Im surprised nobody is talking about the Alpine Marine stuff. I am running a pair of their 10'' Free air subs under my rear bench, powered by a old school Fosgate 800.2 amp, and a two pairs of their 7'' coaxials in the cockpit, powered by a old school aurasound amp. Loud, Clear, and thumps pretty good considering the sub enclosure kinda sucks (would be much better in a sealed box design).

I was underpowering the subs when I first installed them. Running the big fosgate amp woke them up big time. Much better sound. I may build a enclosure for them this winter.

The new miss have increased power handling and a cleaner sound at high wattage, I know this because I tried to use a mixed set on a friends boat, the old style was the weak link an he swapped them out. Not a bad speaker, but the new ones are superior in every way.

He never mentioned only two batteries, he mentioned up staging his friends stereo on a medium budget. I do agree most may not want to deal with high power, but mine is set up right and plays all day long from 11 am to 7 pm on two batteries, having one left to start me at the end of of the day. It is possible, set up is key. Getting the highest spl per watt is crucial in a boat. I'm like the energizer bunny at the bay, and get asked all the time if the boat is full of batteries :)

Seal them up! Huge improvement. I went with a 1.5 cu ft be speaker custom box I built for the side compartments, I didn't want to lose the under seat storage or cut the glass. Removed the plastic side panel and replaced with this box with a false face to cover where the old panel was. These speakers have since been replaced with l7s solo and this winter I am having the box vynil covered to match the interior

http://i1230.photobucket.com/albums/...1/photo444.jpg

http://i1230.photobucket.com/albums/...BA54E4715B.jpg

http://i1230.photobucket.com/albums/...BA6F013E40.jpg

The box is mdf, with plywood face, painted to protect from moisture

Some good options there! How important is to have matching speakers?

So far I have:
- pair of RF 282 8" 2 way
- pair of Polk Audio mm 6502 components

Should I get another pair of one of the above? Or something like the kickers that were just mentioned?

How many speakers can you run off a 4 channel amp at 4 x 200watts at 2 ohms?

I would add another set of the polks and a set of the super tweets. 8 speakers off 4 channels parallel to get a 2 ohm load, which will increase your wattage. Please tell me you didn't get an onyx amp hahah

ttt

:party-smiley-004:

Price was just too cheap to pass up! lol I can buy spare amps for the price of others. Been researching and they 'bench' what their rated for. Ppl are saying that hifonics, MB quart and Soundstream are all in the same category. So yes I did buy the Onyx, damnit! lol

Good to know about the polks, will find another set.

Also, I willl be running at least 4 batteries. I have 2 in the boat now, but have 3 other spares I can put in the boat too...

Maybe you will have better luck with the onyx line than I did, l just couldn't get clean power out of them.

Sounds like you are on the right track. You do have shore power and a genny right? :lolhit:

What smaller 3.5 or 4" speakers would you recommend? I had to raise my engine hatch 4.5" to clear my headers and I am thinking of installing speakers in it that play towards the rear seat and also install some on the back that play towards the water. I have seen some kicker 3.5 snd 4" speakers but I don't think they are marine.

I just bought a 2000 watt RMS MB Quart Onyx...couldn't get it to run my house speakers without shutting down. It sounded fantastic, but it just overheated like crazy which is nuts because it was super overpowered for what I needed.

Not recommended. Ended up just spending the money for a JL Marine amp just so I am not pissed off all the time with it turning off.

Let me add: I am running all Polks.

Love these

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000P0...0328010&sr=8-5

I guess those Polk speakers are ok to get wet? Also I have a pair of old school Precision Power 10" subs. I have never heard these as they were given to me but they are extremely heavy when compared to my 10" JL Audio, probably 20 lbs different. How good are these subs and any idea on what air space ported box I would need? These speakers are deeper than a regular 10" speaker, they are probably 7-8" deep.

I had a similar experience with an install for a friend, the amp wouldn't run 4 pairs of mids at 2 ohms without tripping, we had to wire back I series to get it to work, then the sound quality at higher levels was terrible.

Pretty much any newer speaker is okay to get wet.

Ported is definitely the way to go for the loudest bass, problem is that boats don't usually have enough room. My box for my 2 12"s takes up nearly half my back seat and it is sealed. However, that isn't to say it doesn't make ridiculous bass. The water ripples from my hull to give you an idea. Sealed is pretty damn bad ass.

