310 cc heads
 

Are 310 cc heads good for a 502 or a 540? To small or good size?

Good for NA 500ci, not sure for 540ci

Who's head? A ****ty 310cc port may be worse than a 265 oval

yep, depends on the head, too small for a 540 to make high HP, but will keep the TQ there....

I'd be more concerned about the head/port design, than the particular port size of the intake. Just because a head "pours" out at a certain CC, has nothing to do with how it flows. GM iron heads were what like 320ish cc, and didn't flow anywhere near as good as say a 308cc dart, or 315 AFR. And just because a port is small, doesnt mean it will have great velocity, and just because a port is big, doesn't mean it wont have great velocity.

For example. A 315cc edelbrock, or 320ish cc GM/Merc head, will get its azz handed to it, across the board power wise, by say a 305 AFR/310 dart, or a 325 AFR/dart, on a 502-540.

Heres a good comparision article of various heads, on the same engines. The big CC ports, didn't give up as much low end as one would have thought (if any), and the small ports, didnt give up as much top end, as one would have thought (if any)

If you mentioned a 355/360 cc on a 496ci engine around here, you would probably get slapped right thru your computer screen , and get told what a soggy, three legged dog you would have for an engine, that probably wouldnt even get on plane.

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/pro...ut-the-o-vs-r/

320 Pro Comps seemed to work well.... lol

maybe :bunnydance:

Need to know what rpm the motor will spin. A 310 cc port isn't going to work on an 8,000 rpm 454...

Well, I'm gonna go out on a limb here, since not too many '310's' have been out there....so, are we talking Canfield's ?

Or dart pro 1?

Hey Mild - how old where you in 1996 ? I have a quick funny (to me) head story - while we are waiting for the OP of course.

Alright....I'm cleaning out some things and I open a big plastic tub I have marked with "1 chamber 4" flowmasters , BBC valvetrain." Wholly schit I say, this is from way back." I got those mufflers when Kevin Mclelland (I believe his name was/is ) the owner of Flowmaster had just moved out of his garage making these just several years back. Of more interest is a folder I made back then of receipts and quotes for parts for one of my cars. Quote Dart 320's $2880 Super Comp Ported $3550. Receipt for ATI 8" treemaster "soft hit" $850.00 . A ton of other stuff in their of course - front end clip, rims, tires, whole bunch of schit, the Power Glide with 300M input shaft, transbrake, yada, yada .

Prices on heads and some other stuff not so different today huh ?

Until, I found the receipt for the Procharger kit for carb. With the upgraded billet impellar it was like $1800 and change. Now they are like 5000 times that . LOL.

Sorry for the ramble, that box opened some flashbacks of a few million years ago. LOL.

I didn't know the Dart Super Comps had peanut ports :grinser010:

Close.LOL. They came out with the 265's right around then. Dart Super Spreads. hah

I think Edelbrock...

Port volumes can be misleading. Port shapes differ from head manufacturer to manufacturer. A Dart 310 vs an AFR 305 vs a Canfield 310 are 3 completely different ports. Valve size and cross sectional area dictate velocity profiles through a port and that will dictate how the head will "work" on a given combination. There are two basic areas in a port to look at; the front of the port where the "pinch" is (minimum restriction area usually somewhere near the push rod) and the "bowl" area which is the area below the valve and up to the apex of the short turn. Some ports can have a lot of volume at the front of the port with a larger cross section, and smaller in the bowl area (like the Canfield) and some ports will have less volume and smaller cross section near the push rod and more volume in the bowl area...yet both ports may measure the same volume. A port with a smaller cross section and larger bowl area will have slightly better airspeed through the port and work more favorably on smaller or lower rpm engines while a port with a slightly larger cross section and more volume in the front of the port might work a little better on larger engines or smaller engines running more rpm.

Really, my 305cc on my 540's made 630, if not for the restrictive intake they would of made way more

They are Darts.

