28 Apache bulkheads
 

It doesn't sound right to me, what do you guys think? This 28 Apache I called on has termite damage to the bulkhead, I haven't quite figured out which one yet. He is suppose to send me pics of it. He is telling me that it is not a structural bulkhead. Does the 28 have any bulkheads that do not serve a purpose structurally?

I doubt the anchor locker bulkhead is structural. Not sure of any others. Eric Froberg would know for sure.

The upper bulkhead of the 28 Apache is made of wood, around the dash and down the lenght of the boat, it is common to have damage to that part of the boat!!

Every Bulkhead ,,in any boat is structural !!!!!!!!!

Thats wy they are called crashbulkheads !!!!!

They just dont hold the boat toghether when not in a crash ,they also can save your life ,when something goes wrong (stuff,or crash) !!!:eek:

WMF what kind of damage is common on this bulkhead, and how hard is it to replace that one? This guy is telling me that it is only cosmetic not structural. The damage is from termites. Has anybody looked at the 28 in the classifieds at Extreme Marine?

Yes I have looked at that boat, it looks like junk, the motors look like they need Serious work, it looks like a money pit, if you can the boat for 5,000 it might be a deal, I dumped 17,000 in fiberglass work into my old Apache 28 and it was in way better cond then that boat!!!!! just go back and check out my restoration thread, it will tell you everything you need to know.

WTF? News to me.............. I didn't see any bulkhead damage on mine or yours and I've never heard of bulkhead damage being a common thing on any apache. Are you referring to gelcoat cracks in the fairing? I don't recall your restoration doing any major work to the bulkheads.

I am talking about the upper dash assy, cracks and damage, if you look under your dash it has a wood frame, and the entire bulkhead is made of wood, mine had no bulk head damage, just cracks and some rotted wood.

Anything is repairable and changing a bulkhead is not that hard , if you know what your doing .
Cost for Bulkhead i quess ,,,,,,,,,,,about 1500-2500 $.
Also if the price is right, i would go for it.
The engines dont look that bad , i have seen worse and still running.
APACHE is a great boat ,thats for shure.
But still Bulkheads are structural, maybe is calling something bulkhead that isn,t a bulkhead .:ernaehrung004:

Big boat, be careful and ask around before you waste time and money going to see certain 28's. I hunted for a long time and there are a few here who did also.

Some of them have some issues that cannot be easily fixed and will require extensive and expensive work.

I wasted 2 days gong to see a particular one just to find out it had been crashed and possibly sunk. Owner said it needed some work but was in generally good shape......:angry-smiley-038:

Those cracks are just the gelcoat in the fiberglass fairing. The dash is that.....a dash. If you didn't have any bulkhead damage then who told you that bulkhead damage is common in a 28 Apache?

Why are F-ing with me Andy, I completely restore my 28 Apache and sold it, I was not thier for most of the fiberglass work, but I know what I am talking about, the dash is made of fiberglass, so is the upper fairing, but behind the dash is all wood, it rots from water, moisture and nature, check behind your dash

You did some good work on the boat, but IMO a complete restoration includes repowering and taking the deck off.

I have checked behind the dash, I didn't see any rot or structural problems, I'm sorry that you did. I don't mean to F with you, but you coming on here and saying bulkhead damage is common on 28 apache's is BS. Other than this termite damage and the 28 that warpaint wrecked - I've never seen this issue come up. I watched your restoration - you didn't do any major structural work. Chit man you didn't even pull the engines - I have. So I ask again - if you didn't have any bulkhead damage and I didn't have any bulkhead damage then who told you that bulkhead damage is common on 28 apache's? Do you have any facts or first hand experiences to back up your dangerous claim that bulkhead damage is common on 28 apaches?

Andy I am not bitter about my old boat at all, it was a learning experience, I enjoyed while I had it and now John can enjoy it!!!!, My boat was restored as much any anyone would have restored my Apache, the damage I was talking about is in the upper faring around the top of the dash, I is not just cracks it goes deeper then that, it was the way they built them, when you get your gel coat fixed then you will see what I am talking about!!! I think most 28 Apache's out thier are beatin older boat, that need lots of money to make right!!! It is cheaper to buy a newer/ running boat, unless you love the old school boats, and like working on them!! I work on crap all day and the last thing I want to do is fix my own boat!!! Hey Andy you need to tone it down alittle with me!! I have been nothing but nice to you, but now I am straring to see why everyone hates you.

Hates a strong word, and a fairing is not a bulkhead. Sorry to of pissed you off, but I think you can see why I was so upset.

I dont see why you would get pissed, all boat have different problems, and older boats have tons of them!!!!, they are expensive to operate, and maintain. In this market it is cheaper to buy a newer running boat if you have the money, I know, I have owned alot more boats then just that Apache, and the hate thng:ernaehrung004:

I'm pissed because your comment was not true and it implies that the boat has common structural problems. Try selling a boat like that. Yah I know its old and it has old boat problems, but not as bad as you make them out to be. Cracks and all it will still eat up the rough water like nothing else. If you think its cheaper to buy new then you haven't priced a new 28 apache.....or atleast thats what I keep telling myself:ernaehrung004:

Doesn't mean that it was the wrong word.

But I agree about problems not being universal among 28s. Some don't even have crusty butts.

I am not saying the 28 Apache has any hull problems, I am saying thier is a problem with the upper fairing, it had something to do with the way it came out of the mold. Why get pissed about me talking about a boat that is not even your's, that Apache 28 for sale in Miami is way over priced and needs major work, that is my point!!!!

