Crash at DS.
#222
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 586
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From: Rochester, NY
skater40 did an excellent job of holding his line and actually dropping out of the frame as things unfolded. I am sure he watched the first dcb take off and begin drifting left and knew there was not enough room left for the rest of the boats over there.
I commend skater40 for not 'going with' that first dcb just to stay with him. He knew the time and place was not right. We all know he has the hp to be there, and by giving other boats plenty of room he prevented this from becoming a multiple boat incident.
#223
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 390
Likes: 0
From: Perry Lake, KS Lake of Ozarks
No speed has been mentioned and that is ok by me. They were hauling but as first hand account in #216 indicates, the closeness in which they are bunched and the fact the photo choppers are still hanging around at low altitude suggest, they were not pushing 100%.
At 2:39 in the DCB-desert-storm-2013 video (crash at the end sequence) You can hear the motors change as the silver cat to the right (underneath the chopper) pushes the sticks and pulls out in front. Following that, it appears it drifts to the left of what one might say was "holding its line"
At the same time the silver DCB 35 and black cat to the left are moving right to avoid upstream traffic AND spectator boats sticking out.
From my vantage point of the two videos out, having attended DS in the past and other poker runs; my keyboard analysis of contributing factors that SUMMED into an accident -
1) Silver cat accelerating and cutting the corner apex slightly
2) DCB35 while recognizing the spectator and oncoming hazards, did not slow sufficiently to compensate for the turbid water and air passing so close behind the silver cat and the drifting line created by changing course due to the hazards.
3) Poor viewing position anchoring choice by several spectator boats. They were anchored too far from shore, at the apex of a river bend
4) boat traveling upstream near center channel, assumingly to avoid passing too close to the poorly anchored spectator boats. While this boat was running fast enough and became aware of the approaching flight to duck tighter to shore, the approaching flight would not have been able to read his mind.
I really enjoyed DS 2009 when I was there but did think there could have been more volunteer safety boats both for the poker run and speed runs.
There is no warning I know of alerting boaters before the flights come roaring by. My suggestion would be to have a few patrol boats head down the course in the hour before the start to encourage people to move in sufficient time they can reset safely and not feel burdened they only have minutes to move and might miss the viewing. Have them conspicuously marked as safety boats which will also elevate the attention of general boaters. Finally with 10-15 minutes left, have several boats stationed along the route pop smoke, turn on temporary flashing lights, etc and drive 3-5 miles. This final signaling could be molded as "ceremony" but should also act as a warning of the high speed boats soon approaching for those with their head in the desert sand. Throw some free gas to the patrol boats if there is trouble getting volunteers.
2009 was before the current Shootout location change but No Wake was not enforced in a large enough buffer or though out the length of the course which created rough water for both speed and spectator participants. There were a few patrol boats with signage but it looked more like an afterthought and finger wag than anything to be taken seriously. I also felt like there was an overall "west coast, I'm here to do my thing, fu vibe" by many as they passed by.
LOTO's Shootout is very obvious with many bannered patrol boats backed by Water Patrol that you are crossing into a No Wake zone and you better not push it.
I enjoyed the event. Lots of fun and fast boats which CAN continue but a little more active course management could increase safety of both spectators and participants.
At 2:39 in the DCB-desert-storm-2013 video (crash at the end sequence) You can hear the motors change as the silver cat to the right (underneath the chopper) pushes the sticks and pulls out in front. Following that, it appears it drifts to the left of what one might say was "holding its line"
At the same time the silver DCB 35 and black cat to the left are moving right to avoid upstream traffic AND spectator boats sticking out.
From my vantage point of the two videos out, having attended DS in the past and other poker runs; my keyboard analysis of contributing factors that SUMMED into an accident -
1) Silver cat accelerating and cutting the corner apex slightly
2) DCB35 while recognizing the spectator and oncoming hazards, did not slow sufficiently to compensate for the turbid water and air passing so close behind the silver cat and the drifting line created by changing course due to the hazards.
3) Poor viewing position anchoring choice by several spectator boats. They were anchored too far from shore, at the apex of a river bend
4) boat traveling upstream near center channel, assumingly to avoid passing too close to the poorly anchored spectator boats. While this boat was running fast enough and became aware of the approaching flight to duck tighter to shore, the approaching flight would not have been able to read his mind.
I really enjoyed DS 2009 when I was there but did think there could have been more volunteer safety boats both for the poker run and speed runs.
There is no warning I know of alerting boaters before the flights come roaring by. My suggestion would be to have a few patrol boats head down the course in the hour before the start to encourage people to move in sufficient time they can reset safely and not feel burdened they only have minutes to move and might miss the viewing. Have them conspicuously marked as safety boats which will also elevate the attention of general boaters. Finally with 10-15 minutes left, have several boats stationed along the route pop smoke, turn on temporary flashing lights, etc and drive 3-5 miles. This final signaling could be molded as "ceremony" but should also act as a warning of the high speed boats soon approaching for those with their head in the desert sand. Throw some free gas to the patrol boats if there is trouble getting volunteers.
