RaggedEdge

Well the drive was toasted. Torn down now and all the new parts from the last deal are shot, along with the gears now being shot. Took out the brand new upper drive shaft again, as well as the brand new top cap and bearing that was replaced in the last go-round. Foreward gear and pinion gear have chunks out of them and metal is thruout the entire drive. Just love this chit!

Heat problem in my mind, set up too tight, nothing to do with the gear lube.

Velocity Vector

iTrader: (4)

Sorry to here about that Peter. Hope you get it worked out.

Mr Gadgets

Hate to hear that!! Sorry for the mess. It sounds like it wasnt put together properly..
Let me ask, was the race on the tower in the case burned up? Like the bearing in the gear was not rotating?

Hope you can work it out..

Dick

RaggedEdge

What was torn up was the pinion gear and foreward gear, the face of the teeth are pitted/chunks of metal missing on the face of every tooth of both gears, the reverse gear is fine, and the cone clutch looks perfect. On the upper driveshaft there is some metal torn out on the surface that contacts the bearing in the tower, this is about a third of the way around the surface, rest of the way around it is fine. The top cap surface where the shim/race rides is also torn up and has some metal imbeded in the machined surface. The inside surface of both drive gears where the bearing rides are darkened, I assume heat discoloration. The bearings in general look ok to the eye, I have nixed the idea of using any of them and have all new being installed.

Questions here,
Is the set up of the new swept back style XR drive different in spec than the older style XR's ?
What should I stress they be attentive to when rebuilding this drive this time around?
Am I close to right in thinking it was shimed to tight, the gear lube was very burned and stunk like chit with about 20 hours of use?

RaggedEdge

Thanks VV. Well if it can't get straightened out they make new ones every day, by the time I'm done this time around I could have just bought a new upper to start with .

Mr Gadgets

The setup on the newer drives did change a while back. I know the hump backs use this, but it was implemented on the older style XR a year or so before the humps came out.
But it is in the shimming of the depth of the pinion gear itself. They use a wire shim to set the pinion depth.
If the bearings in new gears are not washed and properly lubricated they can slide on the tower races and stick and burn up. But you would see the bearings worn flat, not just heat bluing.
The pinion and driven gear, both being pitted would indicate to me a tight lash problem. If they are too tight, they can self destruct in a short time, with the results you are describing.
Upper clutch shaft with wear on the inner tower bearing surface is getting more common (can you say China?) If it doesnt destroy the inner tower bearing, then it might not be the cause of the whole failure, but would have been a disaster when that bearing failed. I have seen the upper shaft broken and the inner tower bearings destoryed. Which came first? (Chicken or the Egg? thing)
The proper setup and lash of the gears is important. There are several ways to accomplish this, but in the end the if it is wrong, it wont last long.
A simple check for a novice would be to pull the back cap and wiggle the driven gear with the pinion stationary and see if there is some play. There should be some play in it.. It is measured with the pinion gear during setup, so numbers are not important just some play is the goal.

Hope this helps.
If you want to discuss it give me a call..
616-403-1006

RaggedEdge

Thank you! I am going up this afternoon to check on the progress. They can't finish it without the cap which I have. So I will talk with the tech, he's been at this a long time and did both drives on my last Fountain with no issues. I'm just thinking second time here might warrant a real close look at the set up to make sure it stays together this time. Appreciate the tips.

Velocity Vector

iTrader: (4)

Looks like you cought it early and salvaged alot of the drive. Keep us posted....

RaggedEdge

Well it's all good now. Just got home from the marina and it's back on and ready to run tomorow. Everything was double checked, pinion set and shimed, back lash on the gears set, pressure tested and good to go. Shims are a little different than last time around, could be new gear set or whatever, but set up seems good now. I drained the other one this afternoon and the lube was fine, no chit on the magnets either, so I guess I'm back in business.

Thanks to Mr. Gadgets for the tips! Your advice allowed me to have a conversation with the tech without any feathers being ruffled. I've known this guy for many years and really wanted to avoid that. Thanks again!

But one more question for you .......... Should this thing be "broken in", run easy for a few hours or something?

Velocity Vector

iTrader: (4)

I'm gona guess...3hr's various rpms not to exceed 4000 rpms then mash the sh!t out of it....