I would have no problem with those heads on a 540.

high HP I mean 7-750...

just opinion that's all, I figure if you have a 540 go as big as you can without sacrificing power, then you don't have to upgrade again if you decide blowers...

you looking at another set of engines then? not Edelbrock ones?

A decent 310 head like the Dart, Canfield, AFR 305, etc. will easily support upper 700hp levels. I've made over 800 with Canfield 310's on a 12.5:1 467 and we have a really mild 710hp pump gas 509 combination using them as well. Now, neither of these would be considered "offshore, out drive, wet exhaust" friendly but the point is the heads will support the HP. I'd say 700hp na with 310's on a 540 built for an off shore deal wouldn't/shouldn't be difficult if all the supporting cast members were there.

Can you give a list of parts needed to go with these heads and my gen 5 502 blocks to make that hp on pump gas? It will be running dry exhaust.

I agree. And its been done many times, using the dart pro 1's.

Also, my general opinion, is anyone wanting 700 plus hp, shouldnt be running wet exhaust anyway. Its pretty simple these days, to buy some stainless tubing, and have your tail pipes converted to dry tail pipes. We have plenty of muffler options that can work with that of noise is a concern.

You probably know the Gen5 blocks have water passage alignment issues with Mk4/GenVI heads but given that, our build basically consists of a good 10:1 rotating assy (we use Scat cranks, Eagle or Molnar rods, Mahle pistons and rings), Canfield 310 heads (unported w/ CNC chamber), Victor Jr intake (unported w/ 1" open spacer), AED 850 Holley and a custom hyd roller with Morel lifters, Rollmaster billet/nitrided timing set and smith brothers pushrods. We have been using Crane gold rockers exclusively but they are no longer available so we're in the middle of trying to choose a new "go to" rocker. The heads get REV severe duty valves, ARP studs, springs selected for the cam, American made 4140 10* locks, retainers, spring locators and Jomar stud girdle. The pan would be whatever was appropriate for the application but we use Stefs almost exclusively. Balancer we use is Romac but can be upgraded to ATI, and you can upgrade to things like crank trigger, port work, shaft rockers, wet sump, etc. but the basic un-ported, out of the box combination makes 709 hp@ 6300 and 679 tq @ 4800 on pump 93 octane. The cam is 240/248 .665/.643 on a 107. I can post a dyno sheet if you like. Your Dart heads should be comparable. Cam might just be a little different based on flow numbers.

Scott, did crane stop making the gold rockers ?

I'm not sure what's going on. From what I'm told the next shipment of Crane rockers in "on the ship"... :(
All I know is right now, no one has any.

[QUOTE=horsepower1;4375603]You probably know the Gen5 blocks have water passage alignment issues with Mk4/GenVI heads

So, will these heads not work on the gen 5 block, or what can be done to make it right if anything? Is this parts list for the 509 or the 540 or is it the same for both?

Yes on the dyno sheet if you dont mind?

I think there is a head gasket that addresses the issues but I've never messed with it so I'm not 100% certain.

Here's the dyno sheet:

http://www.performanceboats.com/gall...haskin_509.jpg

your better off following these builds to get real 700hp engines.
http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/...k-chevy-build/

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/eng...engine-builds/

LOL...so for a 540 with open ex they were only able to get {{{720}}} hp (whatever the {{{ }}} means) and 645 tq? ...and with a peak @ 6600???? That engine is an embarrassment. The numbers on the "dyno sheet" are all jacked up. It loses 7 hp from 6200 to 6400 but then miraculously picks up 9hp @ 6600, then falls off another 11 from 6600 - 6800...and love the dual torque peaks. LOL...and that's your idea of an exemplary engine??? The SuperChev 540 isn't any better, either. Certainly not worthy of another 30 ci and 1/4" of stroke. Nothing more than magazine fodder to impress the masses.

