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Dose Anyone Know What The Speed Record For A Single Vee Bottom Is

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Old 07-13-2010, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by ziemer View Post
Check page 1 of the thread (even a bit on page 2).

There's even a video.

20' Allison, XR2002 Model, with carb 2.4 liter bridgeport rated at 245 hp from Mercury. Not sure of all engine mods however no nitrous used.

The info you posted seems to be the record that has been offical at 129 mph that is out there.....

That is fast....and its amazing with the new tech that know one has broke it....but even today...that is still crazy speed for a single vee bottom....

It puts in prespective how fast these boats are running....seeing 50' cats with twin turbines hitting 200 over the last 4 years is one thing...and yes ..fast...but seeing these smaller vees running at 130...over 25 years ago....says alot...

it seems that 150 in a single vee bottom is not and stretch....
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Old 07-13-2010, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve Zuckerman View Post
Waazzuupp Ziemer,
Hell, I feel like I'm back on S&F watching Mercury and Johnrude dudes arguing . Glad I was never in the middle of that sheet........
Actually the old head Merc Jerc (me) was there to see the run. I was there running a N20/2.4 EFI Shadow tunnel vee. My weekend went to sheet. Every time I got on the button, the prop would blow out (really fun at 100 ), the motor would hit the limiter and shut down. So I was a bust. Conversely, Darris and Glen Reynolds really had their boat dialed in. They were running a ModVP legal (no low water pickup) gearcase on 2.4 bridgeport card with 6 2s. It was old Land and Sea six pack set up. The record was was NOA/ModVP Kilo.
The weather was extraordinarily warm for October (like 80o). I am sure the boat would have run 130+ had it been in the 60s. Glen did a really nice job driving the boat. Not many people could have. Another guy ran 112 with a "stock" 2.4EFI on an Allison XB2002 to set the bass boat record that day.
Shortly thereafter I boat a XB2002 and hung a 2.4EFI on it. If you can't beat them, join them.............
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Steve.....thanks for the info.....
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Old 07-13-2010, 07:59 PM
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The info you posted seems to be the record that has been offical at 129 mph that is out there.....

That is fast....and its amazing with the new tech that know one has broke it....but even today...that is still crazy speed for a single vee bottom....

It puts in prespective how fast these boats are running....seeing 50' cats with twin turbines hitting 200 over the last 4 years is one thing...and yes ..fast...but seeing these smaller vees running at 130...over 25 years ago....says alot...

it seems that 150 in a single vee bottom is not and stretch....
After all you've heard, what size boat are you thinking about doing this in? 30 footer or smaller towards the 18-21footer?
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Old 07-13-2010, 08:19 PM
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After all you've heard, what size boat are you thinking about doing this in? 30 footer or smaller towards the 18-21footer?
I was hoping we would be able to build a boat for long distance speed runs since that will be our main goal for 2011...I was thinking we might be able to change engines and still be able to attempt to brake a single engine vee Kilo record also with the same boat...

But these little boats seem to be able to run over the 130 to 140 mark if someone wanted to...and I really don't think a single engine offshore boat will be able to do that....

I have inquired for some pricing from a couple of companys to see what we would be looking at in one of these smaller boats but with a capsule...and I will summitt it to see what they think..

On the new boat for long distance runs....we will be going with the ILMOR agian....
We will get a good idea what we will really need and how the boat will need to be built once we run the Activator in a distance run...this will not be a 100 or 200 mile run...the first one will be over 300 miles to see what we will be up against and how much power we will really need....

Last edited by MANITIE; 07-13-2010 at 08:21 PM.
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:17 AM
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I was hoping we would be able to build a boat for long distance speed runs since that will be our main goal for 2011...I was thinking we might be able to change engines and still be able to attempt to brake a single engine vee Kilo record also with the same boat...

But these little boats seem to be able to run over the 130 to 140 mark if someone wanted to...and I really don't think a single engine offshore boat will be able to do that....

