Gino,

If there is ever going to be 15-20 boats on a regular bases, there needs to be some changes in the basic way that offshore has worked with it's racers.

You get 2-5 boats per class now because thats all they pay.

No one, for any length of time, is going to go out and pay entry fees, race expenses etc. without getting something of value for it.

That value can be something as small a a trophy, TV exposer, or a check, no matter how small. The value depends on the person, and what is important to that person...everyone does it for a different reason.

People will not continue to race....1. when they think they have no chance of winning...2. when their is no value or return on investment to continue...3. it just any fun any more.

When other national race groups had problems filling the field, they make adjustments to make it worth while for racers to come out.

I have never heard of ANY offshore race organization addressing these issues.

Mike

Without race series sponsors where would the purse come from?
How do you get a sizeable sponsor for the sanctioning body without TV?

Several years ago offshore had a recognized TV network and a major corporate sponsor pushing it. Where is offshore (any sanctioning body) now in terms of national, widely recognized sponsors? We know where the sport is as far as TV.

Is it easier for the racers to get good individual sponsors because their sanctioning body has solid, well recognized sponsors? Of course it is. A racer's credibility is enhanced when he can say "I'll be racing against 15 other boats in the chase for the (insert national company here) National Super Duper Series Championship Title". Try telling a prospective sponsor.......... "I'll be racing against 2 other boats in the Acme Plumbing Supply/Bob's Insurance Agency Offshore Championship.

The racers' efforts and the sanctioning bodies' efforts to land sponsors have been damaged by the fragmentation of the sport - how can anyone think otherwise?

Once again, who on the forum is in the advertising/marketing business?

Mike I don't see that....and again I'm talking about Pro-Series CLass's...becuase look up SBI, APBA and OSS Pro class's these guys ran all year...some race were there was very little prize money and some ran for 1st place prize money as high as $6,500 but if its all about the highest prize money then everyone that had conopys would have run OSS becuase they had the highest prize money... but they all did'nt.....who wants to watch a TV show were 2-4 boats are racing each other....As for the comment that if you don't have a shoot of winning teams won't come out....that mentality kills racing....when we had over 23 F1 's in 2001 if we took that thinking there would have only been 5-7 F1's out there....there were teams that came out and gave it there best no matter were they finished thats racing.....if you thing you can put 20 race boat in one class and everyone has the same chance is crazy...because it comes to set up and experience....you not going to just stick someone in SV and say he has the same chance as a Todd .W. Its not going to happen...you have to come out and race to get the experience which means your not going to have a shoot till you get some time under your belt....I'm trying to see who really thinks OSS,APBA and SBI are the ones to blame...the guys that don't even race? P-Class guys? I don't know but talking to a lot of Pro-Series teams...you don't hear them blaming them...ther just going out and racing....My only point is if we can do 1 or 2 more races a year in other Org. it would give all 3 Bodies a higher boat count and will be better for the fans and the city's that put on the event. Which is better for Racing...
As far as the racing bodies not addressing prize money, TV and racers getting something back on there investment....I have been hearing that from all 3 Org. and they have been working hard to do that....I can say from hearing both OSS and APBA these are the first things they talk about and have proved it to me .So I can say first hand they are doing
these things...I don't know how involved you are in OSS and APBA..but if you were you would see what they will do for you. I have been with APBA for 5 years and I will say last year any time I needed anything I called Pop or Dee they were their to answer and took care of what ever I needed..Since also joining OSS. same thing. I have needed things from them already.. I call and they help out...either assistance for sponsors or tech. or just a question...its that simple both Org. will go out of their way to help a racer...Again why all the blame to the people who are giving us a place to race....

Nothing personal Michael - but how are your posts to be counted as constructive or even applicable in this thread? I asked a legitimate question and you are stepping all over it.

Jessss....Gino come on

Let's take this one step at a time

1. I drought that $6500 even covers the fuel bill (trucks cars boats toys etc) for some of the some of the pro class teams on some weekends. They are racing for something of value to them...and to most it's not money.

