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Re: Y2K props
I think Mike said the prop shaft was 3" below the bottom before he changed the drive.
Now it is 1" below with the Speed Master. The 24' Super I/Os have the X at 18" or so. My Pantera was the same. The prop shaft is 5" below the point of the V on my boat and 6-1-/2" below the pad on the step 24' I/O. Condor 24 re-rigged his 1-1/2" to 2" higher than mine. we'll see how he makes out. How is the 30' Y2K set up? |
Re: Y2K props
Sometimes its best just to sit back and listen.Singles do need alot of bow lift.The original set up was 2 below with a neutral box=3 below plus leverage from the box.All = to 86-87 with 550n hp.nothing fancy with props.Now with the speedy IV the motor was able to be lowered 1.5 inches in the boat for better center of gravity and prop still 1 below the bottom.And yes they do make spacers from the 1-3 inches.So changing the X will be effortless.With the speedy case being so narrow you get to use alot more blade surface of the prop so im hoping on not going to low with the drive and still being effective.But we all know its a trial in error.
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Re: Y2K props
Who is going to give me a ride in a 30' Superboat next year???
MERRY CHRISTMAS AND HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO ALL!!! :drink: |
Re: Y2K props
1 Attachment(s)
Originally Posted by jcap
Thrust is a mechanical force which is generated through the reaction of accelerating a mass of gas, as explained by Newton's third law of motion. The gas or working fluid is accelerated to the rear and the engine and craft are accelerated in the opposite direction.
From Newton's second law of motion, we can define a force F to be the change in momentum of an object with a change in time. Momentum is the object's mass m times the velocity V. So, between two times t1 and t2, the force is given by: F = ((m * V)2 - (m * V)1) / (t2 - t1) If we keep the mass constant and just change the velocity with time we obtain the simple force equation - force equals mass time acceleration a F = m * a If we are dealing with a solid, keeping track of the mass is relatively easy; the molecules of a solid are closely bound to each other and a solid retains its shape. But if we are dealing with a fluid (liquid or gas) and particularly if we are dealing with a moving fluid, keeping track of the mass gets tricky. For a moving fluid, the important parameter is the mass flow rate. Mass flow rate is the amount of mass moving through a given plane over some amount of time. Its dimensions are mass/time (kg/sec, slug/sec, ...) and it is equal to the density r times the velocity V times the area A. Aerodynamicists denote this parameter as m dot (m with a little dot over the top). Jim |
Re: Y2K props
HEY PAT, YOU ARE WELCOME " DOWN THE SHORE " ANY TIME. SUPERBABI WILL BE WAITING !!!!! MERRY CHRISTMAS.......... :evilb:
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Re: Y2K props
Pat - come to Texas again, I'll meet you and get you for a ride in the SB!!! JCap, my heads spinning just like Bash above - we were LOL at the image he attached!
I do agree there's nothing that beats trials - get out there and report back - we finally hit some cold weather so I don't know when I can report on the 5 blade, but i'll do it as soon as I can Keth |
Re: Y2K props
Originally Posted by Pat McPherson
Hey Dave M.
What do you think? Got an extra $1000 in the budjet? I know we both need new props.... :evilb: |
Re: Y2K props
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Here's what looks like to be a pic of DaveM "dialing in" his old set up.
