Budman, I really don't think you can get a true reading of what your engine is doing on that engine stand. I also can over think just about anything so I feel your pain!

I'd ditch the silent choice diverters and get the right collector setup going on them.

If money is a concern along with noise , you can temporarily make some home made turn downs for the exhaust at the back of the boat. I think your pissingg right into the wind with that exhaust setup you have there. It's not the cam.

Budman, have you considered taking up golf?! :evilb:

budman,maybe you should try sailboating,no engine problems,lol.

Mike their would be a 38 page thread over on sailboathomos.net asking about the proper teak oil for his cabin hatch lid

sailboathomos.net.:party-smiley-004:

back from the dead........this is basically what I had to say in my 2 paragraph delete. Dump water into pipes just before transom and add mufflers switchable or not to the outside of transom= no more concerns except for future leaks with the headers......but thats a 300 page thread by itself.

Brian you know, according to the Catholic belief, if you take your own life , you go to hell. What's hell like? I can imagine thousands of budmans running around, tapping you on the head asking you rapid fire engine questions for all of eternity!

Stainless Marine + switchable mufflers.

What's hell like? That's easy.......running a boat repair business from April to mid September in Michigan, the rest of the year is a little less stressful.

I'd have no problem running imco, gil, emi, eickert, cmi, Stelling , lightning , or stainless marine with the right setup.

Brand isn't the issue here

SM was just an example of a manifold vs. header. Not a fan of headers unless you are leaving a ton of HP on the table by not running them. In this build I'd run manifolds vs. headers. Funny sight at the LOTO Harbor Hop back in May. At Larry's I saw a 46 Cig with 1075's and SM manifolds. Must have gotten tired of the CMI blues!

I agree, headers can be leaky. My stellings 18 years old and they needed a leak fixed last year. Cost me about 75 bucks having my local welder fix it. A friend of mine has stainless marine manifolds and the risers needed repairs as they were leaking badly at the welds. I have a few buddies running the lightning headers for years in fresh water with no leaks . I wouldn't be afraid to run a set .

Besides the cmi crap mercury specd, I think a lot of header issues are caused by improper tailpipe support, esp on staggered boats that run in rough waters. You just can't put all that stress on the collector. Stainless doesn't like being flexed repeatedly from all the twisting and vibrating.

With that being said my next exhaust will prob be stainless marine GEN I I I with 5" tails .

Probably wouldn't cuss a whole lot more than I already am! :D

I really like the Eickerts, and if I had room I would be looking for a set. It would probably require extensive transom surgery to run anything with a fixed tailpipe, unless I had a set of custom tails made for it.

MT, I'm in agreement with you on that - the way they have those holes directing the water at a 90*, it is literally like pizzing in the wind. I think it would help just to weld something to deflect the spray towards the transom, as Jerry (US1 Fountain) described. Also agree that it's not the cam's fault, although I think that the modern heads with the more efficient exhaust ports can push an engine that is on the edge of reverting over the proverbial cliff. Flow goes both ways, and a poor flowing exhaust port would hedge against reversion, at least as I see it.

Plan right now is to run it one more time with the standard collectors sealed up with silicon like Lightning advised, and keep the idle at or above 900 to be safe. I'll be interested to see if that is where it was pulling water. This winter I might explore some changes to the way the water is fed into those collectors.

Appreciate all the help, and the razzing too. :p Hell, at least I'm not one of those guys who throws a "3/4 race cam" in there and tries to run stock Merc exhaust, and then comes on here bashing everyone. Have fun everyone, and thanks for the suggestions. I'll try not to start any more threads on here. :helmet:

Glad you made it back OK, Brian. ;) And thanks for the advice.

Please run it!!! My combo is similar to yours except that I am running about 10.2-1 compression and I am running silent choice with no issues..... Keep in mind that when the engine is installed, the hoses that connect to the Y pipe will be used and they exit straight down in front of the diverter valves...... I bet half the water goes down there and the other half goes out the back. That has to help prevent reversion by allowing gravity to help pull that water down........As I said before, on the stand with cold hose water, your engine never got up to temp and a cold engine will create condensation bad in high humidity. I also had aluminum heads with no heat crossover and an air gap inake as well and I could keep my hand on the heads after it had run for an hour.... The intake was cool to the touch and it was sweating like crazy so keep that in mind. I bet you will have no problem as long as you get your engine up to normal operating temps.....

TBF, what T-stat are you running in yours?

160.....had the boat out tonight running 4,000rpm and did not get over 170.... I am using a monitor closed cooling setup.....

Yeah, I know that Brian41 and MT will jump off a cliff, but had to post an update...
 

Since I was able to fix the plug threads, I ran it again, hoping the silicone in the joint would solve my water issues. No such luck. :(

Collector high and dry before running:

http://i1224.photobucket.com/albums/...605_185431.jpg

This is what I had after running it at at 1500 RPM idle for maybe 45 seconds. Obviously very wet in there all the way back to the primaries. Sorry the pic is not so clear - still a lot of mist in there.

http://i1224.photobucket.com/albums/...605_191651.jpg

So just out of curiosity, I took US1 Fountain's advice and hooked water directly to the log for the header and ran water out the pipe without the engine running. Damn thing looked like Niagara Falls.

http://i1224.photobucket.com/albums/...605_205108.jpg

I seriously think this is a lot of the problem here. Even with no exhaust pulses back on it, there was significant water splashing back up the pipe. There is also about a 5/16 hole at the bottom that would probably put out enough water by itself to cool the tip and hose. Look at this thing pizzing water with almost no pressure on it.

http://i1224.photobucket.com/albums/...2d2a9d4d0d.jpg

So I think the only way to solve this problem is to either weld in something to reflect the water back towards the tips, or perhaps even close off some or all of the upper holes. I am concerned that I may build up too much pressure in the block if I do this without installing dumps somewhere, either on the collectors or further upstream. Right now all of the water that goes through the engine exits here.

