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Old 08-08-2003, 10:45 AM
  #61
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Sean,

It holds the course record (113mph) at the LOTO Shootout. I wish it was 147!

Steve1,

The boat has had numerous structural failures. Remedial work has helped some (ex: transom rebuilt). Based on the strucural analysis performed by High Modulus (NZ) the boat will not be run in its design conditions.

The entry and deadrise were changed on the 62' as well as eliminating the "pad keel".

We have also done extensive FEA work to determine global bending characteristics to optimize laminates.

We are very familiar with lightweight structures. We run a carbon fiber cat cored with aluminum honeycomb and nomex honeycomb. Consistently, runs over 200mph and corners as hard as a hydro.
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Old 08-08-2003, 10:46 AM
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Steve-
Let's talk serious about Jag some more. Jack has a 40' for sale and there were previous postings about that boat's handling. Jack also told me the boat weighs about 10,500#. Can you provide anymore information about that specific hull?
Thanks
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Old 08-08-2003, 11:00 AM
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Straight From the Horses Mouth: First of all this is the first time ever a Boat of this size with a projected speed of 130+was done ;And there Also were Many Changes which interrupted Construction …… This was referred to as “Design on the fly” There were never any Complete Hard Plans to this Project...

The Changes Cost Money and continually Interrupted the project. They started with the steps and removable inserts...Too change the step location...

Next the Repair of the Mold (foam mold supplied) when chunks of the Foam that the Mold was constructed of Came apart and off the mold...

Then: after the hull was Gel coated and laminated someone decided the Need to put Rocker Panels in the Bottom... Which called for the necessary deductions and the pieces made finished waxed and attached. And Laminated...

Then the supplied Deck Mold it was 4” That’s Right Four inches too wide for the Boat !!! That required a lot of rework!! That also involved Time...

You said Windows in the thing were upside down and had to be changed again, more time Your mold!!

You said The rear door was the wrong size and had to be inserted again...Time

When the Boat was pulled from the Mold the Rocker inserts had to be cut out and finished. Time.

So understand I see the 25% cost increase.

NOW THE WEIGHT The Project Engineer had a target weight of BETWEEN 10,000 and 12,000 Pounds. In order to reach the projected Speed of 130 MPH.

I also know that Jaguar would stand behind anything they build and NO ONE ever contacted them to make them aware of these problems..

For the Transom IF it was properly supported thru an engineered Bracing system you would never have had a problem.

You would have never had complications with this project but so many changes from the Very start LIKE: Engines, Transmissions, Drives, Stringers, Bulkheads and Excreta.

It was a Prototype project and should be reviewed as such.

. Jack and Jaguar had nothing to do with the Changes “Design on the fly” No Complete plans from the start I do not think any boat this size has ran this speed...

The Lamination system: Epoxy and S-Glass were discussed with the project Engineer at the time, but he said due to the budgetary constraints A Dow Vinyl Ester E-Glass Kevlar Laminate was used.

NOW at the time of the power changes and the Rocker panels were added the Engineer was now off the project...

Now my $.02 Jack has many Friends over the past 20 years I am but one… YOU should really think before any SLANDER that has the potential to hurt anyone’s livelihood .. Steve Koss

I think all things considered we should move on...

Last edited by Steve 1; 08-09-2003 at 04:36 PM.
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Old 08-08-2003, 11:11 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally posted by tachyon
Sean,

It holds the course record (113mph) at the LOTO Shootout. I wish it was 147!

Steve1,

The boat has had numerous structural failures. Remedial work has helped some (ex: transom rebuilt). Based on the strucural analysis performed by High Modulus (NZ) the boat will not be run in its design conditions.

The entry and deadrise were changed on the 62' as well as eliminating the "pad keel".

We have also done extensive FEA work to determine global bending characteristics to optimize laminates.

We are very familiar with lightweight structures. We run a carbon fiber cat cored with aluminum honeycomb and nomex honeycomb. Consistently, runs over 200mph and corners as hard as a hydro.
I stand corrected...I could have sworn that I had just read somewhere that it ran 147....oh well see what happens when you get old!

Who came up with the lamination schedule for the 55, Dave?
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Old 08-08-2003, 11:19 AM
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I always wondered if finite elements were used in the development of boat structures, or it was strictly rule of thumb and trial and error. Thats good to hear. Maybe I should look into it a little more.
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Old 08-08-2003, 11:30 AM
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wred

Try Coupon laminate testing from the lamination shop area things will vary from the given to actuall.

Once you have these real numbers then..devolping a lamination schedule is easy.
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Old 08-08-2003, 12:08 PM
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you get real usable numbers from test??? Consider yourself lucky. I typically have to chase analysis to match the latest test result which contradicts the previous test result that was the foundation of the analysis.
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Old 08-08-2003, 12:42 PM
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Wred no no you consider yourself lucky!!

Let me get this straight You do not use your own lamination from the actual area where the work is done AS a base line ???? Am I right in this assumption?

So by your thinking we should arbitrarily use some number supplied by the vendors say!! Something printed a year ago or the like.

Excuse me but I find this a little perplexing that someone would simpally disregard the physicals Actual .

Like I said before in here I build very very Light powerboats.

Well best Of Luck..
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Old 08-08-2003, 12:48 PM
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Man dueclaws sorry.
I will try to get some Information today for you.. Please accept my most humble apology's for not responding earler..
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Old 08-08-2003, 01:05 PM
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Steve 1, nice shots of those boats. With the weights you mentioned, did you have to reinforce the cockpit? How do you mount things like seats, etc. in a boat like that ? If they're really lite, is there a risk of compromising strutural intergrity when through bolting things like the seats?
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