Yep, mirror image of my problem :) I did run a fan on it for a while and that worked fairly well, it just looked beyond ghetto.

The Polk db line is marine rated, like captain said most of today's speakers are at marine standards anyway, but those are true marine rated.

Those precision power subs were pretty awesome back in the day, the size of a Jl w7 series. Find the model number and I am sure you can find the specs for enclosure on the web. Keep in mind when using subs of that size you have to deduct the size of the sub from the encolsure when designing a box. Some of them are near .25 cu ft.

Well, I will wait and see how mine works out. Did you guys have 0 guage wire running it too? Maybe they were a bad batch of them? I DO read a lot of good reviews on them...

|Its like my sled I bought last year, 2012 Arctic Cat turbo: I go onto a sled website, guys are saying theyre garbage, going through belts like mad, etc. Meanwhile I rod the crap out of it, have it boosted and studded and original belt at 5000 miles.

You always hear from the 5% of ppl who have issues, but not the 95% of ppl with no problems.

Wonder if amps are the same way? lol

Hello guys, if u have the budget , get a jl 1000/1 that will have plnety of power to move e kicker subs ( both subs ), as far as the wiring i will run a isolator and intall one batery only for the amps, i will run a 4 gauge wire lead from the main baterry. The reason of the jl audio is that they have a samr mosfet power supply that allows the amp to produce all the power all the time, so you dont need a cap, most if not all amp will have diferent rating on the power output that varies in twi things, one the impedance ( jl produce the same amount of power from 1-4 ohms) and second the voltage, for example if you have a rockford amp rated at 1000 watts, it will be at 2 ohns and 14 v when the voltage drops the power goes to something like 800 at 13 and maybe 700 or so at 12.5, the problem stars when the bas stars hitting and the voltage starts to go down. That will also make the amp to work harder and get into to overheat mode or protect mode, the jl is by FAR the most eficient amp you can buy, they have a real comparison as far as cost of wats per dollar. The mids adn high are just as important since most of the disortion you will hear will come from the mids and highs, you can have a fully distorted sub and some clean mids and higs and have good sound but clean bass and no high will kill many roaches.... Aqua vibe makes a universal rf not ir remote that wokrs 100' from the bost, is water prof and it floats, i had 3 boats over the las 4 years and alway had one, very usefull and only 70$ , get a set of components or coaxial, mount the tweeters as close to mids as posible, or use high en coaxial speakers and aditional tweters. We used 2 jl 13w3 new style and 1000/1 and my boat was by far the best sounding boat in the whole sandbar, i would not sweat the marine part of the elctronics, they last just as long most cases on todays technology, back in the days when soeakers were made out of oaoer and foam .. But today most if not al are poly and rubber, just my personal experience, im sure there is a bunch of products out there that work really god for a good deal, but take in consideracion the jl amp capability. Customer support is key also.... If you get the enclousure done, get it covered inside with epoxy, inside and out, it will sound really good plus last longer, make sure you dont use silicone on the boxes since there is a chemichal that will eat some of the glue that holds together the sub.

Car audio is the opposite IMO. People will cob, cram, duct tape whatever and think they have good sound :)

I was always a fan of mb quart, however they used to be a highline product that was more expensive than the norm.

My bias against them is not what I read, or heard, it was what I experienced. I spent three times as much time as I wanted to diagnosing why the stereo I installed sounded like crap, never even knowing what the price was on the mb quart stuff he purchased.
And I always use 0 gauge on boat installs, the long runs alone make in mandatory.

The square onyx subs were the worst I have ever seen. They have clock radio speaker magnets on them haha

He lost money "trying" the line, and is very happy with the replacements. Kicker components, solo l5 12s, and sounstream amps, all on the same exact wiring we used for the quart. He says the stereo is 3 times as loud and clear, I don't think it is that extreme but definitely a diff class now.

I

I wish mb quRt today are what they used to be 8 years or so ago, i still have 2 pairs of q series mb quart that i purchased and my lukc that the las 4 veicles i have owned they fit 6.5 oversize components, that is in my truck off course. Good luck, i agree, ther is a diference bewtweeen the equipment that goes boom and that sounds good¡

Yes I did have 0 gauge wire. You can't ask for better information than two people here trying to wire up the same speakers you have with the same amp you want to use. I would think about returning it if it's still new in box.

