Looks like you got thing coming together over there, Hope we can get mine back together one day every time I turn around I am haveing to replace another part or in my case two. If you need some help just call maybe we could come up one weekend and give you a hand. I would really like to work on some real horsepower motors instead of these things i am working on. Just ordered two new intakes from summit last night salt water got the best of mine. couplers have to be changed also. Like I said if it's not one thing it's two.

call me if you need an extra hand

What been going on Johnathan? If Eric gets that Fountain its going to hard to get him to work on yours You know they have a ADRL Pro Mod race here this weekend 64 car field Scotty Cannon ,Jenkins,Scruggs small block http://www.outlawpromods.com/flyers/...rnationals.htm. Where headed out Friday.I am Going to try out the Camaro again. Ya ought to try to catch up with us .We might even get to throwing the butane tanks in the ceiling fans again I still need those picks

Rob

May Just come up there if the rain doesn't setin too bad Been raining for the past three days down here
If nothing else may take a ride up there sat.

Coming along good. A buddy of mine used that same cam you are using on a 502 with a 250 blower and twin carbs. It seems to work good. He runs it conservative with 4 lbs. of boost. Idle is ok as well. Good luck and keep posting upgrades.

Tomcat,
You are so far in left field. What is it that your developing as conservative? What is conservative since you don't know the failure point? Have you done any type of stress analysis or long term testing on conservative vs. agressive? What I'm telling you is that port injection does not equal perfect distribution and a big intercooler can have diminishing returns. Trying to brag about having these without having proper information to back it up is what I'm telling you is the problem. Put 8 air fuel meters on it, I guarantee you won't have a consistent air fuel ratio that is less than 1 air fuel ratio from high to low. Then acting like cylinder pressure or accurate air fuel meters are somehow a bad thing is just plain iggnorant. Information is key. How do you know how close you are to knock in what cylinder? Just because you feel it's "conservative" does not mean it is. Proper instrumentation can make opinions into facts, improper instrumentation does not result in facts.

The longer you have a cooler median such as fuel in a supercharger, manifold and runner, the greater the possibility for increased heat reduction. Pressurizing the air to 1.35 in the compressor does heat the air up, as does pressurizing it in the manifold so I'm not sure where your going with that one. The fact that the screw compressor compresses air is the main reason for it's superiority, it has far less leakage or backflow when compared to other designs. For that matter, moving air also increases temperatures, meaning systems with complexed ducting have increased temps and higher psi drops. We deal with psi drops of .5 to 1.5 because we have a very direct path and very efficient intercoolers. We also offer 24fpi with offset fins and have incredible cooling capacity. Our latest design is called the MOAC, Mother Of All Coolers!

You should also take a few days and visit some true high performance racing and see where their injectors are. Whether it's many of the F1 engines, earlier CART engines or many others, they run port injection for transient fueling and low speed fueling, but top end high performance is typically as far up the runner as possible.

Also, please do a little research on screw compressors and see where they've been used for the past 60 years? Umm, yeah, thats the refigiration industry!

As I said, if your using cupronickel, thats great. Too bad cupronickel by itself is far worse than aluminum intercoolers, did you test that? Do you know how bad nickel is for cooling? Our intercoolers offer a patented design of cupronickel for water passages and pure copper air fins. This allows our cores to be resistent to all water types and be efficient at removing heat. Good luck getting some of those made. I'll also give you a bit of advice, fresh water does not equal fresh water. Try running aluminum intercoolers for long peroids in places like Lake Havasu and report back. Once a water passage gets clogged, it will only get worse unless properly cleaned. That corrision attacks the metal at an escalating rate and in a very short time, you can have half the cooling capacity and increased pressure levels to the exposed water passages giving them a higher possibility for failure. The fact that cupronickel melts at a higher temp is very important. This has to do with fatigue and failure. Aluminums rate of expansion and contraction is far greater and is much more sensitive to temp variances. Clogging or poor distribution typically reeks havoc on such a design. Again, a bit of advice for you, you can't control everything that happens in that motor and there will be times that temps will increase to shockingly high temps. Ever measured that centrifugals discharge temp when you closed the throttle at peak rpm without a bypass? What about a backfire?

Thanks,
Dustin

I think this argument is starting to bore everyone and it isn't going to resolve anything anyway. Since we both have better things to do I am not going to continue. Perhaps an independent comparison of dyno numbers, or a test of two similar boats with the different systems installed can be arranged some day.

Tom

Maybe you guys should start a new thread. I do not think differences of opinion are bad. I think both sides learn a little from each other. There are more ways than one to skin a cat. I agree with letting things die on this thread. I have to think Dustin has more R&D than anybody on this forum. Lets see Strips progress.

Strip, I'm impressed with all your gadgets, You probally have forgot more than most people know.