-Man...more H.P....bigger prop...I gotta do some dialing in myself. :D |
Re: Y2K props
THAT pic looks familiar! That boat is one wild ride! :D
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Re: Y2K props
Mike ,
Try going deeper, a spacer is cheaper than a speedy prop anyhow ! I gained 5 mph by adding a 2 inch spacer , I know that goes against what most of us have been taught but it worked for me. Deeper drive also aids bow lift |
Re: Y2K props
Hey Guys
I find this calculator really very helpful & takes the guess out . It is the easiest to use I have found...as you don't have to type anything...just select the numbers.You can alter every combination easily & accurately. - For O/B's...We use a slip % of "10". It puts me right at what I run/ran in previous setups! - I/O boys??? http://www.boatramp.com/prop_applet/...erAppletG.html REMEMBER...SLIP IS THE #1 KILLER OF SPEED!!! |
Re: Y2K props
iv seen that chart bash its good but prop pitch only goes to 27
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Re: Y2K props
No. You gotta click on the + or - signs below the yellow box to fine tune! :rolleyes:
-Goes to 31pitch...120MPH...& oh yeah 20,000RPM's!!! :rolleyes: |
Re: Y2K props
Hi Jim, I just read this thread, Is your max speed, with the spacer, trimmed to the moon?, is the spacer added to your original drive height. I think your's and Jr's need the deeper drive to get leverage to trim. how does the different X's compare at
level trim, and can you race trimmed up with out the nose flying around. Eddie |
Re: Y2K props
hey Eddie,
spacer was added to original drive hieght, max speed is with drive about 3/4 of max trim up (trimmed to the moon i lose 2 mph) level trim no spacer 85-86mph, level trim 2 in spacer 88mph , the five blade gave me much better bow lift but the nose is never flying around even if i trim to the moon and yes I can race trimmed up. I havnt gotten original info regarding my X dim from jc but prop shaft was 3 inches below keel its now 5 with the spacer. I Still feel the boat rides wet , stern deep in the water and I am sure that is robbing some speed but it makes the boat very stable at speed and high speed turn ability is excellent, I am hoping Ric is going to find out my boats layup and x dim info .what is your prop shaft height ? did you ever try a shortie? Jim |
Re: Y2K props
Yes, Ran the Shorty, but it was a Sportmaster lower, add hp with the VORTECH engine around 560 and ran 80 81, changed back to standard lower and runs 83 to 84 with same motor, My x and yours should be the same, maybe I'll try going lower for ****s and giggles.
Eddie |
Re: Y2K props
I cant take the credit for trying to go deeper, throttle -up was doing testing on Randys SVL and found it ran faster with spacers , my slip numbers always seemed to high, going deeper dropped the slip and raised MPH , I also tried a shorty and lost speed ,have you tried a 5 blade?
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Re: Y2K props
Hey Jcap and Fastedy,
Why would the drive be mounted so much higher in the 30' vs. 24' Superboat? The prop shaft is approx. 5" below the V on my 24' and approx 6-1/2" below the pad on the step 24'. Jim is having his best results with about the same depth as my boat... Maybe there should be a change on the stock set-up on the 30' ? FX10 any comments? |
Re: Y2K props
Pat,
What year is your 24 ? |
Re: Y2K props
My boat is a 1997 24' I/O model...
I believe the last year before the step/pad 24'. |
Re: Y2K props
The drive height is higher on the Y2K, due to the steps.
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Re: Y2K props
NOT DIRECTED TOWARD ANYONE!!! but... think you can somewhat compare drive heights on a 24 to a 30...since a 30 is a stretched 24.
-Steps or no steps...pad or no pad...notch or no notch...propshaft centerline is taken from the bottom of the hulls most rearward running surface with a straight edge to the centerline of the propshaft whether its 6" off the transom or 3' back. -I think the steps kill bowlift. Instead of having a nice straight surface...you now have the bow lower than the stern! :rolleyes: Or am I missing something? -For FX10 :) How come the Y2K's don't share the padded bottom like the 24's ? -While I'm on the subject :rolleyes: ...Herb (Intimidator Boats) had a 24 I/O non step/non pad. He had a 300X O/B with a 26" bracket. Being a "builder"...he fitted the 24 with a pad he made. I was told he gained speed. Boat did go upper 70's. I have found out from my own experiences with 21 -24 SB's that they don't really fully "come up on pad" to around 73-74mph besides. :) |
Re: Y2K props
Hi FX10,
Like I previously stated, the propshaft of the step/pad 24' is 6-1/2" below the pad, as measured by Dave M. I would say that puts it in about the same place as my none step 24' at 5" below the V. I owned a 1989 24' Pantera and it was rigged the same. I believe you have the X dim on the 24' I/O right on... The stock 30' has the prop shaft at 3" below the V right? At least on Jcap and Fastedy's boats. Jcap found that a 2" spacer helped with bow lift and speed. 2+3=5" Now the same on Jcap's boat as my 24'... I am sure JC had good reason for going higher with the X dimension, would you mind asking? I know that you fellows are trying to get Superbabi to run faster than the other 30' Superboats powered with the 496HO. This may be a place to look for more... |
Re: Y2K props
Hey Bash,
I remember awhile back you posted a pic of your pad on your 24. Still have it on the puter ? If you do , post it for me. Thanks Rick |
Re: Y2K props
3 Attachment(s)
-First two of my 24.
