454 initial timing questons
#61
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Joined: Jan 2007
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From: Murrayville Georgia
no, the original motor was built for cruisers, it has now been rebuilt, decked, heads surfaced, higher compression pistons, different cam and who knows what else that all means it is no longer the motor that was built for cruisers. that is what everyone is trying to help you with. iron heads you are pushing the limit at a little over 9 to 1 compression and that is with premium fuel which you dont have. if it has the net zero rocker bolts then there is a chance the lifters are bottomed out. lots of factors going on here that can be fixed but you need to find someone that really knows boat motors and listen to the advice on here.
#62
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Funny you should say this.
Air- you have a vacuum leak and mismatched head port styles. Fuel = yours is old and low Octane. Spark = -10 degrees
Engines do not know what type of boat/vehicle it is going to be installed into, BUT, they do know what operating parameters/they perform well/reliably in.
The boat dictated the type of build the engine requires. That is why they make so many cam variations, head runner length, intake manifold designs, carb variations, exhaust manifold styles, etc. etc. etc.
Not being sarcastic just trying to get you to take a objective view of the situation. Some of the most knowledgeable engine builders on the forum are trying to help you.
My suggestion is find a new mechanic so far seems like yours is not making good decisions on your behalf.
Just my .02
Good Luck.
Air- you have a vacuum leak and mismatched head port styles. Fuel = yours is old and low Octane. Spark = -10 degrees
Engines do not know what type of boat/vehicle it is going to be installed into, BUT, they do know what operating parameters/they perform well/reliably in.
The boat dictated the type of build the engine requires. That is why they make so many cam variations, head runner length, intake manifold designs, carb variations, exhaust manifold styles, etc. etc. etc.
Not being sarcastic just trying to get you to take a objective view of the situation. Some of the most knowledgeable engine builders on the forum are trying to help you.
My suggestion is find a new mechanic so far seems like yours is not making good decisions on your behalf.
Just my .02
Good Luck.
My mechanic is fine. He's honest and that's the most important thing . Already got burned once by dishonest guy that sold me the motor and first mechanic that put it in The boat. I am constantly throwing more and more at my mechanic and he is taking it on and knocking it out.
We are definitely going to revisit vaccum leak and triple check for them. It does seems.to be something of the sort. Good news is nothing seems to be physically broken. We will double check compression as a next step as well
#63
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no, the original motor was built for cruisers, it has now been rebuilt, decked, heads surfaced, higher compression pistons, different cam and who knows what else that all means it is no longer the motor that was built for cruisers. that is what everyone is trying to help you with. iron heads you are pushing the limit at a little over 9 to 1 compression and that is with premium fuel which you dont have. if it has the net zero rocker bolts then there is a chance the lifters are bottomed out. lots of factors going on here that can be fixed but you need to find someone that really knows boat motors and listen to the advice on here.
So for example when you say "lifters could be bottoming out" that's an actual useful idea of something for us to check into. Inserting your opinion that you think it shouldn't be built the way it was built is useless at this point. Motor is done.
I'm trying to leave this all to the professionals but .y mechanic is busy as is the Engine rebuilder and I'm just trying to assist in giving additional ideas on what to be looking for
Last edited by CPFITNESS; 02-24-2022 at 05:31 AM.
#64
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Joined: Nov 2004
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From: On A Dirt Floor
i can see why you took that tough.
My bad.
”Give your motor what it wants. Are tou listening ?” - D Morgan
#65
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 634
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From: Indiana
Summers coming-good luck.
#66
You are close but not quite. The motor didn't overheat when it blew up first time. It just lost compression in one hole and upon tear down we determined it was from rust in that cylinder meaning it had taken in water and sat for quite awhile because there was a serious amount of rust "this didn't happen overnight" were the words of the engine rebuilders.
Big blocks are built like this all the time, I'm not sure why so many think it's some radical build???
Big blocks are built like this all the time, I'm not sure why so many think it's some radical build???
#67
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If your intake gasket is leaking on the bottom side you can’t find it with carb cleaner. With engine idling, remove PCV valve from valve cover(if you have one) plug both breather hoses in valve covers with your thumbs or hand. With in 3-5seconds there should be pressure in crank case when moving your thumb. If it has vac instead of pressure intake is leaking on bottom side.
Summers coming-good luck.
