Step Bottom History
 

Just noticed that Seaplanes used step bottoms during WWII. Not sure how much further back this went, but tought it was kinda neat.

thought it started with hustler am i right?

Stepped hulls are way old.....never publicised until ten years ago...check out old sailboats, old sea planes, etc. It was just old Reggie that made a big deal out of it!!!!

DMan

Talkin' Seaplanes from the 1940's


http://www.daveswarbirds.com/usplanes/american.htm
left side scroll to seaplanes

reallllllllly old
 

I'll check in an old hardcover book called Speedboats but I remember seeing some old wooden racers with steps. Keep watching for updates. :cool: :cool: :cool:

When was that Flying wing that Tx2 has made? I seem to recal that having a wing on it.

Jon

the story
 

The originator was said to be Rev. C M Ramus of Plyden Rectory, Rye, Sussex, England. " On April 8 1872, CM Ramus wrote the Commissioners of the Admiralty that he had discovered a means by which the speed of ships might be doubled" thereafter he published the " Improved section drawing of a Stepped Hull on July 5 1872. More to come!

first US PATENT
 

William Henry Fauber 1908, boat name was Pioneer. 20 feet & 7 steps. From the book SPEEDBOAT author D.W. Fostle copyright 1988.

Buckknekkid

That’s right! The story I read the good reverend used a Skyrocket for power on his test model!

Maybe it was reverend Reggie Though??He looks at least 130 years old.
:D

The History Channel did a 4 show
Special a few years ago about the
History of Speed, On Water,On land, In AIR and By Humans.
I was involved when they filmed
Nigel Hook and the Citgo Boat.
The producer talked about filming
in Washington State and that he
had Seen photos of one of the
first Race boats ever to use A Step Bottom as I remember its was
in the very early 1900s.
I posted this on another forum and asked if anyone had any info,
I hope this forum will have more
Information.
Mike J.

steve . . didnt you post some old US patent stuff on step hull a while ago . . . :cool:

Sure did Dave

Here is a Stepped Ship.

and another

Steve1
 

Im sure someone in Blountstown will claim the honors

hey buckknekkid, what is that in your avitar . it looks kinda cool . . just wondering

:cool:

Our, (Darren's) stepped bottom Wing Switzer was designed in 1959. The first time we put steps on a vee bottom was in 1981, when we put them on a Shadow 21. The boat went no faster but lost handling in turns........The same applies today. It's all about sizzle over steak.....and "business plans"...... Let the buyer beware.


T2x

so . . t2x . .i take it you are not a big fan of steps. . . . how do you get upstairs in yer house . . :confused: :D :D :D

I think the very early Chris-Crafts, Garwoods, etc. had a step in the bottom to get the bow out of the water. And that was back in the 1920's or so.

Gar Wood and others put steps on there boats in the 20's. All the Miss America race boats they ran in the Gold Cup had steps. The miss America X was powered by 4 1800 HP 12 Cylinder Packard engines it ran 124.915 MPH. Miss America IX was the first boat to run over 100 MPH it ran 102.256 in 1931

Dancing Bear (22') ran 94.6 MPH with a 400 HP Chrysler engine it has a step hull.

I would say That Fountain definately not invent or revolitionize step botton technology.

Kirk

PS. I'll try to post some picturs, they may be to big, and I don't know how to resize.


1932 Gold Cup winner

one more

22' 400HP= 94.6 MPH

Early day SuperBoat 7200HP 124.915 MPH

KN
Very nice !!

It's very interesting stuff. I have a picture of a boat that shows the steps, just to big to post. Anyone want to resize it.

Kirk

KN, Its amazing with all the new technology since that pic, I wonder what a boat runs with 7k horsepower....

I would think there would be a point of diminishing return between HP and weight? I wonder how much that boat weights and how fast it would be if it only had two of those engines. I also wonder what kind of drives it had?

I wonder how a 46' Skater would run with quad 1800 HP Packard V-12's

Kirk

1

2

3

The question shouldn't be how, it should be where........

I'm guessing somewhere around 35,000' :D :p :D

glassdave
 

the avatar is just a sqiggle at this time. If I built it I would ask Bob and Eric to do it.

For those inquiring minds on the OSO board who aren't familiar with the benefits of a stepped hull, what are they?

I personally have heard many pro's and con's.

What do y'all think?

Ricochet.

The first steps were , in fact tried 70 years ago....and there is the rub. Steps work great.......................as long as that much of the bottom is in the water......so it is a question of speed. If you are dealing with a monohull, and a step is say 60" forward of the transom, then the step will break the running surface up and reduce friction..... if that much of the bottom is wet. The old boats pictured carried a lot of motor weight and ran very "wet" to begin with. That's why tunnel boats use them.....mostly in turns when the sponsons are sucked down...not in straight a ways.

If you can rock your vee back onto the last 12-18" of pad you are already going too fast for steps to give you a speed increase. That's why non-stepped Allisons are so competitive in outboard drag racing. However, in turns the monohulls lose rear end tractability with aerated (stepped) surfaces and either spin out or hook and barrel roll more frequently with all that junk on the bottom.