So the saga continues. Oh yeah, even starting to see a little bit of rust around my exhaust valves.

http://i1224.photobucket.com/albums/...13a9d9757f.jpg

After seeing this, do you guys still think I should just drop the engine in the boat and run it like this? :helmet::party-smiley-004:

That's an exhausting question . My answer is NO . Get yourself a good set of pipes and be done with it .

Have I mentioned that set up sucks, yet ? LOL.

im starting to think you should never install the engine in the boat.maybe it should be used as an anchor.be very careful putting water through the header with the engine not running,you need the exhaust pressure to blow the water out of the pipe.ps,just kidding about the boat anchor.

Seriously thinking about selling the boat and taking up the golf suggestion posted earlier.

Budman, don't worry. We'll get it fixed. I'll hit you up on the other site with my # and we'll talk. We'll figure out best and cheapest way to get it done. I have ideas, just need s little one on one for more info on the boat set up itself. AKA CFM

chitcan your exhaust and buy a good used setup,probibaly cost about the same as a good set of clubs!

Yeah, easy fix would be to go out and buy a set of Stainless Marine, Eickert, etc., but #1, I'm tapped out, and #2, I have that transom alignment issue with the exhaust holes. Had a set of Gils I was going to use a couple of years ago, but no way they would line up.

Sigh. :faint2:

Anyone think of a way to temporarily shut off the upper holes to see if that would help and still keep the tips cool? Silicone?

Thanks SB, I have some ideas too. Glad I built the cart - could have wrecked it just running it inn the boat like that.

Budman,,what you need to do is take the headers off,,find out what size those holes are,dind a piece of rod like a short screwdriver,,take a oxy and ceteline torch with a brazing tip,warm up the fron and read of each water dump port,,,whenits glowing red put the short screwdriver and pull it towards the back side of the header so the water is forced to go out the tail pipe..it would not hurt to put a water diverter on the back side of those holes...i would also try restricting the water hose's going to the headers..

I think the cheapest fix is weld in some type of deflectors. Simplist would be flat stock bent like a funnel and tack welded in front if the holes and extend a couple inches past. Doesn't have to be the full circumference. Just area of dumps. Would a dam be enough if welded as far forward as possible along the bottom? Might be enough to stop the forward flow

Mike, good point about the exhaust blowing the water outward, but conversely, you also have the reverse pulses wanting to pull it back in.

yep ,those headers must be junk .How much do you want to sell them for?

Yep, I was thinking about welding in a dam, not sure if it should go in the collector or further back in the header body. How tall can I go with one of those before it starts affecting flow?

Do you have an engine that you want to drop a couple of exhaust valves on?

Seriously, a good friend of mine has been running a virtually identical set (divorced collectors) for about 12 years now with several big cammed engines, with no issues (that he knows of). I need to get over there and look at the tips on his to see if they are different. Speaking of divorced, that's the way I'm going to end up if I keep spending time and money on this damned thing without seeing it float. :eek: We have a cabin rented on the lake in less than two weeks.

Bud something to consider. The smaller the holes are in there, the more psi will build, and the more spraying effect you'll get out of them. Like a garden hose. If you screwed a nozzle on there with a 1/4" hole, it will shoot 30ft away. If you take the nozzle off and let it free flow, it will pour water out maybe 1ft away.

What about welding those old holes up, and welding in a 90 degree elbow, dumping the water towards the transom? Keep in mind, the discharge MUST be large enough, like at least 3/4''. Too small, and you will have high water psi once in the boat, as the water coming from the engine needs to discharge properly.

You are right, MT. That's why I figured I needed to dump some of the water overboard. I have a water pressure gauge on the manifold to monitor block pressure while it is running on the hose, and haven't seen it go much above 8 PSI. I was planning to either tee off of the logs feeding the headers and dump it from there (easiest fix), or weld in a bung at the top of the collector and bleed it off there. That would probably be a better solution because it ensures that there is plenty of water cooling the pipes. I'm not as worried about having a lot of water going out the tips and the exhaust hose. I think there are a lot of guys on here who are just running a small stream of water through the tips to keep them cool. I could use some of the high temp silicone hose for insurance.

Thanks for the ideas, and keep them coming. That's what OSO is all about. We'll figure this thing out eventually.

Well, my welder buddy is out of town for the weekend, and my welder is not set up to weld stainless, so just for testing purposes I gobbed some silicone in 4 of the 5 top holes in the collector. I think this might hold against the pressure if it is not too high, and I can dig it back out later. BTW, I measured them and they are close to .4 inches in diameter. I'm going to experiment with it like this tonight, and I'm also going to fashion a makeshift tee off the water line feeding the header to control the amount of water going through it. We'll see what that does and proceed from there. I still think some kind of reversion dam or turbulator type feature in the collector would be helpful too. I'll take a little bit less flow if it will keep me from screwing up my engine.