Switch wiring question
#42
Not a fan of soldering. Creates a hard spot and harder to run wire when you gotta bend the wire right at the crimp. Use a quality ratcheting crimper and good crimps and it'll never be an issue. theres a reason why you don't see wires soldered on boats. But to each their own. One of those debatable subjects.
__________________
Some people are like Slinkies - Not really good for anything, but they
bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.
Some people are like Slinkies - Not really good for anything, but they
bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.
#44
Registered
Thread Starter
For ring size look at the new breakers you ordered, when I get home at the end of the week I can tell you what stock was. I think #8 ring on 10-12 awg.
You at the very least always want to use a sealed type of crimp. I use ones that are crimped and soldered. When you heat them up they seal and solder. Fastnel has them but are expensive.
One last thing, you may want to check those switches also, you wouldn't believe how much better new ones work and my boat is a 2000.
You at the very least always want to use a sealed type of crimp. I use ones that are crimped and soldered. When you heat them up they seal and solder. Fastnel has them but are expensive.
One last thing, you may want to check those switches also, you wouldn't believe how much better new ones work and my boat is a 2000.
Not a fan of soldering. Creates a hard spot and harder to run wire when you gotta bend the wire right at the crimp. Use a quality ratcheting crimper and good crimps and it'll never be an issue. theres a reason why you don't see wires soldered on boats. But to each their own. One of those debatable subjects.
Anyone have any recommendations for ratcheting crimpers? I just have regular nice Snap-on ones...
#45
Registered
My old switches had 1/2 volt or more drop across them when on. The new ones less then zero point 2 volt drop. Yes they can work but not well.
What US1 is talking about is soldering not sealing. He means if you solder by hand the solder can wick up into the wire making it stiff and prone to breaking. You have to be good and either just solder the end under the crimp or the connectors I use have a small solder bulb at the end. Leaves the wire free to bend.
Like jerry said its debateable but you do want to seal it with a sealed connector or a good SEALING type heat shrink. Not the cheap unsealed type.
What US1 is talking about is soldering not sealing. He means if you solder by hand the solder can wick up into the wire making it stiff and prone to breaking. You have to be good and either just solder the end under the crimp or the connectors I use have a small solder bulb at the end. Leaves the wire free to bend.
Like jerry said its debateable but you do want to seal it with a sealed connector or a good SEALING type heat shrink. Not the cheap unsealed type.
#46
Registered
iTrader: (1)
Not a fan of soldering. Creates a hard spot and harder to run wire when you gotta bend the wire right at the crimp. Use a quality ratcheting crimper and good crimps and it'll never be an issue. theres a reason why you don't see wires soldered on boats. But to each their own. One of those debatable subjects.
I don't recall seeing any soldered harnesses on any vehicles I've worked on or been around. Cars/trucks, quads/bikes, big diesels, turbines...all crimped.
Often referred to as adhesive lined, if you're shopping for it.
#47
Registered
Thread Starter
My old switches had 1/2 volt or more drop across them when on. The new ones less then zero point 2 volt drop. Yes they can work but not well.
What US1 is talking about is soldering not sealing. He means if you solder by hand the solder can wick up into the wire making it stiff and prone to breaking. You have to be good and either just solder the end under the crimp or the connectors I use have a small solder bulb at the end. Leaves the wire free to bend.
Like jerry said its debateable but you do want to seal it with a sealed connector or a good SEALING type heat shrink. Not the cheap unsealed type.
What US1 is talking about is soldering not sealing. He means if you solder by hand the solder can wick up into the wire making it stiff and prone to breaking. You have to be good and either just solder the end under the crimp or the connectors I use have a small solder bulb at the end. Leaves the wire free to bend.
Like jerry said its debateable but you do want to seal it with a sealed connector or a good SEALING type heat shrink. Not the cheap unsealed type.
#48
Should we take this 1 step further?
Of all those crimped ends, none of those look to have failed. Non heat shrink, non tinned wire, crimped only, no solder. Anyone new here would have thought you must use tinned wire and shrink seal the ends and solder or the world will end. With that said, I always use tinned wire and heat shrink because 1) there is no downside to it from what I know of, 2) the cost isn't that much more to error on the safe side to not to. The key is to do it right, with the right equipment, (hammers, vice grips, and pliers do not fit this description ) and support the wires so there is no tugging on the ends when wave jumping. As Wldman_graphix stated, if you are going to solder, there is a correct way which he mentioned.
What I see in the pics posted here are point of attachment failures. Loose screws allowing high resistance leading to the the issues, or screws that have been compromised.
If I had to make a guess ,I'd say do to amount of heavy wiring involved in that small area, getting the wires routed to bundle them together, I can see the wires being attached to the breakers, then the wires all tugged until they are orientated to the required position, and in the process the screw gets loosened a bit. Very common.
In the end, you'll still get the suggestions that they just wire nut or twisted the ends and tape and have had no problems. Thus the debateable subject.
That should cover wiring 101. lol
Of all those crimped ends, none of those look to have failed. Non heat shrink, non tinned wire, crimped only, no solder. Anyone new here would have thought you must use tinned wire and shrink seal the ends and solder or the world will end. With that said, I always use tinned wire and heat shrink because 1) there is no downside to it from what I know of, 2) the cost isn't that much more to error on the safe side to not to. The key is to do it right, with the right equipment, (hammers, vice grips, and pliers do not fit this description ) and support the wires so there is no tugging on the ends when wave jumping. As Wldman_graphix stated, if you are going to solder, there is a correct way which he mentioned.
What I see in the pics posted here are point of attachment failures. Loose screws allowing high resistance leading to the the issues, or screws that have been compromised.
If I had to make a guess ,I'd say do to amount of heavy wiring involved in that small area, getting the wires routed to bundle them together, I can see the wires being attached to the breakers, then the wires all tugged until they are orientated to the required position, and in the process the screw gets loosened a bit. Very common.
In the end, you'll still get the suggestions that they just wire nut or twisted the ends and tape and have had no problems. Thus the debateable subject.
That should cover wiring 101. lol
__________________
Some people are like Slinkies - Not really good for anything, but they
bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.
Some people are like Slinkies - Not really good for anything, but they
bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.
Last edited by US1 Fountain; 01-15-2015 at 09:06 PM. Reason: links deleted.
#49
Registered
Thread Starter
^ US-1 that was spot on! I think you are 100% correct on your forensic analysis. I'm glad this problem irritated me enough to find the cause which could have turned into a safety issue. When I started this thread I was planning to gather all the info and actually make the repairs in the spring. All of the responses I received got me motivated to get off my a$@ and go out in the cold and tear into it. Thank you all for taking the time to write out responses for me and future newbs like me to reference! Information like this is so helpful to us that may have tons of experience in other fields but are new to this sport. Although they can be found, threads with helpful solutions to your particular issue are sometimes hard to find and can leave you more confused than before due to the lack of detail in the responses. I may sound like a broken record with some of my questions but I truly would like to thank everyone who has responded to this thread you have all been very helpful!
#50
Registered
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 1,053
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hey, that's why we're all here......to help each other right??
Glad to see you found the problem. I think you'll have plenty more years of worry free boating from this day forward. Plus, there's nothing better than saying....Yeah I fixed it!!
Glad to see you found the problem. I think you'll have plenty more years of worry free boating from this day forward. Plus, there's nothing better than saying....Yeah I fixed it!!