I've just never been a big fan of the looks of the .38 Special. As for the Avenger, a friend on our local lake has one (also a '99) so I have been on one a few times both here at our local pond and at LOTO. The rough water ride of the PQ is impressive. I was on the boat when we left the Shootout at LOTO last fall and it ate that nasty water up. Cabin and cockpit are roomy and the fit and finish is above production standards. Only downside of this model year of the Avenger is the tendency of the bow to lay flat even with maximum trim. A switch the 5-blade Hydromotives cured that problem though. Good luck with your decision!

Isn't the 1999 the first year of the step for the 38 Avenger? If it is, there were changes made to the hull after 1999, as it was not a great set-up. If it is a non-stepped hull, then it will run a lot slower.

It is a stepped hull on the PQ

I thought so... do a search here on OSO and you will get some information on the changes made to the bottom after the first generation step (1999). The one I rode in was a 2001 and it was a very smooth ride in rough water.

Great THANKS :eureka:

38 Pq
 

Ther 2001 Avenger won Powerboat's Boat Mag. offshore of the year award

I know I am biased but atheistically I think the P.Q. has way better lines. But that's my opinion,some people actually liked G.M.s Pontiac Aztec.

As for the steps in the early boats, mainly 99, PQ recalled almost all of them to fix the steps so it is a non issue.

Well, a non-issue if this particular boat was fixed. I believe they took off the last 2' (4'?) of the inner set of strakes. Originally they ran all the way to the transom, IIRC. Pretty sure there was a thread on here about the "fix", but it was so long ago it might be lost in the ether. Believe it was Raypanic that had it done to his old 38'...

The PQ is built waaay better.
Buy the PQ.

Wow.... I gotta drive a PQ...

We really do like our .38...

I saw a poker run PQ once that did have gen AC also.. I bet that would be nice...

If I end up getting the PQ you are welcome to take a spin :D

Stepped hull 38 Avenger - no contest with same power or even less power as the steps will help. The build quality of the two is NOT comparable as it's my experience that the PQ quality is top notch in their class. No offense to Baja's since they are nice looking boats but for the money and the post, go with the PQ 2002 or newer for the best of all worlds.

Hi, my friend has a 2001 baja 38, 500hp motors. I have a 1998 Avenger. Both boats are great but in there own way. I have 502s and I run about 4mph faster. Both have alot of room. For every day boating, I like my 380. I think baja still needs to work on the quality, but even the most expensive boats have there faults. On the way to the bahamas from miami there was 12 foot rollers and windy, the baja with the 9'3 beam really did a great job. Places like LOTO I think my PQ does better.

ckentling, I own a 38 PQ and have looked at the 38 Not so Specials. As you can see I bought the PQ, I have owned three of them know and have loved them. They all have there own issues but I feel the PQ has less of them. I will be down at LOTO the last week of July if you would like to ride in mine,and yes I am considering selling her. Looking at a 400SS Formula. I don't have gen or ac but you could add it.

As for the power I have the 525sc's and have been very happy with them I asked around alot about them and found out they are very reliable if maintained well. I had mine rebuilt last may and put a roller set up in it. The #5 exhaust lobe went flat on port side (270 hours) so rebuilt them both. I like the blue motors but I will tell you that you should look to rebuild around 300 hours unless it is a roller set up. Over all I would go with the PQ even with the smaller motors, you can always add power if you want. Let me know if your interested and I will get back with you. Good luck.


Rich.

All around the PQ out weighs the Baja. I have owned 2 PQ's and have never had any MAJOR issues, and the factory back-up was great and will be great. Not being partial, I have owned other boats also

What are you going to drive at LOTO if you sell it. This past weekend the boys went out to lunch in the F4, and the girls went in my neighbors 400SS. His wife is an excellent driver. She came over to the F4 10 minutes after Colette got on board and said "you are in trouble, she already likes it."

The good news was after we got back home, I asked her what she would rather have, and she replied the F4 smokes the 400SS on the ride in rough water.

YES:evilb:

John,
That worked out nicely:D I have no idea at this time.

Ckentling.
Did you get my P.M. I sent you?


Rich.

Yes I did, I am still trying to figure out my end of July schedule to see if I can sneak over an dtake a look

THANKS :)

ckentling
I'm leaving Friday a.m. to head down to LOTO, you have my number so just call if you can make it. If not I'll be back down two weeks later and then for the OSS race.

Rich.

I am leaving Wichita Friday AM and will be putting in at PB2 3ish. We are staying at the 14 and are meeting up at Shorty Pants Friday 7ish and we have a party Sat night at Shady gators. Will probably be in PC Sat day

Here is a shot of my boat and I think I PM'd my number to you as well, if I did not please let me know

I look forward to meeting you and seeing the 38 :D

Gee Rich, what do you really think about the Baja?!

No I did not get your phone number, so pm me if you want. I hope to be at the ramp by Ozark BBQ around 2 or so. We are staying at the 10 mm. Look forward to seeing you.


Rich.

Just not my cup of tea.

Never has been!:evilb:

Time to break in those rebuilds this next week!:eek: :D

Not sure if you made your decision yet, just came across this. I have had a '02 PQ for the past 2 seasons (bought new, it sat untitled for a season and a half) and couldn't be happier with the decision. 500 EFI's, xr's, shorties and 5 blades it will run a hair over 80 in calm, 75 all day in the rough stuff. Ride at lake of the ozarks is great, never had a passenger complaint. Finish and power are great, plus cabin and cockpit room are wonderful

Have a neighbor that had a .38 special who recently traded. He never had any major problems, but ALWAYS had small stuff breaking, coming apart, etc. It also, since it was so tall, had a tendency to walk back and forth (side to side) alot over wakes.

Lastly, I am sure there is one lurking out there, but I have NEVER been pasted by a .38 Special.....

What size prop are you running
 

Cullen

What size is the prop you are running. I have a 99 380 that has a blue printed bottom. I sent it back to the factory in 01 and had the bottom redone. I am running 500 efi's with 4 blade 30" lab finish Bravo's. I can run 82 mph on the GPS with 2 people and 1/4 tank of fuel. I am thinking about going to a 5 blade Maxus prop. Is your lab finished or not and is it 28 or 30 pitch?

Blondes Preferred

Check with Rich - I think he ended up going with a Hydromotive P5 this year on his 99 and likes it a lot.

perspective on props and speed
 

OK, I have a 2001 38 with 575sci's and labbed 32" maximus 5 blades. I only get 4900 rpm but can get 84 MPH on the GPS. I tried a set of 30" labbed bravo 4 blades and they spun to the revlimiter at about 30 mph
The 5 blades are great but with HP 500's I would try a 26 std 28 labbed.

I can hit the rev limiters on the 600s with 32 labbed Maximus, but if I trim down a notch I come off the limiters and pick up a couple MPH. We tried a lot of props and these seemed to work out better than others all around, although the 30P non labbed worked well too. Herings were the fastest, but not the best all around prop. The good thing is the rooster tail looks better when you trim down slightly and pick up speed.:D