I'll cut you a screaming deal on mine (a month old) if you REALLY want an an MB Quart Onyx and you are confident your luck is different than ours. :)

The scary thing is dirty power kills speakers.


1000 clean watts into a 500 watt speaker will play all day

250 dirty watts into that same 500 watt speaker will not last long

My first comment was spend the money on the wiring and amps if your budget is limited. A system with good power will make mid line speakers sound amazing, and speakers are easy to upgrade later.

I have been reading this post and am looking to upgrade over the winter also. So if you go with say the 2 - 12 Kicker comps, and they are only rated at 150W rms, it would still be ok to pump 1000 - 1500 watts to them. What would be the best configuration, 2 ohm and parallel them, or dual 4 ohm and parallel the duals and 2 speakers to make 1 ohm?

4 ohm DVC parallel is the hot set up with subs, assuming you have a 1 ohm stable amp.

The kickers will take more wattage than they are rated for, as most speakers will, as long as it is clean. Application is key. If you are going to run free air or ported, too much wattage may cause an over excursion of the woofer. Sealed box let them eat. This is rare however...clean power is the main concern, not too much.

I ran a pair of them freeair off the 5 channel of a soundstream amp that was rated for 500 watts rms at 1 ohm with a THD >.02 %, they sounded great and are still going 3 seasons later in the sides of my old cruiser with no grills! They have seen rain and sun, no issues. I would guess they can take even more power, but sound great as is.

I would rather back off an amp that run it to the threshhold of distortion. A larger amp only running to 50 percent capacity will also stay cooler. Keep in mind the initial distortion levels that harm a speaker are hard to hear, not as obvious as the high distortion that comes after.

Many amp ratings you see are max power, but the real number you are looking for is RMS. RMS is the clean consitant single you can expect from your amp every day.

So, for the kickers that are rated for 200 rms, 400 max EACH

you want at least an amp that is 400 rms with a low thd

Ideal would be an 800 watt rms amp with a thd of .05 % That same amp would prob be rated at 1600 watt MAX.

Great post 4bus. I totally agree.

Distortion is what kills a speaker. Take a 200w rms woofer, and hook it to a Jensen 75w rms amp with gain turned to the max. Crank it up and the distortion will eventually kill the speaker.

So many people think of watts like hp. As in say a bravo drive can take 450hp , so u don't want to put a 600hp in front of it. But that's not the case with amplifiers and speakers.

Also, not too many amps on the market today can put out a clean 1000watts continuous at 12.5v.

I just have a question. What size box would be needed to put 2 10" subs in(sealed box)?

Depends on the subs and what they ask for. Some subs can use as little as .50 cu ft, like the alpine type r. Other larger subs like the JLW7 and Orion HCCA will need upwards of 1.75 cu ft just for a 10.

The manual of a sub will have the sealed and ported recommended cu ft listed. Design the box from there. the box doesn't need to be square, however you want to leave a few inches behind the magnet for cooling and resonance reasons. I have also found that in extremely shallow applications such as a boat that the total cu ft must be increased slightly when the magnet is close to the back wall.

If you are close to the recommended min cu ft space poly fill can be added to esentially make the box "bigger" buy tricking the driver using surface area. I have had it help, but there is no replacement for displacement

Thanks for the info 4bus, that's the information I was looking for.

So what amp would you use to power 2 10" kickers in a sealed box?

My favorite amp for a simple system. Loud and clear, strong enough to run 8 mid speakers off 4 channels at 2 ohm and two DVc subs off the 5 channel at 1 ohm bridged

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00273...0497200&sr=8-1

Great amp, and a great buy at that price

So your saying this 1 soundstream amp will run 8 mids on 4 channels and run 2 10's on the last 5th channel? So you can run all this on 1 amp?

Not only that but car amplifiers are not regulated in how they publish their power.
This leads to most of them using inaccurate power rating or just downright false specs.

Most typical (not the high end ones) car amps will actually deliver 50-70% of the rated rms power in real world conditions. So that Jensen that says 75w rms may actually only deliver 50w in the real world .. Its like using the speedo on a boat for the mph instead of a gps,LOL.