-3rd of 30 Y2K "All Rise". I would like to comment after all this bowlift talk. Bowlift to me is not wanted in the big ruff water for these hulls. They run FASTER & SMOOTHER level...using the cutting action of the VEE. My TOP SPEED evaluations are for smooth, flat, low chop conditions only. I know these are Offshore style hulls...& really not intended for lake TOP SPEED conditions. As comparison...a 24 Progression has a higher Bow stance when running in normal conditons...making it a faster hull. I would take the 24 SUPERBOAT over the 24 Progression in 4-5's any day. -You know...the more I look at the 24 & 30....there is only a very slight difference in the two's. The 30 looks like a little "sharper" vee...while the 24 has like that 1" drop before the pad. |
Re: Y2K props
Bash,
Since I''ve been back I haven't had the pleasure to build a 24 yet. I must have 40 of them under my belt though. I wasn't sure of the pad in the 24, thats why I asked for the pic. From what I can see, the 24, and 30 have the same pad, if you can call it that. In my opinion, it's better to have the bow lift to start with. If you don''t have it, it takes alot of power and trim to get the bow up, which can rob you of speed. If the hull has a bow that rides higher, it takes less trim, which theoretically uses less power, and should go faster. The 24 and 30 share the same bow and deep vee, as you know, the 30 is a stretched 24. Rick |
Re: Y2K props
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Hey Rick,
Did you build my 1997 24' straight V bottom? Did you have a chance to ask JC why he went higher with the X on the 30' step but not on the 24' step? |
Re: Y2K props
Pat,
I wasn't back with John till last year. So your boat wasn't built by me. If I'm not mistaken, John raised the X because he found it gave more speed. I might be wrong. I''ll ask him next Monday when I go back to work. I can''t wait to get back to work !!! These "Honey Do Lists" that Kate keeps giving me are KILLING MEEEEEEE !!! |
Re: Y2K props
SO RICK, KATE IS DRAINING YOU....I GUESS YOUR MISSING JOHN !!!!!!!!!!! LOL LOL.... :evilb:
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Re: Y2K props
If the 24 and 30 are the same hull the 30 should have a lower drive height, longer hull requires more force to raise the bow, higher drive means less lift , I dont have my CAD program on here but its simple physics , the longer the hull the more force required to raise the bow, Bash is right the perfect set-up would have you running level but you need the ability to trim in both directions, the 30 with the wrong prop needs lots of trim to run level the perfect set-up would have you running level with the prop shaft parallel with the hulls running surface not trimmed up and wasting thrust
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Re: Y2K props
1 Attachment(s)
crude but im sure you get the idea
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Re: Y2K props
Sweet diagram JCAP!...
-Hey Rick...you should show that to JC. http://photos.imageevent.com/superbash/gifs/bang.gif |
Re: Y2K props
I would love to !! I've been trying to convince John to invest in the Autoship (CAD) software. I've already spoken to a Autoship rep about it. It's $ 5,800. John Jr. said he would kick in half if dad went for the rest. I have years of Autocad experience, and the rep said it would be compatable with autoship. The software also comes with Autopower, which, after the hull is programmed in, you program the HP, prop and it will give you a theoretical speed. Fountain uses this software.I believe that part is Hydrostatic testing. It's a cool program, and I hope I can convince John to get it. I got to get him into the computer age !!!
Rick |
Re: Y2K props
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Re: Y2K props
Ok bash , my pic sucked , but you got the idea! hey you the man with the funky avatars!
Ric, now ya talking, I have used AUTOSHIP hydrostatics and stability software , it is used by ALL major ship builders including the United States Navy, CAD software is used by all the major Performance builders Jim |
Re: Y2K props
Jim,
You wouldn't happen to know where I can get a copy, Would you ? ;) |
Re: Y2K props
Why does the gell look like it was brushed on in that third picture of the Y2K ? Also why is the drain plug just off center?
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Re: Y2K props
That bottom was a bottom that was bottom painted for a customer in Jersey. It was a Y2K named "All Rise". And the Garboard drain plug is off center due to the board thats glassed into the bottom for the water to drain to the stern.
Rick |
Re: Y2K props
Thats a sin. Now I realize what Gary meant when he said "a Jersey Y2K that sits in brackish water".
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Re: Y2K props
So "All Rise" sat in the pond over night. I thought all Superboats were treated as "Trailer Queens" !!
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