Baja Fountain layoffs
12-02-2008 | 11:57 AM
#31
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,176
Likes: 333
From: ankeny,ia.
Another great point! We all like big motors but remember big motors take much more maintence. HP500-575's (JT will know more than I) will need head work, spring work etc around 350-400 hours if not sooner. Even the 454-502 MAG MPI's need head gaskets and other top end work at the 350-400hr mark. HP700's need the same at 300, not to mention other high cost maintenece ie: blower oil changes, tranny oil, engine oil, drive oil etc...
We "re-freshed" several HP500's last winter and it gets expensive if you like to boat rather than float.
I have seen 496's with 700-800 hours on them, not using any oil, always starting, problem free. A huge benifit to stock power.
We "re-freshed" several HP500's last winter and it gets expensive if you like to boat rather than float.
I have seen 496's with 700-800 hours on them, not using any oil, always starting, problem free. A huge benifit to stock power.
Agree'd Brett,
But I've seen plenty of 454-502 MPI's run a loong time too,
longer than 350-to 400 hrs....I would say they should have
basically the same longevity as the 496's, hours wise.
I have seen an occasional valve problem with some
of the early to mid 90's mag motors, but nothing cronic.
The HP stuff does require sooner maint. intervals,
and if I wasn't able to do those things myself, I probably
wouldn't have them.
12-02-2008 | 01:06 PM
#32
Registered
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 378
Likes: 0
From: Harrison, Oh/Lake Cumberland, Ky
Agree'd Brett,
But I've seen plenty of 454-502 MPI's run a loong time too,
longer than 350-to 400 hrs....I would say they should have
basically the same longevity as the 496's, hours wise.
I have seen an occasional valve problem with some
of the early to mid 90's mag motors, but nothing cronic.
The HP stuff does require sooner maint. intervals,
and if I wasn't able to do those things myself, I probably
wouldn't have them.
But I've seen plenty of 454-502 MPI's run a loong time too,
longer than 350-to 400 hrs....I would say they should have
basically the same longevity as the 496's, hours wise.
I have seen an occasional valve problem with some
of the early to mid 90's mag motors, but nothing cronic.
The HP stuff does require sooner maint. intervals,
and if I wasn't able to do those things myself, I probably
wouldn't have them.
454/502 and 496mag/ho are all acceptable options for turn key fun, just winterize and repeat each year for three or four years with basic servicing at winterization. 525 and up, not so much. Figuring 80-100 hours of run time a year. Sound reasonable?
12-02-2008 | 01:58 PM
#33
VIP Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,176
Likes: 333
From: ankeny,ia.
requirements the HP engines do.....they should provide
adequate service til' either they quit making the power
they once did, or oil consumption gets high.....the'll run
a loong time if properly maintained.
Most of the blue engines have the obstacle with the valvetrain
needing attention around the 250-300 hr mark.
( HP500, 500EFI, 525EFI, 600/700SCI)
575's have headgasket issues in that area.
I did my HP500's in my last boat at that mark, and am doing the head gaskets in my 575's this winter.
Both of these sets of engines have been turn key,
but when you get to that hour interval where maint
is recommended, you're "rolling the dice" if you don't do it.
Last edited by JaayTeee; 12-02-2008 at 02:02 PM.
12-10-2008 | 02:02 PM
#34
Registered
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 250
Likes: 0
From: S. Fort Myers, FL
Another great point! We all like big motors but remember big motors take much more maintence. HP500-575's (JT will know more than I) will need head work, spring work etc around 350-400 hours if not sooner. Even the 454-502 MAG MPI's need head gaskets and other top end work at the 350-400hr mark. HP700's need the same at 300, not to mention other high cost maintenece ie: blower oil changes, tranny oil, engine oil, drive oil etc...
We "re-freshed" several HP500's last winter and it gets expensive if you like to boat rather than float.
I have seen 496's with 700-800 hours on them, not using any oil, always starting, problem free. A huge benifit to stock power.
We "re-freshed" several HP500's last winter and it gets expensive if you like to boat rather than float.
I have seen 496's with 700-800 hours on them, not using any oil, always starting, problem free. A huge benifit to stock power.
12-10-2008 | 06:41 PM
#35
Registered
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,974
Likes: 495
From: Cleveland, OH / Pewaukee, WI
Hey Guys, No doubt Reggie builds a nice boat but I do have to argue with the best value foot for foot statement. I know there has been one disgruntled customer bad mouthing us on here but all I can say is dont believe everything you here. We have been building boats since 1963 so I guess one upset customer in 45 years isnt too bad! Anyway, thats not what I am on here for. I know all of you have noticed that one of our 34' Drones has won his division 3 years in a row now at LOTO. Guess you can say thats not just luck. We have a 10 year hull warranty on all of our boats and they all handle and ride like a dream. Dollar for dollar no one can compete guaranteed! Our new 39' Patron is equipped with Twin / Staggered 525's with ITS and all the goodies. Has over 6' of headroom in the cabin and is fully loaded for only $259,990! I personally guarantee that no one can match that and we also have full carbon fiber and kevlar options available for all of the racers! All i am saying is check it out for yourself!