2. that mentality is racing...who says "I'm going out, do all this work, spend all this money, to try to loss."

3. Gino, what did you and Mark do to Factory 1...Yeah, I watched in 2001, and I promised myself that it was time to get involved again...So I spend Myself it obliquity...know we need seat time and end up with no chance of winning against you guys.....Hey..Don't feel bad, my other best friend killed B class...and they had 20+ boats for years.

4. If you read my post again, I never said anything about money...ON PURPOSE. Racing value means allot of different things to different people...Gino, you have to understand that.

5. I blame any organization that does not give racers a level and leveled playing field...I know that is a bold statement...but you and I both know, that if they (who ever that is) had worked to slow you and Mark down, there may still be a popular F1 class...also understand this...Mark would have worked harder to win...and that is a lot of the value to Mark. But unfortunately more work, more money, etc, to 19 other racers doesn't seem as fun....do you see my point.

6. I agree, every racer should race every race. Someone figure out a way we can all afford to do that.

7. I'm not blaming any one person...I think we are all at fault...BUT it's also the best people I have ever meet in my life...we share a passion for a unique sport.

Luv Ya Gino, I'm out of Morgans

Mike

P.S. Phantom1...we where working with some of the top marketing people at Bud when things went wrong for Key West 2 years ago...they do watch us ..we need Kilokats input

Mike,
The point is...the Pro-Series guys are not the one's bit#hing....Its guys that are not running them class's that are....To many guys are running there mouths about how the Santioning Body's are killing the sport....If some teams choose to dig into there own pocket to race then thats there right.....If you think this sport is going to pay your way to keep your team running...its not going to happen...thats why every professional racing team has sponsors....and every owner has to put up there own money to get good enough to run out front to get the big sponsorship money....do you think Offshore Racing is going to pay $50,000 a class to get racers out there....as far as making racing fair....what's not fair about it....because Mark has alot of money and test time and seat time in a F1 Fountain and a Activator and you can't keep up...thats your definition of not fair....THAT'S RACING..


I also stand corrected on the highest purse money for 2004....it was SBI in SV at the SBI/APBA race in Washinton, N.C. I have been informed that the prize purse was $24,000 for SV with Reggie putting up additional prize money for that class...Sorry for the mistake John C. and Reggie....

I am simply saying the course that has been chosen has hurt the sport commercially.

This is not unique to Offshore racing. Look at Champ car and IRL. Some of the Teams and Tony George decide to split off rather then stay with CART and work through there issues. At that time CART was big - all races were televised live mostly on ABC. The sponsor money and marketing synergies were vast, and they were rapidly building an audience outside of the US.

Today both sanctioning bodies are in trouble. The races are poorly attended and the fields are never full of competitors. The races are generally broadcast but not on ABC any longer. The point is nothing good has come from the split with the exception of a few team owners and Tony George getting their way. Offshore is on the exact same path as IRL and Champ car. If the once prosperous CART cannot survive this, how can Offshore?

Offshore was easier to sell when a potential sponsor could and probably did see it on TV. Not only has the TV disappeared but so has most of the print media. If you do a search after a race goes off you will find very few printed articles. Sponsors pay for positive exposure. You may land a sponsorship deal, but can you retain it under the current operating model? Most deals are financially marginal for the race team in the first year due to the cost to sell, graphics, uniforms etc. The following years are when a team has the best chance of retaining the sponsorship dollars and deliver value to the sponsor. If you cannot retain both your primary and a good portion of your secondary sponsors the net income to the team is very low.

Finally look at Baseball and NASCAR. It is no coincidence that when baseball went on strike that NASCAR's fan base grew rapidly. The baseball fans did not agree with the selfishness of players and the clean image and close competition NASCAR offered every week filled the void. Baseball still feels the effect of the strike to this day, and NASCAR is now building an International audience.

Food for thought........

Phontom1,
Very true......and sorry for getting off the subject.....my bust.

Everything you have said is good stuff and applicable. Thanks for the input.