I am suprised that your a fan of (todays)soundstream. Can you elaborate?

Well he did say simple system. What amps do think are good? I have been out of the loop on stereo stuff for years. I am running a 5 channel Rockford fosgate right now, but it doesn't have enough power for the subs, so I was planning on using it for mids/highs Add an amp for the subs, get new subs and build a box for them if I have room.

In today's world of putting what used to be a good name on sub standards amps, there is more good than bad. However, my first experience with the soundstream rubicon amp was to help tune a set up that was installed by a local radio shop. I was surprised how clear and strong the amp was for the price.

I purchased one for the cruiser I owned a few years ago, knowing that the boat would not be kept long I wanted a budget stereo. Below is the equipment and price I paid on the initial install. The stereo was loud and clear.

Sound stream Rubicon 5.800 $180.00
Sony CDMX60 head $150
Kicker Comp 12" x2 $100
Fosgate 6.5 prime co-ax 2 pair (4) $80

I was suprised to say the least, and I am not easy to please. My only complaint was the mids, they sounded good, however they were limited at high levels, that was me, I got nothing but compliments on the sound.

I later added 4 more of the fosgate prime speakers, originally tried to bridge them all out but the load was too much. So two speakers on each channel, using all four channels was the hot set up. The increased ohm load only made the system over the top. And the now higher spl allowed me to play louder without hitting the limitations of the mids.

That stereo, would play all day long on one fully charger 1000 amp Napa marine battery, saving the other for starting and house.

We would see people dancing and singing to our music 500 ft away at the beach

Keep in mind the cruiser had advantages over a go fast. Large glass walls that housed the subs in a free air configuration, and areas to mount the mids higher than we can in most go fasts. The amos was also mounted exposed on my cabin step wall, and would sometimes get hot enough to burn a leg, but it never tripped, and never failed.

So I had $510 invested in the 6 speaker set up, and $590 in the 8 speaker set up. Only other costs were, wiring, sub grills, and baffles. I used stick on window membrane (like dyna mat but cheaper) to tone down vibration on the walls and such. Just sounded great :D

Yes, do not bridge the 4 channels. Just run two mid speakers off each channel parallel at 2 ohms. Run two DVC subs bridged parallel at 1 ohm. Make sure the amp has air circulation. I usually use brushless computer fans set up to pull air on on one side, and blow air out on the other if the amp is mounted in a confined space. This amp will get hot with this load, but won't fail or trip if air is circulating

This pic is before the fosgates were installed, I actually tried the cheap single cone stock speakers with the amp, not good :D

http://i1230.photobucket.com/albums/...D9DAF09A6E.jpg

Amp install on stairs in cabin, this was before final wiring

http://i1230.photobucket.com/albums/...D9AD5C71D0.jpg

I too have been out for years. Friends of mine have JL and Fosgate. They seem good clean and reliable. My problem w JL is I bet there are other products that are just as good but will be 30% less. I just dont know what they are. You cant trust reviews becasue you know some of them are written by 16yo kids who know nothing. There are a zillion products in the marketplace now. Old brands are not what they used to be. And the list goes on.

If I were to buy amps today it would be fosgate and it appears I could get a 4ch 100x4 and a 800w mono amp for under $500.

But im not buying today, so these threads are intriguing. For amps, Soundstream esp ref series, Precesion power, fosgate, kicker and yes even JL all have my attention as I write this.

OK now that I've acquired a few of the pieces am just curious about adding extra batteries. I want to go from 2 to 4. So do I need battery isolators for each side in that case?

I have 2 switches right now, one for each motor/electrical circuit.

You need to determine how the switches are currently set up.
No additional switches should be needed.

Usually, the additional 2 batteries should be added to the same bank that auxilery such as the head unit and lights pull. Otherwise the amps will drain one bank and the HU and anchor/interior lights potentially drain the other.

If you are running a couple high power amps, 1/0 wire is best even on short runs.
Cut the wires to size and have them professionally crimped at a battery or auto electric shop. If you dont go at a busy time or just drop them off, they might charge $10-20 cash for all. I used to crimp as tight as possible with a vice grip then solder but still ran into problems.