Jr.
12-10-2008 | 07:06 PM
#36
Registered
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 6,306
Likes: 1
From: Lake Lanier - N. Georgia
From most recently released Boat Trader search data for the week of 23 May 2008,
as reported on Sounding's Trade Only
(http://www.tradeonlytoday.com/index....hives/445322):
Top powerboats searched when length 20-30 ft.
1. Joker 33,348 6. Grady-White 8,396
2. Bayliner 12,702 7. Chaparral 7,932
3. Baja 10,578 8. Ranger 7,604
4. Crownline 8,920 9. Cobalt 6,703
5. Wellcraft 8,481 10. Mako 6,660
Top powerboats searched when length 30-40 ft.
1. Sea Ray 11,998 6. Bayliner 2,118
2. Fountain 4,000 7. Baja 1,923
3. Formula 3,175 8. Contender 1,892
4. Carver 2,539 9. Silverton 1,774
5. Wellcraft 2,427 10. Donzi 1,431
Top powerboats searched when length 40-50 ft.
1. Sea Ray 3,258 6. Formula 408
2. Carver 627 7. Silverton 343
3. Chris-Craft 477 8. Gibson 328
4. Fountain 456 9. Hatteras 325
5. Viking 414 10. Mainship 301
Note that Baja is the only performance boat in the top 10 in the 20-30 foot range.
In the 30-40 foot range, its Fountain, then Formula, then Baja, then Donzi: so the combination of the Fountain and Baja brands is impressive.
In the 40-50 range, Fountain is the only performance boat in the top 10.
Therefore, its clear that Fountain and Baja have very impressive top-of-mind awareness in the boat buying public. When people want to buy a performance boat, they think a lot about buying a Fountain and/or Baja.
That is a very good indicator of latent demand. Sure, the market is a disaster right now. But the market will come back -- we are not about to stop boating, or dreaming about boats, or wanting to buy boats.
Its just that face it: boats are not a necessity, so we all stop buying and spending on boats when things looks dicey -- and the economy is a disaster right now. It will take awhile to get things stabilized to the point that people will feel good about spending tens and hundreds of thousands of dollars on something they can easily put off for a year or three.
as reported on Sounding's Trade Only
(http://www.tradeonlytoday.com/index....hives/445322):
Top powerboats searched when length 20-30 ft.
1. Joker 33,348 6. Grady-White 8,396
2. Bayliner 12,702 7. Chaparral 7,932
3. Baja 10,578 8. Ranger 7,604
4. Crownline 8,920 9. Cobalt 6,703
5. Wellcraft 8,481 10. Mako 6,660
Top powerboats searched when length 30-40 ft.
1. Sea Ray 11,998 6. Bayliner 2,118
2. Fountain 4,000 7. Baja 1,923
3. Formula 3,175 8. Contender 1,892
4. Carver 2,539 9. Silverton 1,774
5. Wellcraft 2,427 10. Donzi 1,431
Top powerboats searched when length 40-50 ft.
1. Sea Ray 3,258 6. Formula 408
2. Carver 627 7. Silverton 343
3. Chris-Craft 477 8. Gibson 328
4. Fountain 456 9. Hatteras 325
5. Viking 414 10. Mainship 301
Note that Baja is the only performance boat in the top 10 in the 20-30 foot range.
In the 30-40 foot range, its Fountain, then Formula, then Baja, then Donzi: so the combination of the Fountain and Baja brands is impressive.
In the 40-50 range, Fountain is the only performance boat in the top 10.
Therefore, its clear that Fountain and Baja have very impressive top-of-mind awareness in the boat buying public. When people want to buy a performance boat, they think a lot about buying a Fountain and/or Baja.
That is a very good indicator of latent demand. Sure, the market is a disaster right now. But the market will come back -- we are not about to stop boating, or dreaming about boats, or wanting to buy boats.
Its just that face it: boats are not a necessity, so we all stop buying and spending on boats when things looks dicey -- and the economy is a disaster right now. It will take awhile to get things stabilized to the point that people will feel good about spending tens and hundreds of thousands of dollars on something they can easily put off for a year or three.
12-13-2008 | 11:01 AM
#37
Registered
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
We do not make anymore jet boats unfortunately. We actually cut all of our old molds up about 2 years ago. In todays market place materials and hardware are just too darn expensive and you could never justify selling a jet boat for a price that it even costs you to break even. We currently build 26', 30', 34', and 39' V-Bottoms and will be tooling a new 30' Sport Deck this coming year.
We are going to spend all of the 2009 season traveling around the country and doing a lot of pr stuff. BAsically what I am saying is that you will start seeing us at your local poker runs and boating events as most of our business and demand is on the East Coast now! We look forward to seeing all of you very soon
