We can talk all we want, bottom line is you can't run 150 on open waterways. NJPPC runs are paced intill the fast group is out in the ocean. The NY runs I have done are paced untill well out into lake Erie. This lake Cumberland does not look that big. There is now way that every boater on the lake knows what is going on, and like what was said before at 150 you come up real fast. May they rest in peace. I mean no disrespect.

I dont understand why anyone wouldn't discuss it? It was a tragic accident, however so is someone dying on the way to work in the morning - and no one would be saying - hey bud, thats inappropriate to talk about. Actually this is slightly LESS tragic the person dying on their way to work, because they likely werent going 150 mph on a public road.
I personally feel this is a turning point for the sport. I believe soon or even right now, insurance companies will have their actuaries working on risk formulas for special poker run policy riders - btw, you better believe its going to be expensive.

I am afraid you may be right, we should have had this conversation years ago....oh wait we did.

i understand and respect your thought but if through these discussions,if an idea ends up preventing such a horific accident from occuring again,it was a productive discussion.it appears many oso members feel this way.

well if history and facts hold true I'll be here reading and watching videos of guys wrecking million dollar boats on public water ways until theres no more PR runs or we get rules or regulations that would effect all boaters. you guys really think that local, state and fed (coast guard) law enforcement are going to keep letting this idiotic behavior keep happening.

plus add in todays world of camera phones and internet and its instant bad press. they had this incident on 6oclock news last night down here in FL.

My comments are in NO way a Reflection of the two killed this weekend on Lake Cumberland. I haven't participated in a poker run in over 10 years...I've run them ALL over the country, from Lake Erie and Lake Huron, to The Gulf of Mexico, New York City and LOTO to the west coast Delta and many in between. I quit for many reasons, my last being on Lake Michigan...I just do not trust the participants and value my life too much. There are too many unqualified drivers with big egos and too much money along with a thousand uncontrolled variables...odds will catch up to you in that scenario.

Public waterways outside of closed courses don't have any place for boats traveling in large organized groups at speeds approaching 150...it's a recipe for disaster. I ran LOTO once and was very impressed with the overall event and the strict, well enforced rules and a pace boat that controlled speed. Ego and speed are a dangerous combination...rules are broken and some events luckily end accident free....while others end with our hearts crushed and stomachs in a wrench.

It's never enough or consoling to say someone died doing what they loved...because if they could see into the future, they would all choose to stay home with their families that weekend. I don't see any changes looking like they're going to take place...loss of life is too easily forgotten unless its someone in your own family or a close friend....then it's business as usual on the water and event organizers are looking for their next dollar. Don't get me wrong, event organizers don't want to see anyone hurt or killed, but they're often not interested in enforcing rules that would cut their fleets in half or less.

E only thing that's going to change anything is personal responsibility...understanding the consequences which we all seem to think will never happen to us...or the other guy...after all, we're all out to have a good time. Well, I'm here to tell you...it does happen to us....to our friends...the our online community...to our boating family. S all I can really say is slow down, use common sense...understand what you have to lose and be very aware of your surroundings. You can't expect things to run just as you plan on a public waterway that you're sharing with a thousand other boats while you're running 100+mph...that just doesn't make sense.

I hope the boating community wakes up...if you want to run that fast in a group...take up offshore racing, you'll enjoy a closed course, required proper safety gear, mandatory drivers meetings and a team of professionals just a moments notice away.

My thoughts and prayers are with everyone who has ever been effected by an accident like this...in a poker run...or just on the water.

Joey, see your from Cape Coral, so you've probably ran with my friends down that way. One of these guys owned Loose Cannon, pictured on the top of this site. When I ask him last week if he was coming up to Cumberland, he informed me he sold the boat and was done with the sport.. That struck me a strange because he was all about poker runs, and that boat was fast, scary fast, 170 in a 32' cat. However he and everyone onboard walked away from a 120mph spin during a poker run a few years back. At the time he blew it off to me as no big deal, I knew better from reports of those who witnessed it. Point is, he was always that first guy at the card stop, maybe he just realized how lucky they actually were when that motor seized up. Who knows. Bragging rights are cool, long as your around to use em.

I've watched both videos so far of this crash frame by frame, along with the DCB flip at Desert Storm. Identical situations, identical results, but terribly different outcomes for those onboard this one. IMO, catching a big roost in the tunnel compressed the air, upset the boats balance, resulting in excessive bow lift. Ain't gotta be an engineer to see that in either incident. But people do need to look closely at these videos to understand how tight they both were to the boats in front when attempting to change lines. As much as I'd like to disagree, both situations are as reported, driver error. People gotta understand when to back out of it, that first card ain't worth any more than the last one.

I've often laughed at the big US poker run association rule #1 "boat to boat racing is strictly prohibited", but I sure won't any more. As many on here, I also cruised up along side Jeff's boat under tow with half the transom gone and the remains of a sheered off jagged windscreen. Not something I'll soon forget. Changing the poker run format is not the answer, changing participants attitudes is. As I listed in the other topic, this is a basically a unregulated sport which doesn't require a canopy to run 150+ on a "open to the public" course. Yes I'm all for it, but I also realized this one was best viewed from the sideline.

One rule that should be strictly enforced going forward.. Maintain 100' from all other participant boats while under way. I'd also like to see scout boats running ahead of the group, and mandatory radio comm's onboard. Simple little changes could make a huge difference, then let em fly fast as ya want.

-K

news travels fast,be it good or bad,not discussing it will not make it go away,at least on this open forum,the people discussing it have heavy hearts for those involved and there familys,do you think the people who see it on the 6 o clock news feel as we do-?

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This is from this years buffalo poker run, I do not have a 150 mph boat, but I will run what I have as hard as I safely can, every piece of saftey equipment you have on increases your chances of survival. You would also be suprised how much better you can see with out the wind slamming into your eyes. Like I said before I mean no disrespect, but we have to make changes, or its over.

Anyone posting on any of these threads needs to take the time to watch this.

Accidents happen. Conditions got better. Do I believe the cruiser in the second video was in the wrong place, yes. The only action for this lake is to impose a no wake for all non-participants. Period.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL0GrnnNwhE