MOAC!! I love that one.Makes me want to buy one just so I can say that.Thanks Dustin,it is very clear you guys spend a ton of $$ on R & D. Strip,Mark is good people.He did my dyno work on my 540 then went out with me for final tuning.Ofcorse he also took time to answer all the stupid questions.I'm sure you'll be happy.Hope to see ya at the TickFaw or the RoyalPurple this year.28 PowerQuest BaDaBing,BOB

One quick question, I have been following your build. Linster just finished mine and put a parts list together and he asked for a Rollmaster timing chain that was a twin chain style. Why are you staying with a single chain?

Linster you have a point. They do need their own thread . I don't see them adding anything helpful or positive to this thread. If you would like add anything helpful to my project I am willing to listen and learn. Thanks

Linster we just got finished flowing the heads . I Will post as soon as he prints them out . They came out fair

Linster I do not claim to be a engine builder or know a hole lot,But I enjoy building them and having fun doing it

Bob280Silencer Yea Mark seems to be one of the best in the Industry on the ECM's.He is very helpful and has patience with people .He will not shoot you a line of BS just to sell you something and he will tell you if something will not work.I do not think you will find anybody like him in Engine business.

Hopefully I will be able to return his generosity Thank you Mark and Precision Marine .

If I every get these hand grenades together I can take them to Mark and well see what they will do . Mark told me the ECM cuts off at 6300rpm so I figure well pull it up to 6200 just to see what it will do This ought to give Sutphen30 a hard on We are going to start calling him MR RPM

I am documenting everything and I am going to give RMBuilder all the Data for his database that he is building .He is like me ,We like sharing info to help others

I hope that I can learn from you guys and maybe I can help others with what I am doing .

Thanks

Rob

It is a CLoydes Hex A Just chain .They said a double chain on the hexajust will not fit on the Gen 6 block. I did some research on them with some other engine builders and they haven't had any problems ..Most of them told me they used the cheaper ones anyway ? Theres not much spring pressure on the motors anyway. The Hexajust makes it easy to degree in the cam.Just personal preference I guess?On my Scarab with the blown motor The chain had 170 hours on it and its still running in another motor I built and sold in the Scarab .I have had good luck with the single chain Hexajust on the big blocks.



When Linster made his post on the Rollmaster someone came up with a old notice about them having a problem . He called and also did some research on them and found it was with a blown small block crank . Only one!! So they withdrew the notice and said it was not the chain[crank gear].You are in good hands with Linnie

Rob

Funny... my engines came back from Charlotte, NC with TWO oil galley plugs drilled out as well. Not really sure if it was good or bad either, but we figured that using one plug with a hole in it was enough for oiling. We also used a Cloyes Hex Adjust as well, but I think it was a double roller.

Yes, that was me on the timing chain gear, but I still think Linster sounds like he's a good man, and a good engine builder.

Sounds to me like these two need to get a new thread and maybe a woman or two. Even though they both sound like they know a hella lot more than me.

Kamma my plugs looked like they were pre drilled . I dont think they drilled them up there.It had 3 different kinds in them. I asked a few people and they said they have seen it come in the higher HP stuff and also in the marine motors from the factory, But it was 50/50.On my small block drag stuff I would drill the hole in the block face. I thinking was with a high voulume pump that one hole should lube it enough.

Does Anybody else have any experance with this?






SpeedJunkie you have any rusted threadless head bolts laying around

The two plugs behind the cam gear that feed the lifters have the small holes in them from GM. The main galley does not. In the GM high performance catalog, a few years back it stated the were installed to keep an air lock from occuring in these runners. All old Gen 4 engines never had them. I keep them in since it does not seem to hurt. I think it helps oiling if you have a roller bearing behind the cam sprocket.

I found this out on my first Gen 5 rebuild. I did not notice the holes and reinstalled all the plugs after the block got out of the shop. When priming the engine in the boat I noticed a bunch of oil in the bildge. One of these with the holes was installed in the rear cam passage. After pulling the engine and correcting the problem, that is what I found out.

Messy mistake.

Hey Strip,I'm looking for just a little more HP.Can I send you my oil pump so you can port and polish it like yours?That along with the Strip/Mark one & only trick intake manifold I should break the 300hp mark! BOB

Yea I know I spent too much time on the oil pump

The intake does look funny doesn't it. I bet a few people would not notice whats wrong.

Bob 300 hp where your at now on HP?


Thanks linnie on the Info.Let me know how your dynoing goes .Good Luck

Rob

Ck this out I was cleaning the drive hubs up and found this on thats Bad You might want to ck yalls when ya tear it down . The splines are all mashed to a sharp point . Looks like it was fixing to strip out .Ill have to ck the shaft on the drive when I get them back from BMax.I did not know I had a problem


The last picture is the bad one .

I have one short block together. The crank had .0075 end play and the main bearings had .0025-0027 and the rear had .0035..

The rods came up between .0025 and .003.

I also have the ballance cards I will post also.