2009 was before the current Shootout location change but No Wake was not enforced in a large enough buffer or though out the length of the course which created rough water for both speed and spectator participants. There were a few patrol boats with signage but it looked more like an afterthought and finger wag than anything to be taken seriously. I also felt like there was an overall "west coast, I'm here to do my thing, fu vibe" by many as they passed by.
LOTO's Shootout is very obvious with many bannered patrol boats backed by Water Patrol that you are crossing into a No Wake zone and you better not push it.
I enjoyed the event. Lots of fun and fast boats which CAN continue but a little more active course management could increase safety of both spectators and participants.
Last edited by ChargeIt; 04-30-2013 at 03:04 PM.
#224
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,054
Likes: 12
From: Pompano Beach, FL
I agree with Glass Dave, trying to turn left, crossing wake at angle, left sponson comes up, inward prop rotation equals bad situation. I believe the prop rotation had a factor in the rollover. As far as all cats turning in I don't and never will. There are many boats turnig props out. Ck Pure Platinum. Dave is spot on.
Glad no one seriously hurt. On another note I think each boat in a poker run should be given smoke flares that they can use to alert on coming boats in case of an accident like a caution flag in racing.
Glad no one seriously hurt. On another note I think each boat in a poker run should be given smoke flares that they can use to alert on coming boats in case of an accident like a caution flag in racing.
#225
VIP Member

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 930
Likes: 1
From: Tucson,Az.
I couldnt believe what i was seeing when the M41 jumped the start before pilot rock instead of what was discussed in the drivers meeting.Bob Teaque made it very clear that everybody was to hold there line with no jockeying for position and that once ALL boats made the left turn at pilot rock and were lined up with open water -then they could go.
After the M41 left,the M35 and the 32 DCB to my left took off.My first thoughts when i saw the M35 leave was that his nose was to high,then he cut over right thru the M41 wake which didnt end so well.The 32 DCB was running next to him and when the M35 lost it- the 32 cut right in front of me hosing me down bad.I let off the throttles and turned right as i couldnt see a thing.The hose down shut my port motor down which by that time i came to a complete stop and restarted it.By that time i saw the 2 from the M35 floating and they appeared to be okay as other boats reached out to them.I then got up on plane and as i accelerated i heard a backfire from the port motor.I was unable to go over 140 to the first card stop and on the way back up the lake the MSD finally gave out.My bilge had 4 inches of water from front to back from the hosing down and the MSD didnt last long after that.
Sad day that shouldnt have happened.We will see what action the promotor takes as this kind of behavior has gone on way to long.They need to make a example out of the people involved and every one is watching and waiting.
After the M41 left,the M35 and the 32 DCB to my left took off.My first thoughts when i saw the M35 leave was that his nose was to high,then he cut over right thru the M41 wake which didnt end so well.The 32 DCB was running next to him and when the M35 lost it- the 32 cut right in front of me hosing me down bad.I let off the throttles and turned right as i couldnt see a thing.The hose down shut my port motor down which by that time i came to a complete stop and restarted it.By that time i saw the 2 from the M35 floating and they appeared to be okay as other boats reached out to them.I then got up on plane and as i accelerated i heard a backfire from the port motor.I was unable to go over 140 to the first card stop and on the way back up the lake the MSD finally gave out.My bilge had 4 inches of water from front to back from the hosing down and the MSD didnt last long after that.
Sad day that shouldnt have happened.We will see what action the promotor takes as this kind of behavior has gone on way to long.They need to make a example out of the people involved and every one is watching and waiting.
#226
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,008
Likes: 752
From: Traverse City, Michigan
I couldnt believe what i was seeing when the M41 jumped the start before pilot rock instead of what was discussed in the drivers meeting.Bob Teaque made it very clear that everybody was to hold there line with no jockeying for position and that once ALL boats made the left turn at pilot rock and were lined up with open water -then they could go.
After the M41 left,the M35 and the 32 DCB to my left took off.My first thoughts when i saw the M35 leave was that his nose was to high,then he cut over right thru the M41 wake which didnt end so well.The 32 DCB was running next to him and when the M35 lost it- the 32 cut right in front of me hosing me down bad.I let off the throttles and turned right as i couldnt see a thing.The hose down shut my port motor down which by that time i came to a complete stop and restarted it.By that time i saw the 2 from the M35 floating and they appeared to be okay as other boats reached out to them.I then got up on plane and as i accelerated i heard a backfire from the port motor.I was unable to go over 140 to the first card stop and on the way back up the lake the MSD finally gave out.My bilge had 4 inches of water from front to back from the hosing down and the MSD didnt last long after that.
Sad day that shouldnt have happened.We will see what action the promotor takes as this kind of behavior has gone on way to long.They need to make a example out of the people involved and every one is watching and waiting.