A cat tends to turn on the inside sponson walls and holds better in turns than a vee....but a non stepped cat will spin out less often then a stepped cat as well. It is not a question of absolutes but rather of degrees. My 28 Skater runs fastest when I am able to trim all of the steps out of the water, but before I gain too much attack angle and increase aerodynamic drag.

Mike, we did, in fact put steps on two 21 Shadows in 1981, a Sterndrive and an outboard, Both boats were identical grey, white and Navy blue and their photos graced our brochure that year. The steps were 1 and 1/2 " deep, and made the boats no faster....yet they were more slippery in turns. This is still true today.

As to the Wing Switzer, that design is not a true cat or tunnel but rather a four point HYDROPLANE. Hydros by design kiss off on the forward sponsons and carry the aft section completely clear of the water......and without skid fins they literally don't turn at all.
Sound familiar?

T2x

T2x I always enjoy your inputs and calling the kettle black. I'm no engineer, but your explanation has been plain/obvious in my mind for quite sometime now. I too think buyer beware of the hype...:rolleyes:

I love the pictures of RonP and the construction of the boats.

How about this thought, it (the steps) had nothing to do with speed but came to be because when building a wooden boat they didn't have any straight pieces of wood 30'+ long, so they had to overlap the wood planks only as a method of construction. That way they got the length and the strength that they needed. So with 12' lengths of wood and a 'step' or overlap every 6', they were able to build longer boats, even up to 50'. Only later did they find that the speed went up. Then with glasfiber, the construction method changed.

T2X.

Ditto what Reckless288 said. Thanks very much for the insight!

Ricochet.

T2X
THE WAY YOU EXPLAIN EVERYTHING REMINDS ME OF SOMEONE ELSE. SOMEONE MIGHT GET THE WRONG IDEA AND THINK YOU JUST MIGHT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. IMAGINE THAT STEPS WERE AROUND 70+ YEARS AGO, GEE I REMEMBER SOMETHING LIKE UNLIMITED'S IN THE TWENTIES WITH STEPS, I THINK THAT HELPED THEM THOUGH I NOT QUITE SURE WHAT THEY DO FOR TODAY'S BOATS. UNLESS YOU JUST WANNA GO STRAIGHT AND NOT TURN. I KNOW THERE'S A WHAT? FOR EVERY SEAT.

Steps and the Pleasure Boater
 

Fountains sport cruiser has caught my fancy. :D I note a 5 mph increase in top end when they went to the stepped hull design. The same increase in top end occurs for other manufacturers models (Cig, Formula, etc.). For the average guy, is this not a good thing? I fully appreciate the dangers of a stepped hull boat hooking in a sharp turn, but I doubt I would lock the wheel at 70 mph regardless of hull design.

For the cautious pleasure boat buyer, aren't effectively engineered stepped hulls a good way to get that increase in speed we all crave?:)

[ OH NO - I've noticed the props on most 38 SC pics I've seen turn IN. That could be a problem...]

TX2,
I agree with what you are saying about riding on the last 12-18". If the water was like glass then you could trim accourdingly. However, what happens when the boats bounce? Is speed lost with a conventional V?

By the way, your argument is exactly why Jay Ross at Sonic said he doesn't use Steps.

I think that Frequency makes a good point. At 60 to 80 mph steps possibly could help a bit in a straight line(this is when a monohull is still relatively "wet"), but that still doesn't offset the loss of directional predictability in turns. Is it possible that a 60 mph boat could gain speed with a step....? Theoretically yes, but a 70 mph 21' Shadow......did not. Maybe it's a function of scale and a smaller boat has a lower speed threshold or range. Perhaps we should have tested the Shadows with 50 mph engine packages.
I personally would not sacrifice turning control for a fancy bottom and some theoretical speed increase. Especially when Sutphens, Apaches, Allisons and etc. all run just fine thank you.......without them.

T2x

Just my personal $.02

While I can appreciate the theory behind the stepped hull, aerating the water to reduce drag, I feel that the designs are starting to border on marketing-driven absurdity.

Has anybody seen the steps built into the Regal hull (not high-performance, I know, but to make my point)? They've got these huge notches, and curves, and swerves---it it reaching the point where, if a manufacturer (particularly high performance) does not incorporate steps into the design of their hull, everyone thinks they're behind the times, or clueless.

Admittedly, my offshore performance boat driving experience is limited to traditional V-hulls, so I am a bit biased, but I enjoy the predictability of a straight V, where I know I can trim in, throw the boat into a turn, and I know she'll carve without any crazy, unexpected spin-outs.

I had a close, personal friend get killed while test driving a brand-new 38' V hull performance boat (stepped hull). The boat was built by a very well known manufacturer, but the design was new to them. The boat apparently spun out.

My friend was a highly experienced driver, and was NEVER reckless.

That was several years ago, and my view on stepped hulls has been tainted ever since.

'Lotsa marketing, limited actual benefits.