I have inquired for some pricing from a couple of companys to see what we would be looking at in one of these smaller boats but with a capsule...and I will summitt it to see what they think..

On the new boat for long distance runs....we will be going with the ILMOR agian....
We will get a good idea what we will really need and how the boat will need to be built once we run the Activator in a distance run...this will not be a 100 or 200 mile run...the first one will be over 300 miles to see what we will be up against and how much power we will really need....
I have been 113 in a 27 Activator!!!That boat could handle big speeds!!I bet you could get a 27 to go 130 with the right amount of power with the new Imco on the back!
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:40 AM
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I have been 113 in a 27 Activator!!!That boat could handle big speeds!!I bet you could get a 27 to go 130 with the right amount of power with the new Imco on the back!
You better duck.....were have you been this year...

It is one of the things we were looking at...
To build a new 27 Activator but move the firewall forward about 15 inches so we could put in the ILMOR 725 and put on the Indy drive...and also put in fuel blatters that we could carrie 150 to 175 gallons for the distance speed runs....and then see what we could do with added HP for the kilo run....
But I think the 140 mark can be hit...but not in a offshore boat....

But this little 27 is in for a bruttle run coming up...as soon as we get here dailed in and the gremlins out....
She will be put to the test....
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Old 07-14-2010, 10:57 AM
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But this little 27 is in for a bruttle run coming up...as soon as we get here dailed in and the gremlins out....
She will be put to the test....
Which run is that?
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Old 07-14-2010, 11:00 AM
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I did not mention Allison in anyway yet you subcribe it to me somehow. Quit being a zealot and doing so in such a hasty manner your reading more into it than you should.
I also never said you brought it up...you are still all over the map...and much more of a (Howard) "zealot" than I am. It appears that you never heard of an Allison or a Hydrostream, or a Norris Craft, or a Speedliner, or a Switzer Shooting Star, or any of the numerous other monohulls that have posted amazing speeds in the past.

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I never said Howard is the fastest monohull or single engine v-bottom I merely indicated the builder has a stable full of very fast V-Bottoms that consistently put up big numbers for V-Bottoms.

As for generic it would be your reading comprehension rather than your feeble attempt at criticizing a boat builder about whom you know nothing at all.

.
] You pointedly did say that Howard was the fastest V bottom up until the date of some magazine test. As far as your comments regarding me knowing nothing about Howard hulls. I will gladly trace the derivative line, that Howard is a small part of, for you along the West Coast bulder history clear back to to Rudy Ramos and his Rayson Craft hulls that set the stage for most of the current California builders.


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Thus, to say that you could put tremendous HP to any V-Bottom and make it run is absolute rubbish.

Respectfully,

KAP
HP makes geniuses out of even mediocre designers and Icons out of the great ones. Excessive hp and a good setup man allows you to increase speed at lower trim settings in less aggressive attack angles wherein you "glue" a hull to the water and use raw power to increase speed. Manufacturers for years have exceeded design speed parameters using this technique. For instance, our Shadow cats were designed for a 115-120 mph maximum speed in 1979, using small block power up to 600 hp each. We really felt that the hull wpuld not be very stable over that speed. Recently, I received correspondence from a guy down south who has run his Shadow well over 160 with a pair of supercharged big blocks.

Vee bottoms have been stabilized for years using combinations of c/g changes, strake mods and bottom tuning, with proper use of trim tabs and setbacks allowing speeds well over Ray Hunt's original 60 mph design. With enough power you can "trim against the tabs" and make a vee hull rock solid at very high speeds. Since all vees have a common ancestary these techniques work to one degree or another on any hull that is constructed basically straightand true coming out of the mold.

The thought that adding HP does not increase speed capabilities, or that there is some form of speed limit by vee hull manufacturer, fails to take into account the impact that ever passing years of development, setup and prop design have on the equation.....and is, in fact, both" absolute rubbish" to use your anglophile term....and naive.