After the M41 left,the M35 and the 32 DCB to my left took off.My first thoughts when i saw the M35 leave was that his nose was to high,then he cut over right thru the M41 wake which didnt end so well.The 32 DCB was running next to him and when the M35 lost it- the 32 cut right in front of me hosing me down bad.I let off the throttles and turned right as i couldnt see a thing.The hose down shut my port motor down which by that time i came to a complete stop and restarted it.By that time i saw the 2 from the M35 floating and they appeared to be okay as other boats reached out to them.I then got up on plane and as i accelerated i heard a backfire from the port motor.I was unable to go over 140 to the first card stop and on the way back up the lake the MSD finally gave out.My bilge had 4 inches of water from front to back from the hosing down and the MSD didnt last long after that.
Sad day that shouldnt have happened.We will see what action the promotor takes as this kind of behavior has gone on way to long.They need to make a example out of the people involved and every one is watching and waiting.
ed
#227
Registered
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: California
We went by shortly after it happened and no helicopters tried to help due to not being set up for rescue just pictures and there was rescue boats there and I was told later that they were there fast was also told that they were ok just banged up. Someone said they got pinched in the turn and had to cross the wake and got air under them and that is what it looks like in the video.All of this came from just talk at the card turn in so we know how accurate that can be. That section was rough and it seemed like we were not spread out like other years and we were all running together and it was a washing machine out there just nasty water, I don't think we were bunched up for any other reason than we just stayed together to the first card stop. I have no idea what the skill level was and have no opinion due to that but we just don't need any more of these accidents at poker runs. This year we did not run as hard and gave way when other boats came thru and had just as much fun as any other year but I will admit that my first poker runs were looked at as a chance to race boats without being a racer and that is not the right way to look at them,we are not racers and we are not in raceboats.
#228
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,057
Likes: 0
I couldnt believe what i was seeing when the M41 jumped the start before pilot rock instead of what was discussed in the drivers meeting.Bob Teaque made it very clear that everybody was to hold there line with no jockeying for position and that once ALL boats made the left turn at pilot rock and were lined up with open water -then they could go.
After the M41 left,the M35 and the 32 DCB to my left took off.My first thoughts when i saw the M35 leave was that his nose was to high,then he cut over right thru the M41 wake which didnt end so well.The 32 DCB was running next to him and when the M35 lost it- the 32 cut right in front of me hosing me down bad.I let off the throttles and turned right as i couldnt see a thing.The hose down shut my port motor down which by that time i came to a complete stop and restarted it.By that time i saw the 2 from the M35 floating and they appeared to be okay as other boats reached out to them.I then got up on plane and as i accelerated i heard a backfire from the port motor.I was unable to go over 140 to the first card stop and on the way back up the lake the MSD finally gave out.My bilge had 4 inches of water from front to back from the hosing down and the MSD didnt last long after that.
Sad day that shouldnt have happened.We will see what action the promotor takes as this kind of behavior has gone on way to long.They need to make a example out of the people involved and every one is watching and waiting.
After the M41 left,the M35 and the 32 DCB to my left took off.My first thoughts when i saw the M35 leave was that his nose was to high,then he cut over right thru the M41 wake which didnt end so well.The 32 DCB was running next to him and when the M35 lost it- the 32 cut right in front of me hosing me down bad.I let off the throttles and turned right as i couldnt see a thing.The hose down shut my port motor down which by that time i came to a complete stop and restarted it.By that time i saw the 2 from the M35 floating and they appeared to be okay as other boats reached out to them.I then got up on plane and as i accelerated i heard a backfire from the port motor.I was unable to go over 140 to the first card stop and on the way back up the lake the MSD finally gave out.My bilge had 4 inches of water from front to back from the hosing down and the MSD didnt last long after that.
Sad day that shouldnt have happened.We will see what action the promotor takes as this kind of behavior has gone on way to long.They need to make a example out of the people involved and every one is watching and waiting.
#229
Registered

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 406
Likes: 1
From: South Jersey
No thanks!
So your saying someone doesnt care about flipping over going 160+ because he has insurance? Get real!
Makes no sense. It was an ACCIDENT. Let it go . Glad everyones OK, thats all that really matters. Thats the risk of going 160 plus. They're taking the risk not you.
So your saying someone doesnt care about flipping over going 160+ because he has insurance? Get real!

Makes no sense. It was an ACCIDENT. Let it go . Glad everyones OK, thats all that really matters. Thats the risk of going 160 plus. They're taking the risk not you.
#230
skater40 I would had been pissed if they dossed my boat that bad.but at our lake several years ago, we were anchored out watching when a Daytona with twin turbines went within 20 feet of our boat trying to spray us I guess, we watched him turn towards us didn't know to jump in the water and swim to the bottom or what, sadly a few years later he and his family lost there life in a terrible crash at the same lake. not saying anything but during takeoff, when the flag drops so does most everybodys attention, they tend to keep looking ahead even when theyre drifting over in frt of other drivers who are coming up hard from the rear , not even knowing they cut people off or sprayed the heck out of them.
Last edited by johnnyboatman; 04-30-2013 at 11:17 PM.