You're just an idiot, and so is Chris Straub. That combo you guys did for offshoreexcursions hyd roller 572ci's, making 750HP at 5900RPM, thru 1 7/8 primary CMI headers, and around 800hp with 2.25 dyno headers, with less than 10:1 compression, that run fantastic in his 36 gladiator, just a real turd. :rolleyes: Oh, and the parts that were purchased, sent in for machine work, and overall time from first phone call to delivered components, was very reasonable.....but, some guys don't like you, so you suck.

You guys are a joke. Please, there's no room for your input here on engines. ;)

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.. .........

I'm not supposed to say anything, but I recently did a test in my kitchen, it was scorpion rockers vs all the others. The Scorpions left them all in the dust....thats all i can say.

You clearly missed the sarcasm. But hey, we can use your dyno sheets with 20% correction and call them good. or how about you friend voodoopro and his 40% that you say are great.

why don't you post your miracle 460 or what ever it was that you claimed 900 HP with rect port heads

don't forget the sharpie lines through the rocker arms.

I don't know him personally, but I can tell you, him and his partner nailed the combo on Kevin's 572 build, and dyno testing was done on an independent dyno, in michigan. They also seem to have quite a bit of happy customers on yellow bullet, performance boats, and speed talk.

What I find interesting, is guys like Scott Foxwell, and many other "professionals" in the business, chime in on many different forums, posting pictures of heads they may have ported, combos they put together, general engine advice, blueprinting and machining info, camshaft and valvetrain dynamics, public videos of valvetrain mockups, induction debates, assembling procedures, and so on. Basically, putting it out there publicly, among some of THE BEST engine builders on other forums, wide open for criticism. And yet, YOUR HERO, reads all these forums, is a registered member of all these forums, and yet, never has anything to say. I'd like to see HIM, jump into the fire, and argue his valvetrain theories, and engine design expertise, with guys like Mike Jones, Chris Uratchko, weingartner, curtis boggs, darrin morgan, and literally hundreds of other engine builders who build engines daily......where is his public advice on those forums, about which intake manifold works best, which cylinder head works best, which is his preferred brand of ring filer, valve cutting machine, and so on.

Sorry, but its 2015. Anybody can figure out a decent combo for a big block chevy engine, when you study hundreds of other peoples engine builds. Want talent? Walk into a shop that can build anything from a 4 cylinder nissan, to a resto 340 mopar, to a blown alky dragster, a 1500hp pontiac, twin turbo LS or yes, a 900HP 460ci, all under one roof. Its easy to sit back and quarterback everyone when you are on the sidelines, rather than in the game.


Sorry buddy. This isn't boatfreaks, you don't run the show here. People here might actually have an opinion that doesn't agree with your camp's long lived infatuations with each other.

Ya'll are crazy. All you need is one of them "Shooter Bullets":duel::wizard:

This is OSO, not a drag race forum

Yup, its called free advertising. post the same garbage over and over and soon it becomes "fact". You can not tell anything from a picture of a ported head. Even flow bench numbers mean nothing. Anyone can hog out a port and get huge numbers.

My "hero" LOL. I didn't know I had a hero, so thanks for telling me, I have to "assume" that you are talking about who built my engine. He is not in business to try and sell you parts like straub and steel chump. There is no such thing as the perfect part for an engine. There are 1000 variables. So to tell you to use brand Z, could be totally wrong. Just as if you asked me what jets I use in an 850 Holley. No matter what I tell you, its going to most likely be wrong depending on your application. And "my hero" doesn't need any defending. He can take care of himself. As I have posted before, he built my 509 that never saw below 5500 RPM for 7 years, and never had anything except oil changes in that time.


.

About the only part you got right. My cats can build a BB and get more HP out of it than stock. and do it without a 20% correction dyno.


Lots of people on OSO have an opinion. all negative. you and your chicago buddies seem to be the only ones drinking the kool-aid. Do some homework on straub and wet exhaust. Then do some homework on steelchump and what his drywall background was. Then ask yourself why they use cam profiles that every experienced engine builder says can't work and claim stupid amounts of HP with. Its a huge game of smoke and mirrors. But hey, if you like the taste of the koolaid, have at it.