Today there are at least a dozen hull designs that could up the single engine vee record, but my bet would be on a K-Boat.

Not neccessarily respectfully,

T2x

Last edited by T2x; 07-14-2010 at 11:11 AM.
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Old 07-14-2010, 11:12 AM
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Which run is that?
Around Long Island........?
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Old 07-14-2010, 02:46 PM
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HP makes geniuses out of even mediocre designers and Icons out of the great ones. Excessive hp and a good setup man allows you to increase speed at lower trim settings in less aggressive attack angles wherein you "glue" a hull to the water and use raw power to increase speed. Manufacturers for years have exceeded design speed parameters using this technique. For instance, our Shadow cats were designed for a 115-120 mph maximum speed in 1979, using small block power up to 600 hp each. We really felt that the hull wpuld not be very stable over that speed. Recently, I received correspondence from a guy down south who has run his Shadow well over 160 with a pair of supercharged big blocks.

Vee bottoms have been stabilized for years using combinations of c/g changes, strake mods and bottom tuning, with proper use of trim tabs and setbacks allowing speeds well over Ray Hunt's original 60 mph design. With enough power you can "trim against the tabs" and make a vee hull rock solid at very high speeds. Since all vees have a common ancestary these techniques work to one degree or another on any hull that is constructed basically straightand true coming out of the mold.

The thought that adding HP does not increase speed capabilities, or that there is some form of speed limit by vee hull manufacturer, fails to take into account the impact that ever passing years of development, setup and prop design have on the equation.....and is, in fact, both" absolute rubbish" to use your anglophile term....and naive.

Today there are at least a dozen hull designs that could up the single engine vee record, but my bet would be on a K-Boat.

Not neccessarily respectfully,

T2x
Comment:

I won't comment on the early comments as they merit little discussion and are more bravado than substance. However, the latter part of your post contains some useful information.

The reference to Shadow Cats I assume is to illustrate how you can push the hull limits with proper set-up. I agree remarkable things can happen when you have an outstanding set-up but eventually you will hit a wall wherein despite the best set-up possible the increase in speed will plateau or flat line. I don't care how much HP you put to it.

If you argue this point and we follow your theory simply put a turbine engine in a V-Bottom--- chain someone in the boat [because that is the only way your gonna get someone in the boat] and let it rip down the kilo run.

Just so you don't think I am an anglophile I call bullsh_t on the second theory you espouse...let's see hmmm.... the hull is unstable but we are going to counteract that with tabs which scrub speed and trim up---Ok you go with that.

To stabilize a V-Bottom in a single engine configuration is extremely difficult and your mention of technology is correct up to a point. In the single engine V-Bottom category hitting high numbers 120MPH and above by simply adding power is not the solution [it is if you want to die].

Furthermore since you allege there are a dozen single engine V-Bottom hulls capable of topping the record books can you list them since it is so common place. As for your described band-aid for going fast i.e... "trim against the tabs" that is disaster try it video it for us so we can see how that works for you in attempting to get the best top end number in a single engine V-Bottom.

Note: In my opinon trim tabs are for pulling skiers, making turns you should not be doing [high speed] and running in rough water with a poor set-up or hull...this list is not all inclusive.

Forgive me maybe you know more than I do after 4000 posts you must be an authority herein... so... can you post up some [GPS speedo] or any photos/video of single engine V-Bottoms running 100MPH++ and the relevant data.

I am sure you are a very knowledgeable person I suspect more in the outboard arena given all the manufacturers you listed. Yet with several posts into this discussion you have not put up one exemplar on this subject when in fact as you allude there are hulls aplenty.

In conclusion, I find online bickering lacks substance however in certain instances some amount of jousting is necessary to establish an online order of sorts.

Respectfully,

KAP

Last edited by kap328; 07-14-2010 at 02:49 PM. Reason: Added content...video
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