Also on the Keith Eichert oil pan the Fel pro one piece gasket had a lip on the rear that had to be trimmed for the pan to sit down on the gasket . The old gasket was done the same way.I will get a pick on the next motor .

Here are some more picks of my heads before the Valve jobs. Like I said I did not do a lot to the runners .Here is some of the combustion chambers . They came up to 122 cc's after the new valves ,valve job and cutting just .We cut them 007 of all 4 heads just to get them flat .The

My little table and stuff , More combustion chambers

exhaust

Intake and flow bench

Ck out the valve job . The new design seat cut that Mark at Precision Marine came up with has a lot of extra radius's and angles .It blends everything in together. With what I did in the chambers and below the seats there is NO extra work after the valve job to be done. The old style cutters use to leave a ridge and most shops would not go to the trouble to do the extra cuts and then dress the chamber lip. We also did the extra cut on the intake valve . He should be finished with flowing the head Wed and I will get a print out on all the #'s. I am guessing I might of got about 10% at least I am hoping?If not I will make it up artificially

Just think this was on just some old 088 cast iron heads .What a waist of time

Well I got the Whipples in and I could not stand it I took this one apart Ck out the vacuum fittings on the inside of the lower . They had little aluminum flakes coming off the treads where they cut them and didn't dress them up. No biggie

Before final assembly on the heads I wanted to mock it up with the lower intake to ck intake to head face angle . To make sure the angles where OK . since the block had been cut so much and the head cut a little I wanted to make sure . Remember in the beginning of my tear down the leaking intake gasket. Wanted to make sure it wasn't going to pinch it.

The other reason on mock up was to ck port alignment and to trim the intake gaskets . It was off some . I guess core shift in either?

On the openings there is some ridges left after machining. Probably might not hurt flow but it cant hurt to smooth them some . Mark had already told me about this before we ordered the kits.

The kit looks Impressive !!I haven't even unpacked all the boxes of stuff yet. Its going to look good sitting on my old hand grenade motor

You want belive the innercooler core in this thing




One thing that is bothering me is this unpolished bearing[seal] plate,that has the serial # in it.

I see you have the same cylinder head porting kit I do. I thought I had the only Bud Light kit on the market (Post188). After that iron intake, you need some hops to wash it down.

Great pictures, keep them coming.

Looks great Rob, take that unpolished bearing plate and paint it black to match the motor, tape everything else off, thats what we do on our harleys, the middle ring on the rocker boxes, adds a touch of detail to it...Rob

Yea I had a lot of iron Intake on those heads.Linnie it helps with the cutter

Rob the bearring plate is on the inside of the timming chain cover.It want show .The paint would flake off anyway

Can you post a few more pictures of the intake lower, especially looking down into it and also of the upper and intercooler and how it fits together. Thanks.

Strip,Messin' with ya.My 548 makes around 650 with 677 tq at 3700.Lifts my 28 PowerQuest right out of the water.I like IT! Doing all this work to racecars & boats simply means more SMILES per gallon.THAT'S what it's all about.Thanks for sharing all your work with us.BOB

Bob just wish I had more time to do things



Marty I will post some more when I get ready to bolt it on .It is a tight compact package.

Rob

Looking good Strip, Those whipples look wicked!

Hey rob I have a problem what do you do when your motor looks like pic 1 but your assembly table looks like pic 2

Oh and by the way as far as your concern about my head bolts YES I DO ..................
Make you a great deal on them................cheap$$$$$$

Moving up in the world bought stud kits

strip,
Porting the intake certainly helps. You don't have to worry about the top of the ports much but the bottom and sides could really use a nice blend. The bottom can really improve if you really blend the bottom corners of each port, they can be laid back quite a bit.

If you think that IC is big, you should see the MOAC! It's the Mother after all!

Keep up the good work.
Dustin

Hey Strip!

I check this thread about once a week, but I don't post because I am not a motor builder. Nevertheless, with all the work, thought, and attention to detail you are putting into these, I'd take a ride with your "grenade" engines anytime. Looking very good, man.

Cameron

Thanks Guys ..After mocking the heads and intake up there is a pretty good bit of head hanging into the port at the top of the runner . With the block being cut so much and a little on the heads I am going to cut the head intake surface. I am also going to have to do some blending like Dustin said to get everything matched up.I guess there is a little core shift?

SpeedJunkie the bolts and studs will rust the end threads completely off. Remember it also eats the bottom threads in the block also.I remember having the same problem on my old Scarab blower motor. I think ARP said ya only need 8 threads grabbing on them . I had to buy a new block on the Scarab. Probably a good thing at over 800hp


Thanks

Rob

Rob Looking good cant wait to see these things on the dyno making some power.Keep up the good work.Saw Eric's motor yesterday looks good.He is out of control with his color scheme.Have a good one.

Sean

Yea he is talking about changing the intake and carb again. I told him if he was . to do it before going to the dyno.