Andy in this market a completely restore 28 Apache, that runs perfect would only bring around 45-70k depending on the year and how it was done, I believe my old 28 Apache when it is done will be one of the nicest out thier!!!! You can buy alot of boat today for that kind of money, they are not going to bring 250k like the one Mark McManus has for sale, no way!!!!, That Apache will never sell for that price and the owner knows that and most likely does not care!!!!, I doubt they need to sell it or the price would reflect that!!!

WMF thanks for your info on that boat.

the only common problem I have heard of on 28 Apache's is cracked 'knees'. I have seen a couple of them with this problem and a couple without. The ones I have seen with the problem were run hard and had big power. The knees are not structural like the main stringers and are merely there to protect a panel underneath. I was also told it isnt a hard repair by a good fiberglass person.... at least thats what I was told by the person who built these boats.

Andy, your boat doesnt have this problem, at least thats what the surveyor told me who did the boat when you bought it, whom I also used to survey a different 28 Apache.


I posted a couple pics on an old thread of cracked knees.

Not trying to stir the pot but I thought I would add some of my limited knowledge to the discussion. :ernaehrung004:

Dont piss him off Adam, you better have facts to back up that bold statement:drink:

Big boat, why dont you look into one of the two 28 Pantera Singles for sale right now without power? Both are newer and each boat is priced so that you could negotiate a price point where you could put in a good reliable engine with enough power to make it fun. Single engine is the way to go under 30ft in my opinion. My Pantera runs 81.6mph with a stock 26p bravo 4 blade and 710hp (give or take as per engine shop). JO told me that with some prop work and light fuel load, etc I could be seeing 85-87mph.

If I blow a drive or a motor, I only have one to fix.....one set of gauges, less worries.

I have smoked guys in Cafe racers, 292 Fastechs and even a 35 Fountain (I think the guy ran out of balls to be honest cause it was rough). All twin engined GOOD boats.

If you have people tell you that a 700hp 540 cant be reliable, they are buying engines from the wrong people. You wouldnt beleive how well mine runs and idles, It suprised Airpacker and he is a master mechanic who has forgotten more about this **** than most of us will ever hope to know.


Just want to help you cause I went throught this same search (28 ft boat with rough water capability and old school looks)

BTW I am not bashing Apaches in any way, I am actually a huge fan/groupie lol. :ernaehrung004: Just think Big Boat might be better off in a diffferent boat. I was.

I have the email signed by a man with the initials B. S.

Chief of the tribe......:cool:

That might not be enuff:ernaehrung004:

LOL, atleast ar15meister knows what a bulkhead is. So what thats two people who have agreed with me.....counting FR and he hates me. No reason to be bitter over it :ernaehrung004:

If you have to count my post reminding people that some 28s are nice and some have crusty butts as agreeing with you, you are more desperate than people think, Nancy.

Hey Andy I think I know more about the 28 Apache then you do, I did a real restoration on my boat, not a OSO paint my drive's with a brush resto!!!!!, give me a break, I know what a bulk head is, I also know what a A#$hole is, do you???

I dont think I agreed either....:eek: I dont have a dog in this fight so I am staying out.

I have been thinking about this termite thing and it is bugging me.

I dont understand why you would even keep the converstaion going with the guy selling the boat once you discovered there was this type of issue. There is likely alot more than that.

I am telling you, you like Panteras, why not make an offer on Dude Sweet's boat and put an engine in it and have some fun?

Or Elite marine's boat?



Dont buy a beat up 28 Apache and have to dump a ton of money and TIME into it (I nearly did, so happy I didnt)....the only 28's I would touch were Bills (once he was done with it:cool:) but that is sold. Also the 28 Cherokee 3 man race boat with the single was sick, but I never saw it in person nor do I have intimate knowledge of it. The 28 swneedle has doesnt have cracked knees and it looks nice from pics but, again, I dont have intimate knowledge nor have I seen it. I was also told that the engines have approximately 300hrs on them when I inquired about the boat. I would definately get a leakdown on them.

I had my Pantera get a full survey as well as had a serious engine builder perform a leakdown test and a compression test. It passed with flying colours (8% was the worst leakage I got). I wrote a cheque (canadian for Check)

Anyhow, good luck.

Adam

Bugging me- now that's good chit right there!

Sorry for the stupid question, but what are "cracked knees"??

Thanks,

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sorry for the sizes guys I still have no idea how to resize.

I am done with the 28 with the termite damage after WMF said it was a piece of junk. Someday I will have another fast boat. I want twin engines and a cabin. I am on a budget:mad: per the wife.

Is there any particular reason you want twins?

Have you ridden in a 28 Pantera with a single?

Most have cabins. Mine doesnt and I havent had one instance where I thought 'man I wish I had a cabin'.

I have a few buddies who have perf boats and all they use the cabin for is bangin and lighting smokes on plane lol.....two things that can be done (in a pinch) in my boat if you needed/ wanted to ....just not quite as well..... :evilb:

ar15meister,

Thanks for the pictures. What part of the boat is that? I'm going to look at an Apache 28 tomorow and would like to know what to look for.

Thanks, again

Never riden in a 28 with a single but had one with twins and loved it. I like the idea of twins just feel safer, whats the chances of both breaking down at the same time. We slept on our 28 quite a few times over the years. We did poker runs on Lake St Clair, Thousand Islands, boated around the islands and went to Cumberland a few times all staying on the boat.