Summers coming-good luck.
luckily I live in Tampa so it's summer year round and I have a friend with this rig instead of my ****box ! Lol.


#68
The guy that rebuilt the motor really knows boat motors. He cosigned everything I discussed with him. It is still a motor built for a cruiser because of high torque and broad torque curve. Now it simply has ability to Rev up to 5500 rpm instead of 4400. If anything the biggest no no should be stock bravo3 and not a xr.
So for example when you say "lifters could be bottoming out" that's an actual useful idea of something tomoursue and check into. Inserting your opinion that you think it shouldn't be built the way it was built is useless at this point. Motor is done.
I'm trying to leave this all to the professionals but .y mechanic is busy as is the English ne rebuilder and I'm just trying to assist in giving additional ideas on what to be looking for
So for example when you say "lifters could be bottoming out" that's an actual useful idea of something tomoursue and check into. Inserting your opinion that you think it shouldn't be built the way it was built is useless at this point. Motor is done.
I'm trying to leave this all to the professionals but .y mechanic is busy as is the English ne rebuilder and I'm just trying to assist in giving additional ideas on what to be looking for
The engine you had built will make +/- 350hp at 5000rpms and spinning it past that is a waste since the torque will completely fall off. Its only making about 20-30lbs of torque more than your stock engine. It also should not be spun past 5000rpms with the cast crank and small rods. Bravo 3's can handle 400hp+ easily.
First thing that should have been done after the overheat was a compression check and leak down.
Why should you need to give your "mechanic" and "engine builder" ideas on how to do their job? They are the professionals who do this for a living and this really is not that difficult of a problem to fix if a person knows what they are doing. Your mechanic did not seem to know how to break in a flat tappet cam. If a serious problem is found, I hope you realize that your engine builder and mechanic are going to be blaming each for whatever the problem is.
#69
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If the guy that rebuilt the engine, knew boat engines as well he represented to you, he would have NEVER used pistons that resulted in that much compression, especially for a cruiser type boat.
The engine you had built will make +/- 350hp at 5000rpms and spinning it past that is a waste since the torque will completely fall off. Its only making about 20-30lbs of torque more than your stock engine. It also should not be spun past 5000rpms with the cast crank and small rods. Bravo 3's can handle 400hp+ easily.
First thing that should have been done after the overheat was a compression check and leak down.
Why should you need to give your "mechanic" and "engine builder" ideas on how to do their job? They are the professionals who do this for a living and this really is not that difficult of a problem to fix if a person knows what they are doing. Your mechanic did not seem to know how to break in a flat tappet cam. If a serious problem is found, I hope you realize that your engine builder and mechanic are going to be blaming each for whatever the problem is.
The engine you had built will make +/- 350hp at 5000rpms and spinning it past that is a waste since the torque will completely fall off. Its only making about 20-30lbs of torque more than your stock engine. It also should not be spun past 5000rpms with the cast crank and small rods. Bravo 3's can handle 400hp+ easily.
First thing that should have been done after the overheat was a compression check and leak down.
Why should you need to give your "mechanic" and "engine builder" ideas on how to do their job? They are the professionals who do this for a living and this really is not that difficult of a problem to fix if a person knows what they are doing. Your mechanic did not seem to know how to break in a flat tappet cam. If a serious problem is found, I hope you realize that your engine builder and mechanic are going to be blaming each for whatever the problem is.
Your way off on your horsepower and torque estimates as well. This configuration will make closer to 450 HP with torque numbers north of 500. In the case of my mechanic, he's a younger guy and carburetors arent his specialty. He's open to learning and because I have the time to research things as well I'm just trying to be another source for information for him. I guess I'll cease asking questions here because the more some of you guys answer the more apparent it becomes who actually knows stuff and who doesn't. We did numerous calculations for safe piston speed and a big block with stock crank and rods is easily capable of spinning past 5000rpm but I do agree that the power and torque drips off around that point so no reason to go much higher
#70
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Joined: Apr 2014
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Bro, believe me, I'm as objectiv as **** but when you say dumb **** like "mismatched heads and intake" it tells me that you certainly don't know much about Gen V Big block Chevys. Go look at the gm truck lineup from that generation. It's a purpose built motor for high torque across a huge rpm range, if that's not exactly what a cruiser needs I don't know what is.



